De Jongh versus Engelbrecht the stats speak....

These two centres had very comparable games.....although I would argue the Rebels backs were a little more challenging.

In the end the attacking stats were similar. Engelbrecht made 2 clean breaks ....to de Jonghs 4. He did beat more defender 9 to 5 ....but de Jongh offloaded once and scored two tries. Let's be generous and call that even.

On defence it was a vastly different story. De Jongh made all of his 5 tackles....one or two were quite excellent. Engelbrecht missed 3 of his 4 tackles....and even that fourth led to an offload.

When you add in de Jongh's  much greater involvement ....passing and offloading......to his vastly superior defence......it's no contest.

Moart

Stats or anything else - I would not want to see De Jong again in a Springbok jersey.   He is a good defender - no dount about that - but in offence - despite his two tries yesterday that was created for him by others - he is really ineffective.   In Super 15 this year his main contribution in contact situations was to hand over balls to the opposition.   I think a person needs to look at a more creative player and not somebody that is tackled backwards most of the time.   At this stage I know that the argument here is a comparison between Engelbrecht and De Jong - but although I am beginning to like Engelbrecht as a player - I would much rather see him at wing and not in the number 13 jersey.   More expereience in next years Super 15 will help him in ironing out his defence abilities.   Not ready for higyher honours yet.

He is an excellent player to ultimately replace Habana on the wing - even though SAFFEX thinks otherwise.  However - Engelbrecht is at least 18 months away from being ready for Springbok selection and time would tell.

We evidently have some very good up and coming youngsters - but they do have to learn a lot still and that is where I differ from Saffex.   However, I think that on issues such as Etzebeth and a month ago also Marcel Coetzee - I differ from you as well.   Both has played well against the POMS and they can only get better with more experience.  I also am a great believer that ultimately Du Toit would be a stand-out lock, but he must also gain more experience..  We cannot go into the next WC with "rugby geriatrics" who play on there reputation and not anything else.   

Over the next two years we will have to "blood" some youngsters to take over from the older players and I think learning process should be implemented in next years Super 15.   In the next WC we will have problems at 13 and even in 12 -  unless Francois Steyn stop playing the fool and start playing to his potential.   We are fine on the loosies side - but need another lock forward and two really good props.   For the rest the players are relatively young and they would contribute significantly in the next WC.      

 de Jongh had his first good game of the season. The major difference between the 2 is the fact that JJ is Bok material, de Jongh is not. This is down to one thing and that is size. Meyer knows it, I know it. JJ is a class act and the real deal, de Jongh is a nice little pretender.

JJ and JP can both play wing and centre. JJ is improving rapidly and has huge potential. He has it all and is big as well. De Jong has never shaped in tests but he toois nmaturing.

Cant see us having any problems player wise for next WC apart possibly for tighthead. Malherbe in not convincing in recent games for some reason but is still very young. WP Nel has been looking good so maybe it will be fine.

We have more center possibilties now than for many a year. Also a number of locks will be  on stream in the next couple of years..

Engelbrecht has a real problem tackling. It's not just that he is an ordinary defender.....he is a gateway. His hands are not that great either. The fact that he is elusive in space will never offset those weaknesses in tests. He either learns how to tackle or he wont make it, even if he is given a chance.

De Jongh by contrast has scored outstanding test tries....and to suggest his first try yesterday was "created for him by others".....is pure nonsense. It was a fine centre's try. And his defence is rock solid.

Nonsense, there is nothing wrong with his tackling at all, its no better or worse than Jean's an established test centre.

As for his hands, they are certainly better than de Jonghs, kindly point out what you base his poor hands on. Have never evidenced this, in fact he has a good pass on him, both ways and thats why I say he has better hands than de Jongh who's pass to the left is poor.

JJ is our future, de Jongh is not - he is far too small end of. JJ is a beautifully balanced runner, has a brilliant step and swerve and aways looks to use this to evade defenders. He is one of those players you always expect things to happen when he gets ball in hand, much like JP.

I cant believe de Jongh is even being discussed, its chalk and cheese stuff. JJ has the X factor, he would be my 13 right now

 When Engelbrecht played a against de Jongh he gained 5 metres.....just like your other pick Sadie gained 5 metres. De Jongh gained three times as much against  Engelbrecht and 8 times as much against Sadie.

I'm expecting nothing except missed tackles from JJ against the Saders......I'm afraid the gig might be up come Saturday.

de Jongh has done stuff all all S15 and that is pretty poor given he is a 13 in a log topping side.

JJ has started from nowhere, originally sharing the 13 spot with Sadie, then forcing Sadie out and progressivley getting better and better. In the last month or so he has been sublime, confirming he is a real option at 13 and displaying the skill set that has Meyer selecting him in his Bok squad.

JJ is the kind of player that makes things happen - what you see in de Jongh is beyond me, but then again you saw so much in Adi. I dont get you Moz, you see so much in so little yet fail to see the obvious talents like JJ and Taute.

I can assure you de Jongh will never make a test centre, not with those physical attributes. There is no longevity in this guy. A test 13 has to be able to impose himself physically both on attack and in defence. de Jongh is only able to operate in space like all little guys. There is very little space in test rugby

 JJ has improved quite a lot and just need to work on his defence in the 13 channel, but he has oodles of pace. This guy is quick and I like the look of him. I'm not sure if its the Stormers back line but for me both centers suffers from either having poor players on their inside or having a poor attacking game plan. The bulls attacking is better for me than the Stormers. 

I would like to see JJ in a backline where he actually gets decen ball. Hougaard, Goosen, Frans Steyn. With these guys on your inside I'm sure that our 13's would shine.