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FORUM / RUGBY /  Kolisi and Pollard talk about who are Boks most undervalued playets

Kolisi and Pollard talk about who are Boks most undervalued playets

Started by Beeno187 REPLIES2,933 VIEWS· 29 Feb 2024, 14:05
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CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
04 Mar 2024, 11:26
#41
04 Mar 2024, 11:26#41

Mozart bragged about one thing  - he said he never see anything  good in rugby by his pet hate players.  He never sees that De Allende when being tackled does not lose balls and it always comes back to the Springboks to continue attacks - he never sees De Allende protecting the ball at breakdowns - he never sees anything positive in anything D ev  Allende does.   He never sees anything  he does not want to see.  A  sure recipe for BS writing on site.     

MP
MpowerPro5,061 posts
04 Mar 2024, 11:32
#42
04 Mar 2024, 11:32#42
By running a more straight line to Nonu and committing in making the tackle….he rather chose to ran next to him and only at the end when it was to late, you see Dda on Nonu,s back.
SA
Saffolk Captain30,741 posts
04 Mar 2024, 11:53
#43
04 Mar 2024, 11:53#43
Oh boy so you missed Nonu’s in out before DA could get anywhere near him You guys don’t understand the finer points or the art of rugby at all. Here is a lesson for you. Nonu is renowned for stepping - so if he does an in, it’s either going to be an inside step or an in out, feigning an inside step and instead going out, which is what he does. So if DA is going to rush out and take the line you want him to, Nonu steps him inside. As a centre defending you have to cover both options. The in out means you have to pause, it’s why attackers use the in out and something Nonu was brilliant at.
MP
MpowerPro5,061 posts
04 Mar 2024, 12:02
#44
04 Mar 2024, 12:02#44
No I saw the stepping and Nonu was brilliant I agree, but if Dda run a more direct route to Nonu, not holding back himself, he might have had a better chance in tackling him when it mattered.
CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
04 Mar 2024, 12:07
#45
04 Mar 2024, 12:07#45

Nonu started off running  across the field and there was no way De A llende culd prevent him from doing  it.   Rushing up to try to prevent Nonu from doing what you want would have created a gasp meters wide.    Mozart initially lied and claimed De Allende did not tackle Nonu - but he did.  

The Rush-up system never works -  here is an example - In the 2013 test against the A B's the aB's scored a try - basically as a result of  Dev Villiers rushing up out of line - expecting Morne to maka tackle - but all Morne did was to slap the A B on his back and wish him well on his way to score and Engelbrecht who were far to late to stop the try.      

In any event back to the incident Mozart  liedf about.    If somebody was at fault in  that case it was Pietersen who ended up doing nothing and not covering Barrett allowing him an open run to the try-line.       

MO
MozartCaptain49,914 posts
04 Mar 2024, 14:30
#46
04 Mar 2024, 14:30#46

Dud’s first mistake was he was too deep at least a meter and a half behind Pollard. His second mistake was he never accelerated immediately, he was trotting. Then he finally started sprinting but instead of going into the tackle he got ‘stood up’ by Nonu’s fake.

The amazing thing is if you watch the top down video he was actually outside Nonu at the start and Nonu  ended up rounding him. That shows how slowly he reacted.

Nonu was never going to step Dud Dave….he was flanking him on the outside. No way to step him given their body positions. There Dave there’s a finer point for you.

Dud was confused and made three mental errors in 5 seconds to take us out the WC.

MO
MozartCaptain49,914 posts
04 Mar 2024, 14:34
#47
04 Mar 2024, 14:34#47

Thanks for the heads up Moolaa….haha, kind of devalues one’s point if you can’t even name the AB that shredded Dud.

CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
04 Mar 2024, 14:49
#48
04 Mar 2024, 14:49#48

How did he shred De Allende BSter    Rushing up defence out of line  is disastrous.   Nonu was trying  to get away from De Allende by running cross-field and was caught in the end by following  he was not running beside Nonu he was running at  angle to tackle him.   

However - dim fool - that was one incident 89 years ago and for you to bring up that incident and initially lied about it just is what you specialize in.   I asked  you why no other commentator came up with  the BS you  came up with and no expert came up with  it either - you said   you are the leading expert on RUGBY in the world.   It was obviously seriously funny when y ou - with prejudice and idiocy on rugby issues can come up with.    Hilariously funny.           

CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
04 Mar 2024, 14:49
#49
04 Mar 2024, 14:49#49

How did he shred De Allende BSter    Rushing up defence out of line  is disastrous.   Nonu was trying  to get away from De Allende by running cross-field and was caught in the end by following  he was not running beside Nonu he was running at  angle to tackle him.   

However - dim fool - that was one incident 89 years ago and for you to bring up that incident and initially lied about it just is what you specialize in.   I asked  you why no other commentator came up with  the BS you  came up with and no expert came up with  it either - you said   you are the leading expert on RUGBY in the world.   It was obviously seriously funny when y ou - with prejudice and idiocy on rugby issues can come up with.    Hilariously funny.           

MO
MozartCaptain49,914 posts
04 Mar 2024, 14:58
#50
04 Mar 2024, 14:58#50

He didn’t need to rush up….he just needed to hold the defensive line with Pollard.  But given he was incorrectly positioned and slow to react, he did have to rush to reach Nonu who was threatening to cross the line unopposed.

A catastrophic  defensive mistake he repeated with Mo’unga at WC 2023. 

CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
04 Mar 2024, 15:06
#51
04 Mar 2024, 15:06#51

Nobody can discuss anything  about aa rugby idiot who claims he is the top expert of ruigby performnce analysis in the world and routinely lie about incidents on rugby.    Where does ruby centers line up anyway - always slightly behind the flyhalf - never before him.   Dimness a  meter nearer would not stop Nonu from running  across the field like he did.       

Anyway we had shit as a coach in 2015 and  Matfield - who was useless as well losing his first line-out when he came on a a replacment  and causing a penalty turnover - which would have put the Springboks in a real possible winning situation. 

Nearly 9 years later and we have the top coach in the world and won the WC twice in succession and you keep moaning about an incident at least 8 years ago - what a fool you are.    

  

SA
Saffolk Captain30,741 posts
04 Mar 2024, 15:09
#52
04 Mar 2024, 15:09#52
What part of if he had shot out directly, Nonu would have stepped inside do you not get Blaming DA is not only ignorant it’s childish Two things happened - Schalk fucked up completely by conceding possession and Nonu executed a great in out to cause DA to pause. Of course DA is not going at full tilt for had he, Nonu would have stepped him As per usual the take on DA is utter bullshit and more than anything it displays rugby ignorance Schalk is to blame for that try and that’s a fact. He retains possession like he should have and we clear the ball
DB
DbDraadCaptain26,388 posts
04 Mar 2024, 15:09
#53
04 Mar 2024, 15:09#53

De Alende was involved in the ruck just prior to that move...there might not have been enough to get back wide to the proper defensive position.

SA
Saffolk Captain30,741 posts
04 Mar 2024, 15:34
#54
04 Mar 2024, 15:34#54
Draad it will always be big bad DA’s fault Taken with a pinch of salt
MO
MozartCaptain49,914 posts
04 Mar 2024, 16:08
#55
04 Mar 2024, 16:08#55

Nope…go to minute 0.55….draw a line through Pollard to JP it’s dead straight. Dud is two strides behind that line….there’s your opening.

And nope he was at, but not involved in the ruck. And the ABs moved to the right before coming back to the left. He had plenty of time. Proven by the fact that he was actually outside Nonu when he started his trot forward.

If you think that a center cant be blamed for not defending his direct opponent …if you think the right point of contact is behind the defender….then Dud is not to blame. Which of course means the position Nonu found himself in was a sure try.

But if you think Dud should have been within two strides of Nonu when he got the ball and ceded no space towards the line…then Dud’s ineffective defense took us out the WC.

SA
Saffolk Captain30,741 posts
04 Mar 2024, 16:43
#56
04 Mar 2024, 16:43#56
Bullshit what took us out the WC was Schalk conceding possession on our line Nonu effected a perfect in out, if you don’t know the effects of this you don’t know rugby But fact is regardless of this - Schalk cost us the game - fact.
PL
PlumCaptain21,007 posts
04 Mar 2024, 17:00
#57
04 Mar 2024, 17:00#57
Ever heard of being married to an idea? Here, watch this... Saffex, name 3 times that DDA screwed up. To everyone else...can you hear those wedding bells?
SA
Saffolk Captain30,741 posts
04 Mar 2024, 17:08
#58
04 Mar 2024, 17:08#58
Big fat fucking YAWN
PL
PlumCaptain21,007 posts
04 Mar 2024, 17:18
#59
04 Mar 2024, 17:18#59
Do you know what being married to an idea means, Saffex? At some point you become too proud to admit you were wrong and too lazy to deal with the fallout. So you stay in that toxic relationship for far too long hahah
SA
Saffolk Captain30,741 posts
04 Mar 2024, 17:42
#60
04 Mar 2024, 17:42#60
I’m about as wrong about DA as Rassie is
MO
MozartCaptain49,914 posts
04 Mar 2024, 18:04
#61
04 Mar 2024, 18:04#61

I’m a huge Schalk fan, but I can admit his fumble was a big part of the AB try….the other part was Dud Allende blew the coverage. I wonder why Dud fans can’t admit that. I’m guessing because the Dud case is so  bereft of any tangible positives, there isn’t room for any negatives.

SA
Saffolk Captain30,741 posts
04 Mar 2024, 18:12
#62
04 Mar 2024, 18:12#62
I don’t need to admit it I can see exactly what happened - Nonu’s in out had the desired effect - it often does Dweba on Fassi the other day
MO
MozartCaptain49,914 posts
04 Mar 2024, 18:27
#63
04 Mar 2024, 18:27#63

Hahaha….classical Dave harping on the in/ out, whereas Nonu had run 20 metres before the in/out. And it wasn’t an in/out. It was a slow down and an acceleration. He never changed his angle through the whole run.

SA
Saffolk Captain30,741 posts
04 Mar 2024, 18:43
#64
04 Mar 2024, 18:43#64
It was an in out I’ve just double checked JP fucks up by coming in - had he kept his line there was no try as DA got Nonu
MO
MozartCaptain49,914 posts
04 Mar 2024, 19:13
#65
04 Mar 2024, 19:13#65

He just made a step faking it, he never changed his angle. A step would have made the tackle easier. And JP who was on Barrett cut off the pass by coming in…trouble was Dud never made the tackle. There was also the risk of Nonu beating Dud to the line.

It’s amazing how little analysis of these things take place in rugby. In American football they would have identified Dud’s horrendous positioning and slow reactions as the problem.

CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
04 Mar 2024, 19:21
#66
04 Mar 2024, 19:21#66

Mozart

I have to tell you one terribly story about De Allende - in the 2015 RWC test De Allennde made a hard  tackle of  Nonu that caused  a serious injury and had to leave the field.    Not surprisingly   that instead of carrying  the ball forward Nonu did the expected - he ran across the field in a desperate effort to avoid another De Allende tackle.

So we have 3 reasons for the try -

1     Burger lost the ball forward in a tackle that led to the attack by the AB's;

2     Pietersen who instead of covering Barrett stood around and did nothing to prevent the Barrett try.

3     De Allende

I believe 1 started the problem and 2 completed it.  Most to blame was 2      

  

MO
moolaaPro2,380 posts
04 Mar 2024, 20:26
#67
04 Mar 2024, 20:26#67
Mike, you can’t blame Petersen. It was DDA getting beaten by Nonu that forced him to have to try and cover both him and Barrett! He was in a no win 2 on 1 situation due to DDA’s lack of pace and indecision. This is all academic anyway as the ABs were far superior in that game. From memory the Boks only got within 10m of the AB line once in the entire game!
PL
PlumCaptain21,007 posts
04 Mar 2024, 20:29
#68
04 Mar 2024, 20:29#68
It's the same as the when DDA hugged the English player and basically just allowed him over the line. He ran next to him for a while then hugged him a bit, and at no point looked like actually stopping his man. This was after Pollard had already stifled most of his momentum. Or when DDA chooses to kick when he has a 3 man overlap. Or the countless occasions where he totally stifles momentum and dies with the ball. Willemse's reaction in the Irish game tells you exactly what the story is. He was absolutely livid that DDA ruined another clear try scoring chance in a very tight game. It was a type of letting out of frustration that says Willemse expects DDA to fuck up and can't stand it. None of these things are a mystery to anyone that isn't completely biased.
SA
Saffolk Captain30,741 posts
04 Mar 2024, 20:49
#69
04 Mar 2024, 20:49#69
Wrong he changes his angle slightly which is what the in out is about. DA makes the tackle but JP who should have stayed wide to cover Barrett, cuts in leaving Barrett open to receive the pass from Nonu to score So had Schalk not fucked up and had JP stayed wide - no try would have been scored - so blaming DA as I said is complete rugby ignorance
SA
Saffolk Captain30,741 posts
04 Mar 2024, 20:52
#70
04 Mar 2024, 20:52#70
Bullshit Moola DA tackles Nonu - he is going nowhere so JP made the error cutting in. JP stays wide he tackles Barrett with DA having tackled Nonu - no try Blatantly obvious
PL
PlumCaptain21,007 posts
04 Mar 2024, 21:12
#71
04 Mar 2024, 21:12#71
Everyone is wrong...everyone but Dave.
SA
Saffolk Captain30,741 posts
04 Mar 2024, 21:32
#72
04 Mar 2024, 21:32#72
Ok Plum so given DA tackles Nonu and Barrett scores, how is DA to blame given JP was originally covering Barrett? I’m all ears
MO
MozartCaptain49,914 posts
04 Mar 2024, 22:12
#73
04 Mar 2024, 22:12#73

Nonu slows up to connect with Barrett. He could have probably scored the try, Dud had put himself in the position of tackling from behind.  That’s why JP had to come in. His blocking of Nonu’s path was the only prudent thing to do. Dud couldn’t even make a smother tackle from behind.

It’s incredible really Dud’s direct opponent in a one on one situation makes 25 metres inside the 22 and according to Dave and his moronic  supporter, he has no culpability .

It’s a strange, strange game they watch Master Jack.

SA
Saffolk Captain30,741 posts
04 Mar 2024, 22:34
#74
04 Mar 2024, 22:34#74
No Nonu could not score as DA got him down - that’s a fact. Credit to Nonu for the in out but given DA got him down there was no reason for JP to cut in leaving Barrett open to receive the pass and score Given Schalk, DA and JP were involved one would have to conclude culpability was in the order of Schalk, JP then DA Schalk and JP made errors, DA was slightly thrown by the in out by Nonu but still got him down. To blame DA for our WC exit is just plain childish
MO
MozartCaptain49,914 posts
04 Mar 2024, 22:39
#75
04 Mar 2024, 22:39#75

JP had cut in way earlier because it wasn’t clear Dud would make the tackle. That opened up the pass, which Nonu made….slowing down slightly. Given he could easily have reached the 2.5 meter line with the pass…if he just goes flat out Dud never gets him…too slow as Moolaa said.

The real problem you don’t want to admit is Dud was way out of position.

BO
bobbok...Captain10,129 posts
04 Mar 2024, 23:26
#76
04 Mar 2024, 23:26#76

Mostert would've nailed Ma'a'aa  .................... nay bother

MO
MozartCaptain49,914 posts
04 Mar 2024, 23:41
#77
04 Mar 2024, 23:41#77

Think the Nonu thing is an aberration? Watch minute 10.20 to see Mo’unga pull an eerily similar fake on Dud….leaving him behind and gifting Smith a try which was called back, apparently incorrectly 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hrQh9HCCvNQ

SA
Saffolk Captain30,741 posts
04 Mar 2024, 23:41
#78
04 Mar 2024, 23:41#78
Bullshit DA was not out of position, Nonu’s in out checked DA but he still got Nonu JP fucked up by leaving Barrett open to score Those are the facts - just as it’s a fact Schalk fucked up by conceding possession The real issue here is your claim that DA was responsible for our WC exit - that my friend is utter bullshit and having heard the facts here - you will now know it DA ranks 3rd in culpability after JP and Schalk and that’s a fact This take on DA is as ignorant as any other on him by you and the likes of Plum It’s all a load of crap but thankfully Rassie sees it the way I do
MO
MozartCaptain49,914 posts
04 Mar 2024, 23:48
#79
04 Mar 2024, 23:48#79

DA was not out of position 2 metres behind the line through Pollard and JP? Desperate stuff Dave….watch Mo’unga putting the same move on him, only worse in the video above.

Schalk was stripped it happens, I have seen Etzebeth being stripped…but he was culpable. JP came inside to stop Nonu running it in….his position on Nonu’s path forced the pass. He was not culpable.

Dud has to be able to mark his man in the 22. And he should never let his man take the outside gap, you learn that as an Under 13 center….there’s cover inside, the outside gap is fatal. He was most culpable.

And he repeated his act in 2023 with Mo’unga, rescued by an incorrect TMO intervention.


CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
05 Mar 2024, 05:25
#80
05 Mar 2024, 05:25#80

First it was one meter - now it is 2 meters. Same first De Allende did not tackle Nonu - then it waa  I never wrote that.   Are you becoming like Biden suffering from dementia?    

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