How good was PSDT for the Stormers

but according to our resident idiot.....he is not up to it
Same applies to SA player of the year in Lood and Munster player of the year in CJ......not to forget world number 4 ODI bat de Kock
Oh boy......make Moffie the Bok coach I say......with ugly Denise as his lackey

 Four years later you are still telling me how great Stephanie is....this time how great he is ball in hand....12 runs 22 metres, no defenders beaten, no clean breaks. You make me laugh Fattie.

Moffie you dumb fuck he has always been good but you are too fucking stupid to pick up on this obvious fact. Team of the week you ignorant prick....how did Schalk go at blindside huh....you are such easy pickings...let me guess he had an off day...headache maybe?

He has never been good......an effort player who shows up against weak opponents.  

Moffie coming from you that means fuck all....geez just look at your track record...Fuck me it was Vic in the WC....a Meyer fan...and wait for it....Coetzee would be an inspirational choice....Fuck me....you are so bloody stupid. A loser who backs losers 

 Mozart
Please get over your prejudice against Du Toit and De Jager.  They are top class players and better than your favourite Matfield during the past two years.   

Talk to me again when they have contributed something significant.

 Insofar as you are concerned your prejudice against those two players make it impossible for you to see and ad mit they have played well - your campaign against them is in fact ridiculous.  

 Look you get excited when a player has a good game against the Kings...I look for performance against worthy opposition. For example you were persuaded by Lomps performances in the WC pool games. I needed to see it confirmed in the knockouts against better competition. And it wasn't, Lomp spilled the ball twice deep in the Welsh 22, and missed a simple tackle to gift the ABs a try.
Steph we can't even discuss because he was so poor, even in the pool games, that we never saw the poor chap in the knockouts. He was a neophyte ....a boy among men.
So I guess Mike you describe it as prejudiced. I prefer to think of it as being a bit more demanding, not being satisfied with a nice game against palookas. Talk to me again when these two kids have actually done something worthy.

 Mozart
These two kids have been better in their games than Matfield - yet you support Matfield and make a song and dance when he got MOM against the Argentinian "B" team.   Pleae be objective and make a realistic assessment.
Lets get back to the play-offs in the WC.   The team that played the Cheetahs was substantially stronger than the Argentinian play-offs team was and De Jager did very well in that game - in fact twice better than Matfield did in the play-offs.
I bring in Matfield - since you became toxic against the two players concerned ever since they became a selection threat against Matfield and your campaig n has never ceased.       

 Moz, I'm going with Saf on this one.

Look, Matfield was great in my opinion. He may have overstayed his welcome by 2 seasons though.

But PSD is class. He has the physicality, pace and ball skill to be a fabulous international lock.

Playing him as a loosie in the world cup did him absolutly no justice whatsoever for a number of reasons:
1. He had just come back from a long layoff
2. He does not have the pace to be an out and out loosie
3. He played in a team (vs Japan) that played incredibly poorly.

In saying that, he has shown in the past for the Sharks that he has the raw material to play at the top.

Lets give him a full season of SXV and judge then, but for now, he has my vote based on past SXV performances.

 "Lets give him a full season of SXV and judge then......."

I have been saying that about a number of players. Only problem was that they never last/ed a full season of Super Rugby. PSDT, Lambie Goosen, Jantjies, Lood, Pollard, Coenie Oosthuizen, etc, etc, etc. Even Etzebeth, at some stage. 

Sigh! Here we go again . . . the stupidest, most biased rugby noob on this site says something stupid and biased that only a rugby noob would say . . . and everyone's surprised!

What do you people expect Moffie to say? Surely you've been reading his pitiful drivel long enough not to be surprised when he comes up with his laughably biased stupidity?

Flash I think Ceradyne makes the crucial point...he never lasts long enough to establish a track record. But I'm afraid the fact that he is also spoken of as blind side flank highlights the issue.
Stephanie as an impressive athlete, so is Spies, Kolbe, Albert van den Burgh etc.  players who can't/couldn't quite fit the rugby mold for their intended positions.
Stephanie looks quickish, but he is far too clumsy to play test flank. He is a big chap, but nowhere near as physically dominating as Etzebeth or even Lomp. His lineout work even at 5 is no better probably worse than either of these chaps, they both are better on the run....he is the inferior athlete in rugby terms.
If he was a bit more compact he could have been Juan  Smith....as it is he is our fifth or sixth best lock and injury prone.

 The same story over and over again and always harking back to the past - especially Juan Smith this time.  Mozart just cannot over the fact that it is 2016 - not 2007.   And he has build up a beautiful memory collection of them whether it is rea l or pure day-dreams.   
Problem is that these daydreams are destroyed when they return to test rugby with his enthusiastic support - and when they flop the flop is ignored because it can damage his mythical dream.
Du Toit has a problem and it goes back to the time that he became a threat to selection of Ouma Victoria - Mozart was the latter's most enthusiastic supporter ever so any threat to Victoria had to be discredited.   This while Matfield was destructive and actually caused major damage to the Springbok team.
   

 PSDT was never a threat for Matfield. He was always either injured or in rehab. 

 When Victor patted him on the head after taking Stephanie's lineout ball on the Sharks line...it said it all.

As far as I can remember that game Ouma Victoria Matfield took only two line outs that day - one on own throw and one when he took up position at 4 on opposition throw-in.  One of the worst performances of useless Victoria that year.
Du Toit took 6 line-outs that day and another on opposition throw-in.   Matfield have as per normal not  called line-outs to come to him in that game because he knew when it happened he would be disgraced.   In 2014 that one was poor and he got progressively worse as the season wore on.
By the way I read an article today about the last game Ouma Victoria played for the Bulls in Super 15 in Melbourne.   Ouma Victoria was disgustingly poor that day and the Bulls lost the game 21-20 - the only game the Bulls ever lost against the Rebels.  Shows what catastrophe Ouma Victoria normally brought to the teams he played for after his return after retirement.  He should never have - because he managed to destroy his reputation in less than two years.

 I'm more than pleased with PSDT'S first outing for WP. I hope he stays fit...Eben too. WP and the Boks need them...and a few others.

'More than pleased' .....I am too....he exceeded my expectations.

 "I'm more than pleased with PSDT'S first outing for WP. I hope he stays fit...Eben too. "
That is the key issue.

 Ja, I know Vlag, I've had enough of unfit players being accommodated AND getting injured again because the were played before being fully fit. Alberts, Jean, Bekker and a legion of pthers being prime examples. You can't fix stupid!

Stay fit and play well. If you have had it with injured players being rushed Draad.....I've had it with youngsters being rushed into the Bok team before they have made a performance case for their inclusion......based on hype. No team in the rugby world does this more than the Springboks.

Stephanie is another Goosen, although no one is as bad as the Bulls creatine zombie Arno Botha. Arno Botha watches a game of rugby on TV and gets injured before half time. 

 Mozart 
Do you not understand yet that hype is where players are written up to high heaven without performance to support the praise songs.   
Want to have a list of hyped-up players over the past two years?

 Well let me come at it from the opposite direction......who was praised to high heaven who actually delivered at international level...or even in the S!5 playoffs.
Over the last 4 years I come up with Etzebeth and Pollard.

PSDT was good, but Eben was much better. Showed some serious lineout skills to go with his all round game.

 Kitshoff is probably the best player in a long time who did not get a chance to prove himself...yet Coenie went to the RWC? Jaco Kriel has a case too....

Kitshoff would have got a chance, were it not for the Beast or Big Trev. He was terrific in the last S15. So was Kriel, but I can't see a 6ft/98 kg/ 26 year old chap living in the space populated by Vunipola....it's a long shot.

Kitshoff had that injury at end of the S15 that put paid to his chances, along with competing against Beast and Nyakane.
Agree that he is probably the best player in a long time to not get a chance at Bok level. H ope he doesn't get residency somewhere.

 Mozart
Sorry - but most of the senior players in Meyer's squad were let-downs in 2014 and 2015 - yet the hype was unending.      

 "Stephanie is another Goosen, although no one is as bad as the Bulls creatine zombie Arno Botha. Arno Botha watches a game of rugby on TV and gets injured before half time. "
Correct.
You have to understand the term "hype" to comment on it. Hype is normally used (in rugby) when a premature fuss is made, mostly in the media and then followed up by hysterical supporters, about "new stars". 
The Goosen media circus was a hype. A few supporters who questioned him were apparently fools. He is playing well at fullback nowadays. Some of us, or should I say very few of us, saw him at FB some time ago and we were rubbished. Most of his best games for Racing Metro was at FB. Like it or not. The hype around him is some brilliant, above average flyhalf was just that..... a hype. He is a better fullback for various reasons. 
Jantjies was a hype.
Pollard was a major hype. I initially bought into it as well. Especially after the one JRWC game. I don't think that he will  ever be a Bok great. He is OK but nothing special. His decision making is nothing special. 
Arno Botha is one of the biggest hypes of the lot. He has proved bugger all. I doubt i f he ever would.
The list goes on and on. 

Ceradyne
Your story about what hype is is utter BS.  Hype does not only apply to new players - it equally applies to existing players.  Some existing players can make the biggest bugger-ups and the press still do write-ups on them.
The most hyped up player in the period 2014 - 2015 was none other than Matfield - useless in games but praised to high heaven.  
The players you claimed are hype players all showed promise and was especially mentioned to replace proven failures like Morne Steyn (Goosen) and Matfield (De Jager).   You apparently also do not realize that Pollard is a 10 times better flyhalf than useless Morne - not the finished product, but at least a flyhalf who takes decisions and not a donkey-kicker like Morne - the celebrated bench flyhalf of Stade Francais.       

"The players you claimed are hype players all showed promise and was especially mentioned to replace proven failures like Morne Steyn (Goosen) and Matfield (De Jager).   You apparently also do not realize that Pollard is a 10 times better flyhalf than useless Morne - not the finished product, but at least a flyhalf who takes decisions and not a donkey-kicker like Morne - the celebrated bench flyhalf of Stade Francais. "      But, but,but.......................... you branded Pollard as a Morne Steyn clone.....
In any case. You have mentioned the the crux of the matter but you fail to see the context. You rightly mention "............are hype players all showed promise............"
Now, this is the reality. All the players that I mentioned, including those that fall under "etc, etc,etc.............." showed promise. The problem is that most South African supporters have the same issue. Every young player, showing promise, has to be included in the Bok team immediately. The media start the BS and the supporters run with it. The result is that most of these players are rushed onto the big stage prematurely. 
The 2015 RWC was one RWC too soon for Pollard. He was pushed too far too soon. His decision making was brilliant in the RWC where he played in a competition where the playing fields were level. All of, more or less, the same age and experience level. He had space and time "to do his thing". He was a promising player and he should have been in the mix but he the mantle of the prime no 10 fell on his shoulders too soon. The same thing happened with Johan Goosen and even Lambie but to a lesser extent. Lood de Jager, and PSDT for that matter, would have benefitted immensely if Andries Bekker didn't disappear so soon. They would have been great had they had the opportunity to be eased onto the bigger stage instead of being thrown in.
To me, there is a massive hype around  Lood de Jager and I might be proven wrong in the long run but at the moment the jury is still out. And, just to be clear, it has nothing to do with Matfield. I am not stupid. I know that Matfield could not last forever and yes, he did make a  balls-up in the game against the ABs in the RWC but that does not negate Lood de Jager's blunder in the Kaino try. It also does not negate Lood's other blunders in other tests. Lood should have been the main man in the next RWC. Not the 2015 one. I am not saying that he should not have been there. I say that he should not have been so prominent. 
Having said that, let me give you a little surprise. When Matfield returned, I did not really expect him to end up at the 2015 RWC. I really thought that he was only there because of the lack of leadership as well as the lack of locks due to the injuries to PSDT and the loss of Bekker, etc. In hindsight, he should probably not have been in the RWC but he delivered, IMO, right up to his the game of his first injury in the 2015 RC. When he did not immediately pass a fitness test in the next week, I had a gut feeling that he was not going to go through the entire RWC without another injury. Problem is that that was at the eleventh hour. 
To get back to your remark. Once again. You are correct when you say that all those players showed promise. The issue comes in when they are hyped up too soon. Having a discussion about Morne Steyn, with you, is of no use because of your preconceived hatred of the guy. Morne Steyn has had too many success for him to be called a failure. His failure is a figment of your imagination. Let me give you an example. You started rubbishing his tenure at Stade Francais from the moment that his move to the French club was announced. You maliciously started threads containing blatant lies about him. You claimed that his club was trying to offload him. Meanwhile, back at the ranch, his club extended his contract. 
Pollard still has a lot to prove before he could be named as 10 times the player that MS is or was. South African supporters have him on some super pedestal but there are many better international fly halves than Pollard. I don't think that he would feature in the top 5 at this stage. Actually, if he is going to be out for the entire year, I see a very difficult road back for him. 

Ceradyne
You forget Morne Steyn's last test in Perth - he was an outright failure - caused the Aussies to win the test by not finding touch with a penalty - and he missed 7 out of 15 tackle attempts.   He enver was a reasonable flyhalf - his only asset being his kicking at goal.  For the rest he was a miserable player who should never be in the Springbok squad.  He failed in virtually all the tests he played in since 2012 - so bad that even his pal Meyer had to drop him.  Just think about the tests he played in then.  He coinstantly failed against the AB's in tests since he was so predictable and useless - they knew that he was poor in defense - they just ran in the channel and he collapsed like a heap.  Two missed line penalty kicks in one test and a string of missed tackles in another.   If you said he was successful - it never happened in the Meyer era.
Your dear Morne virtually only played as starting flyhalf when Plisson is NOT available  - that is a fact as well,   They found out that he is not a flyhalf - but a kicking donkey.   No decision- making - I can remember  a match for Stade Francais where they had a bonus point in the bank until Morne came on - made a ridiculous kick and the opposing team scored - goodbye bonus point.  That is Morne and that is why he will never ever be regarded as an acceptable flyhalf on international level.
Hansen once made a remark before the test in 2014.   "We know what we have in Morne Steyn - but we do not know what to expect from Pollard."  So that means they know how to handle Steyn because he was so poor and predictable.   
What did Victoria deliver?  He was in the test against Australia for 17 minutes before injury and he delivered zero in that game.  That after he failed badly in the last game in Super Rugby - against the Rebels.  He was involved in more losing tests than any other lock since 2012 - and you call it delivery - what a farce.     

 One incident out of 60 tests. Your sunshine boy only managed one good one in 6 and that one was courtesy of a highly disrupted and injury plagued Aus side. 
"He enver (sic) was a reasonable flyhalf - his only asset being his kicking at goal." - Opinion
"He coinstantly (sic) failed against the AB's in tests since he was so predictable and useless - they knew that he was poor in defense - they just ran in the channel and he collapsed like a heap. " - Opinion. Should we pull up the stats where he scored all of 30+ (including a try) against the ABs?
"No decision-making - I can remember  a match for Stade Francais where they had a bonus point in the bank until Morne came on - made a ridiculous kick and the opposing team scored - goodbye bonus point."- I can remember French newspaper reports hailing him after SF won the Top14 semi-finals and then when they won the Top14 final as well. I can remember a kick where your sunshine boy was  taken off after a horrible kick with the commentators mocking him, saying that that was not the way to convince his club that he is teh prefect back-up for Johnny Se.xton.
"Hansen once made a remark before the test in 2014.   "We know what we have in Morne Steyn - but we do not know what to expect from Pollard."  So that means they know how to handle Steyn because he was so poor and predictable."- I cannot remember that remark but it was probably a matter of them acknowledging that Pollard was an unknown factor. I am sure that they now know him as well. 
"...He was involved in more losing tests than any other lock since 2012 - and you call it delivery - what a farce. "- It is possible. I haven't checked that. Then again..... the others were always injured.

 You make comments about Morne Steyn about a test in 2009 or 2010 I believe.  Three years later he failed badly - and Meyer did drop him for the simple reason that he was useless.  However, he got progressively worse since then culminating in his last RC test where he delivered victory to the Wallabaies on a platter.  However, this is not 2010 - it happened that it is 2015 and he was useless. already in 2012.
That rem,ark of Hansen was as clear as daylight - they knew how pathetic Steyn was and they knew how to handle him.   We lost 6 tests in a row against the AB's where Morne was the flyhalf and he messed up all of them before that game.  The first game Pollard was flyhalf the AB's lost the game - despite a near fatal f#ck-up by Matfield when he lost a Springbok throw-in in a line-out 6 meters out.   Morne was always a one-dimensional player - his only asset was clear.  A kicking donkey par excellence.
Whether you like it or not - there are three totally deficient selections made by Meyer since 2012 - those were Fat Alberts, Ouma Victoria and Morne - the Kicker only - Steyn.    

   

 "...He was involved in more losing tests than any other lock since 2012 - and you call it delivery - what a farce. "
OK. I checked the facts for you. Are you sure you want to see them?
Victor Matfield:Played: 17Won: 10Lost: 7 Drawn: 0%: 58.82
Eben Etzebeth:Played: 44Won: 29Lost: 13 Drawn: 2%: 68.18
Bakkies BothaPlayed: 9Won: 8Lost: 1 Drawn: 0%: 88.88
Lood de JagerPlayed: 19Won: 11Lost: 8 Drawn: 0%: 57.89

 A series of great posts Vlag. Your post 4 or so up where you discuss mentoring and phasing in of young players is spot on.....the ABs provide us a clear example of what you are discussing, but we are still on the youngster drug. This year the drumbeat for the du Preez twins will be huge.