Ethan Hooker Springbok Material... What Position?

He has played inside centre and wing for the Sharks, and also outside centre on occasion.

I am not sure if he is fast enough to be a Bok wing, but he could be a useful utility back (if there are 3 backs on the bench).

If Esterhuizen is the preferred inside centre at the Sharks, and Delande is still the first choice at inside centre for the Boks, could he play 13? This is the key position on defence for Rassie, so he would have to marshal the umbrella - and Rassie makes decisions pretty quickly if the 13 is not panning out.

He should get some game time this year, perhaps at inside centre. How much longer does Delande have, and will he make it to the next World Cup? Esterhuizen has been playing well as he usually does at 12, albeit he has not been as consistent for the Boks.

Iike him, and he might be a future bok...IDK if he can play 13...but there are quite a few ahead of him for both 12 and 13...no chance on the wing...it's not gonna be easy for anyone getting into this Bok team...and rightly so.

Esterhuizen has been playing well as he usually does at 12, albeit he has not been as consistent for the Boks.

As if DDA has been consistent. Not even player of the year ad infinitum PSDT has been consistent - he had a painfully average World Cup up to the final, for example.

Hooker is probably a natural 12 but I can see him at 13, sort of in the Mortlock/Herbert mold. Utility might be his current role.

We should ask Dave.

He's bound to give us a balanced opinion.

My main learning about Hooker yesterday is that the kid is very bright, much smarter than the average interviewed players. Thirteen in the Bok set up is a position that requires judgement ….I think Hooker could do that, be a better Jessie Kriel.

Certainly he is more physical ….you won’t see him get slapped off like Kriel was in the 2015 WC against Japan. Kriel is a superb defensive decision maker, but not the best tackler

Esterhozen and Hooker for Dud and Kriel is like for like, but a significant step up in both instances….for example Hozen is one of the best off loaders in the game.

Hooker has had exactly the type of season I was expecting him to.

He leaves a positive mark on every game he plays.

He puts out a lot of energy and very little of it is wasted. That takes both a good engine and circuit board to achieve.

It's like we alway say, you don't have to go looking for the good players, their performances will insist that you pay attention to them.

Mozart suffer again from the dreadful shit om the brain disease that often take over his thinking ability

Esterhuizen yesterday again showed he is not up to standard when he had a deadful perfromance and jeopardised the Sharks backline. He was so bad that he was moved to flank forward wjere he did nothig too. He has pleny of msucle but near to zero thinkng ability when it comes - he is equal to Mozart in rugby idiocy. Looking at his performances this year is is clear he will not be in any future Sprigbok squad due to the fact that he has no idea about reading of games and that is the reason that in 22 tests he could not score a try as yet - e never is wher eth e actin is and if he s in the one case where it did happen jhe knocked on a accurate pass to him with an open tryline ahead of him. That is why he has no chance of being in the Springbok squad for any series in 2025/ I always thought that Hooker may be a good 13 - he lack the hysicality needed at 12.

As to the no 12 posiion as long as De Allende is rated as the best 12 in the world by real rugby experts - I rather believe them and not the idiotic comments by prejudiced Rugby noobs on site,

I write previously on site that Hooker and Kriel have the makings of good 13's - at twelve they are just not physical enough,

After the performance today by Willemse it is clear he will replace De Allende when and if it becomes necesarry - it is also clear that the rugby dumb Esterhuizen has zero chance and Hooker should line up with a string of playes avaiable to play in the wing, fullback and 13 positions.

Someone owes me 50 bucks.

"As if DDA has been consistent. Not even player of the year ad infinitum PSDT has been consistent - he had a painfully average World Cup up to the final, for example."

Yes, not nearly as consistent as their distractors.detractors... and more consistent than any of the challengers...

Pakie, you set a high bar if PSDT is painfully average in your world...

Edit...thanks Moz.

Steph DuToit took a while to get back to his best, but he had consistently improved his form since his last major injury before the World Cup to scoop up player of the year (again)

Distractors(sic) are the worst.

Yes, my English let me down...should have been detractors...I got distracted by the constant nonsense.

No worries Broerskind…just stirring. It’s the nonsense that stimulates debate and learning.

"After the performance today by Willemse it is clear he will replace De Allende when and if it becomes necesarry"

You mean the sidestepping and tasty offloads Willemse produced against the Dragons?

Yes we know those are definitely the two primary criteria Rassie wants his 12s to score highly on.

DDA is not now, nor has he ever been, a power player. He's a crafty operator with a complete skill set. A wonderful player, but no power merchant.

Let's remember that the Dragons are a horrific team...a shambles by all accounts. And DDA struggled to get over the advantage line against them yesterday.

Unlike Esterhuizen who made ground at will on Friday evening.

Stop spreading BS, Mike.

"No worries Broerskind…just stirring. It’s the nonsense that stimulates debate and learning"

Yes, I know...I don’t have a thin skin and comfortable enough about myself not to worry about trivial mistakes...which can easily be corrected.

Plum

You have weird ideas about De Allende and that clash totally with the views of experts - and one can only laugh at you statement about De Allende on test level made more progess as a power player in tests than Eterhuizen did an club level. Other than te try he scored that wa in broken play and followed a mistake by his handling of the ball by the worst team in the URC - he was ptrid and made zero progress when getting the ball. In th er cases Esterhuizen made ZERO progress IN POWER PLAY SITUATIONS - he was tackled before he crosed the gain line, He was togethe with the malfunctioning flyhalf jeopardizing the functionng of the Sharks backline and after halftime he as moved with good reaon to play at 7 - where pwer play situations is required - but he was as bad at 7 a he as at 12

Esterhuizen has a history as a non-performer on test level - in large part because he failed as thinking player, That was confirmed by his peformance on Frdiay which was so bad that he was moved to no 7 where he produced produced f-all as well. So you saw something that nobody else bar Mozart saw.

As a matter of fact the Bulis 12 put in a better performcne and Willemse was brilliant as well. When Sacha had an off day and was replaced by Willemse who added 9 points to the Stormers points and the Stormers played another weak team and perform much better than Esterhuizen did, It could have eben 14 points snce Willese scored another try that was not allowed to stand because Moerat fucked up rioyally at a loose scrum ad copped a yellow card at as well. It clearly confirms that Willemse is a much better 12 than Esterhuizen ever was onm test level - Willemse combined thinking and reading of games unlike Esterhuizen and he at leas scored tries in tests - whch Esterhuizen was unable to do, Reason he was never whee the action was leading to scoring of tries n test evel.

I expected - maybe too much - that what happened on Friday would be understood by you and Mozart - but nothing relating to malfunctioning of the Sharks backline has entered your mindless adoration of Estehuizen. When Esterhuizen as noved to 7 - the backline attacking performances improved. and that taught you two nothing. On test lvel Estehuizen was a square peg in a round hole and you want that to continue is really a joke.

However - the inistence on Esterhuzen to play at 12 - will never be realized and Esterhuizen will not be in teh Springbok squad in future - opening up the way for Mozart and you to moan contnuously about the inevitable, I have always regarded from his days playing for the Sharks before he moved yo England - he was a flop at insie center and afer his return from Europe he was flop as well - which his performance on Friday was confirmed again.

I will be surprised if Mills today would not out-perform Esterhuizen's performance on Friday.

What is clear is that the Bulls who has millions of money of which White is the coach - was not interested in contracting Esterhuizen. The only explanation was that White - who moved Esterhuizen to play at 7 in one of the Sharks Super Rugby matches in 2014 - would never have offered him a contract, Neither the Stormers nor the Lions would offer him a contract - so he ended up at the Sharks again. But for you and Mozart he is a top class cente - which he is not,

Easmus tried to use him at 12 and in 2018 picked hi to paly and he failed horrible - his defense was a joke and atacking ability worse and in thend when in the 2019 WC torunaments after Kriel got njured and Erasmus had to get a center repalcement Erasmus picked to call up the inexperienced Willemse as a replacment. I 2023 RWC Esterhuizen wa in teh squad based on his reputation he had playng for Northampton - but he failed n the series s well when eh produce ero in the two ests h played in against Georgia and Tonga, Esterhuizen ws called up in the test squad i 2024 and selected to play against Portugal to se whether he wuld be fitting into the revised Sringbk game plan and was a disaster aainst Portugal wh ere he s red-carded in minute 3 of the match and a a resulth a anned or four weeks, With Browne around there is zero chance o him returning to play for teh Springboks again.

So live on in dreamland - Esterhuizen has had opportunites to cement his position in the Springbok team and he failed in using those opportunities, So at 31 yeas of age hs chances of playlng for the Springboks have gone out of the window,

, , . . . . .

He was togethe with the malfunctioning flyhalf jeopardizing the functionng of the Sharks backline and after halftime he as moved with good reaon to play at 7

Imagine doubling down on a stupid lie like this when you've already been given the facts. Ai ou Maaik. Ai, ai, ai.

He totally ignored his previous BS when we pointed out that the "promising attack" was anything but.

Go on living in a dream world about a failed player - my money s on him not t be near to selection even as a squad member for tests this year, At 31 Esterhuizen is as bd as ws at age 20 - no groeth through experienmce. He sometimes per perform well m grmchse level - but he was BS on Friday end of sstory. He was bad at 12 nad worse at 7, ,

@Plum...

"We should ask Dave.

He's bound to give us a balanced opinion."

That was RuckersForum gold right there!

I cannot stop laughing.

Shame Dave's such a poes.

Hooker is a 12 who can play 13

He is strong, looks to get involved.

Foe me he lacks X factor - he looks a good solid player - but I want to see more X factor

I want to see a step, some soft hands

Time will tell

He is up there but behind Willemse, JJ and Henco v Wyk in terms of real impact. I think David Kriel is also better

I like Hooker but I want to see more - I don’t want solid I want X factor

I don’t know Dave, how many X factor do you need on the pitch. If you have SFM and Jizzo, then someone that is vanilla can create the platform for them to shine.

Hooker is really fast, watch some of his early games. He has a phenomenal work rate and tracks back and makes covering tackles. He is a 12 but not in the style of Bundi or DDA. He is only 21 and perhaps we can finally have a 12 that can break the line instead crashing the ball up. I want to see more of him at 12. I hope they don’t keep him on the wing for too long. Nonu started on the wing and we know how well his transition went, so it is not a bad thing to have a season or two there.

Pakie

WhatI am glad enugh the memebrs of his sie does not elect the Springbk team. If they did we would have no WC victories before and since since 2019 -- we would have had no RC trophy or any of the string of trophird rhr Springbokd on with Erasmus as head of Rugby in SA,

When experts year after year indicate who rhey believe are the best players in the world every year, and in those teams accoding to site members De Allende is useless - yet he is elected year after year as the best Insde center and when Pollard says he sis the ebest cene he ve playe wih yeat after year When Pollard state he is the best 12 he ever played with - then I blieve the site selections are real BS, sad to say,

I would rather believe what rugby experts and players say than the statements made on this site, Hwever - it is funny beyond words what site memebrs come up with - but seriously at has no lnk to reality people comes up with/

,

Mike...here the problem with the appeal to authority.

It’s not fallacious to consider expert opinions, that’s often reasonable. But it becomes fallacious when their status is used as the sole or ultimate proof of a claim without evidence or reasoning.

Which is the case with DDA. All we hear is how good he is, but our eyes don't see it. And neither do yours, else you'd be able to point out the magic to us.

King I’m not convinced Hooker would break the line at test level - that’s why my vote goes to Willemse to start at 12 - it’s a no brainer for me

He should be playing 12 now to hone his skills, he is wasted on the wing and you can tell from his post match interview he does not want to be on the wing. Problem is he is at the wrong province with Esterhuizen at 12 he has no chance of playing 12

Hooker and David Kriel along with Jordan Hendrikse as the back ups. With all being able to play 13

My near future Bok backline would be

15 Fassi 14 Moodie 13 JJ 12 Willemse 11 Arendse 10 Sacha 9 Williams

That composition is gold dust

With vd Bergh, Papier, Jayden, Nohamba, Libbok, David Kriel, Hooker, Henco v Wyk, Edwil vd Merwe, Green, Horn and Jordan Hendrikse as back ups

"I’m not convinced Hooker would break the line at test level"

Well, you may be right Saffex, but you can't argue that out of all our backline prospects, Ethan Hooker is the one who has earned the right to prove what he can do at test level.

I'm with you on Damian Willemse at #12. Hope he gets an extended run at inside centre. He's too good to waste as a versatile bench option and he needs to make a position his own.

Yes Rooi I like Hooker he deserves a crack at test level for sure

Willemse was very good at 12 for the Stormers on the weekend - two tries (one disallowed) loads of defenders beaten

Playing him at 12 would require the Boks to play a more expansive game instead of the direct route - I’m all for that. Willemse is big enough and robust enough to take it up in contact if need be but his default is to attack space - bring it on I say

Hooker on the bench as back up if you want to resort back to the direct route

I would argue that Willemse is too good to waste at 12.

If anything, Hooker 12 and Willemse 13

That combo wouldn't be fun for anybody to deal with.

Hooker will get to around 105-108Kgs...and he's stronger than Willemse. Willemse is in his prime and is 96Kgs.

I agree that Willemse should be there but I prefer him at 13, where he has space and can also put Fassi/Arendse away.

If Willemse plays 12 for the next 4 years, I'd be pretty disappointed actually.

I would lay a bet ith you of R100 with you. I believe that Hooker has a 20% chance f making the Springbks squad this year and a zero chance to start in matches if he makes it onto the bench - bt hew ill not play at 12, So Willemse will be the 12 if De Allende is to be replaced.

Whether yu ad others like it or not De Allende will remain to be the inside center as lng as he is regarded as the best player in the World in that position by real experts,

For one I would like t see Hooker givn a chance against weaker teams - but for one thing there is no chance that Esterhuizen will be in any squad this year because he is a dumbo unable to play thinking rugby and far too slow to play in any backline on intenational level. The mere fact that he scored no tries in 22 tests played confims his dumbo status - he is never wher the action is - while De Allende and .Willemse are. .

Damian has a blinder over the weekend. He is not the biggest when you look at modern 12s and do you want him to be your tank in the backline.

However, him and Sasha are playing well together.

Hooker had a few more seasons to go and by that time AE would be 34, Hooker 24 and Willemse 30. Willemse would then be peaking.

The problem is how do you get all this talent on the pitch. Maybe a backline bomb squad that can stretch teams.

This is the first time that I have seen SA backline players that can actually compete or even exceed NZ and Aus when it comes to skills.

I think that is why Rassie brought in brown. Someone that knows how to coach these guys as we don't have coaches inside SA that can do this at test level

KC

I agree with you about the above bar in respect of Estehuizen. He had plemty opportunities playng for the Springboks and never produced the goods, Paki delibertely tried to mislead people as to my comments on that incident, U stated he ran a line none foh Sprigboks either misunderstood or found unbelievable, whether hew as tackled illegally or legally there were no Springbok players that could protect the ball when he was tackled My problem with that one is clear and is that Esterhuizen ran a line at his rather slow pace that none of the Springboks understood thus isolating himself, He never was first choice center and was chisen in two tests against Georgia and Tonga where he delivered nothing as well.

The other incident was the match against Portugal where he was supposed to be tested in playing the attacking strategy of Browne and he destgrpyed his owm chance, At 31 years of age there is no chance that he would be given further opportunities to prove he belongs in the S[rimgbok squad - something he has not proved since his first tes/t .

He is phyical well enough to play at twelve - but for the Springboks he enver produced the goods,

. .

No I don’t want Willemse to be a tank in the midfield - I want him attacking space but he is big enough, physical enough and a warrior so more than capable of taking it into contact when need be

Willemse is a big boy these days at 98kg, probably more 100kg. He muscled up sometime ago

We don’t have any De Allende or Esterhuizen type of 12’s coming through - Hooker is the closest size wise but he is only 100kg probably closer to 105kg

He has about 5kg on Willemse and is taller so nothing in it

Willemse at 12 for the Boks all day long for me

Willemse had his first good performance at 12…and he might be the answer to a more expansive game.

But Erasmus will most probably hang on to the DDA/ Kriel combo for crunch games, as it’s tried and tested..

It looks like Erasmus is Making incremental changes…and the new Future combo,s Like Willemse and Henco etc. , will hopefully get a start ASAP.

Henco is an injury nightmare - he spends more time off the field than on - pulled out just before the game this past weekend

Ths will upset the Lions fanboys but Henco van Wyk is overrated . . . even on the rare occasion he's not injured.

He is strong I give him that - he punches above his weight - does have the knack of busting tackles and is a very good defender - but he lacks X factor, there is no subtlety to him.

I prefer Julius and Moodie as 13 options for the near future - Henco would be third on my list

That is a pity that he is injured again….make no mistake he has got talent, but injury prone….

I hope he can get over his injury woes. Some players do…

JJ and hooker should get a chance to prove themselves. I also hope David Kriel gets his shot and maybe Rikus if he comes back….

By the way I do llke Hooker as a player, His surname reminds me of a movie called he Sting roduiced i the1970's One of the main characters in the movie. The movie was a classic - not a single character in the movie was honest - but it wa the funniest thing I ever saw as a movie - it was a comedy - but way beyond nrmal comedies, Paul; Newman was the main character in the movie, It was not only funy - but also clever. You probably never heard or seen the movie - but it is really worth watching.

Now back to Hooker - to my mind he has the potential to develop into a top clss player and I would like it if Erasmus and Browne would help him in developing as a player, He has the physical requiements - but for further development he needs top class coaching and that he would not get from any of the four chachise coaches in SA. I wish Francoi Smith would come back to SA as coach of the Stormers or the Bulls - especially after seeig what he did with the Glaslow team the past two years. But it does not seem he is interested in coming back to SA as the media and supporters make life hell for coaches in SA,

.

Everybody I know has seen The Sting…..Robert Redford was Hooker. About half the size of our Hooker.