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Ireland vs ABs …live thread

Started by Mozart133 REPLIES2,626 VIEWS· 08 Nov 2024, 20:33
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RO
RooinekCaptain18,117 posts
09 Nov 2024, 16:04
#121
09 Nov 2024, 16:04#121
"To the manner born” is an expression from Hamlet by William Shakespeare that means someone has refined tastes and habits because they were born into a privileged class. In the play, Hamlet says, “Though I am native here and to the manner born, it is a custom more honor'd in the breach than the observance"
LMAO! Are you saying Sha kespeare got it wrong and you're right, Moffie? Is that what you're trying to tell us?
RO
RooinekCaptain18,117 posts
09 Nov 2024, 16:15
#122
09 Nov 2024, 16:15#122

ChatGPT: 

"To the manor born" means to be born into a privileged or affluent lifestyle, often with the implication that the person is accustomed to wealth, status, or certain social advantages. The phrase originates from English, where it refers to someone who appears naturally suited to a life of luxury or high social standing, as though they were born into it.

The expression became more widely known with the popular British sitcom To the Manor Born, which aired in the late 1970s and early 1980s. In the show, the phrase humorously reflects the life of an aristocratic woman who loses her ancestral estate but retains her noble attitude.

Phrases.org.uk:

"

What's the origin of the phrase 'To the manner born'?

Any examination of ‘to the manner born’ has to include a mention of its often-quoted incarnation, ‘to the manor born’. That has a similar meaning but stresses manorial birth, that is, it refers to someone born into the nobility.

The ‘manner’ version is earlier and there’s some debate amongst etymologists as to whether the second of these phrases was coined deliberately as a play on words, or whether it is just a misspelling of ‘manner’ as ‘manor’. The third possibility, that they arose independently, is highly unlikely.

‘To the manner born’ was used by, and probably coined by, Shakespeare, in Hamlet, 1602:

HORATIO:     Is it a custom?

HAMLET:      Ay, marry, is’t:
      But to my mind, though I am native here
      And to the manner born, it is a custom
      More honour’d in the breach than the observance.

The meaning there is clear. Hamlet knows the custom being spoken of because he is native, that is, born locally.

Hamlet was written in or around 1600 and published in 1603. The ‘manor’ version comes much later. The earliest reference I’ve found so far is in The Times, July 1859, in a story about the Emperor of France’s visit to Austria:

“Before Solferino, Austria was only an intruder in Italy; now she is as one ‘to the manor born’.”

To the Manor Born is the name of a popular BBC comedy series that was broadcast in 1979. The final episode had the highest audience for a single UK TV show at the time, which accounts for some of the penetration of this version of the phrase into the language. The show’s scriptwriter, Christopher Bond, would certainly have been aware of the line in Hamlet when he adopted the title and it’s clear that he used the ‘manner/manor’ play on words knowingly.

The question is, did ‘to the manor born’ originally become adopted because of a play on words or by mistake?

It would appear to be a simple mistake. Some people may have been aware is the ‘manner’ spelling but it’s hardly credible that everyone did. The ‘manor’ version of the phrase is now far more popular in the language than the earlier one. Examples of its use make it clear that the distinction between ‘manner’ and ‘manor’ is now being lost. Given the closeness of the meaning of the two phrases, they have now become virtually interchangeable.

There are many examples of such errors, where words are replaced by plausible, similar-sounding alternatives. In fact, this is so common a linguistic form as to have been given a name – eggcorn. This name was coined in 2003 following the example of a misspelling of acorn as egg corn. If you know that acorns are egg-shaped but aren’t sure how the word is pronounced, ‘eggcorn’ would be a reasonable guess.

‘To the manor born’ makes sense, as people born in manors could be expected to be born into a life of pre-determined affluence. The existence of the previous phrase ‘born with a silver spoon in one’s mouth‘, would also tend to have made the ‘manor’ phrase intuitive. It may well have been coined by mistake but, given its adoption into the language, it’s perhaps overly strict to label it as incorrect. It could now be viewed as an example of how language mutates with time."



MO
MozartCaptain49,914 posts
09 Nov 2024, 16:25
#123
09 Nov 2024, 16:25#123
‘ LMAO! Are you saying Shaekespeare got it wrong’. He used ‘manner’…not ‘manor’, old chap.
So no I’m not saying Shaekespeare (sic), got it wrong. I’m saying language evolves.
But Chat suggests the subsequent evoloving of ‘to the Manor born’ was the result of a mistake, time to move on. 
Thanks that was helpful.
RO
RooinekCaptain18,117 posts
09 Nov 2024, 16:28
#124
09 Nov 2024, 16:28#124

Stay down Moffie . . .

MO
MozartCaptain49,914 posts
09 Nov 2024, 16:40
#125
09 Nov 2024, 16:40#125
Hilarious…..you wanted me to use an expression that was the result of a spelling mistake. And clearly you never knew Shakespeare created ‘to the manner born’ when you asked me to use ‘to the manor born’….and you botched his name.
How many flubs is that…three?
RO
RooinekCaptain18,117 posts
09 Nov 2024, 16:44
#126
09 Nov 2024, 16:44#126

LMAO!

Stay down, eggface.

MO
MozartCaptain49,914 posts
09 Nov 2024, 17:03
#127
09 Nov 2024, 17:03#127

Admit you never knew Shaekespeare(sic) wrote ‘to the manner born’. Be honest now. I’m not sure if you knew the correct spelling of his name, but I see you have edited your gaff….,hahaha!

RO
RooinekCaptain18,117 posts
09 Nov 2024, 17:07
#128
09 Nov 2024, 17:07#128

Tell you what, eggface, I know Shakespeare never wrote "from the manner born".

I gnorant, poorly educated fool!

LMAO!

MP
MpowerPro5,061 posts
09 Nov 2024, 17:26
#129
09 Nov 2024, 17:26#129
Well deserved win by the AB …. There scrum was performing well and laid the foundation for there win. The Irish just couldn’t get into a groove and there error rate didn’t help.. they really missed Tagh Furlong tonight. But they are a class outfit and will be back. Congrats AB for the win in Ireland which is special as many teams don’t get that right.
MO
MozartCaptain49,914 posts
09 Nov 2024, 18:25
#130
09 Nov 2024, 18:25#130

Yes you thought he wrote ‘to the manor born’….until you googled it. Game, set and match again. 

RO
RooinekCaptain18,117 posts
09 Nov 2024, 18:30
#131
09 Nov 2024, 18:30#131

LMAO!

Stay down, eggface.

MO
MozartCaptain49,914 posts
09 Nov 2024, 19:18
#132
09 Nov 2024, 19:18#132
So let’s recap. I made a perfectly neutral post and used the term from the Manor Born. Perfectly good English, totally understandable, but not the most common usage.
A bomb goes off in your brain and you insist on ‘to the manor born’ . I prove to you from the Manor Born is used in the title of a significant documentary, so in general use.
You then quote Shakespeare….misspell his name….and put in manor instead of ‘manner’. Two errors you correct, but clearly in pushing ‘to the manor born’ vs Shakespeare’s ‘to the manner born’ you knew nothing of the Shakespeare quote. And it turns out Chat GTP who you stupidly quote without checking,  rules that ‘to the manor born’ was a simple mistake.
Everything you did pretty much backfired. And it was all so unnecessary, just another example of an unprovoked ‘gotcha’ attack gone wrong.
What’s the compulsion I wonder. Have you ever sought help, it might change what’s left of miserable life.
RO
RooinekCaptain18,117 posts
09 Nov 2024, 19:47
#133
09 Nov 2024, 19:47#133

Here's a slightly different recap . . . Moffie displays his ignorance, Rooinek corrects Moffie's laughably ignorant mistake and points out that Moffie has copiouis amounts of egg sliding down his stupid face. Moffie quickly Googles  the nonsensical "from the manor born", gets a hit and starts trumpeting his victory . . . secretly knowing he's made a complete dick of himself again but keeping up the pretence to try and save face.

Somehow, I think my version is a lot more accurate.

LMAO!

"From the manor born" . . . Waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaahahahahahahaha!

MO
MozartCaptain49,914 posts
09 Nov 2024, 22:34
#134
09 Nov 2024, 22:34#134

Oh your version where you pompously thought Shakespeare wrote ‘to the manor born’, whereas he actually wrote ‘to the manner born’.

Nope what happened here is just another foot shoot. As I told you before I just have to give you some rope….or is that  enough rope. 

Waaaahaha…clearly I gave you enough rope….enjoy your egg.

— END OF THREAD —

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