BEBeeno1
Captain40,032 posts
BEBeeno1Captain40,032 posts
15 Dec 2014, 08:49#2
Ou maaaikie stamina is not the problem. You can wiln the comrades at 40. The problem is a fall off in pace. Both Hougaard and Reinach are faster scrummies. Lets hope they both have great Super Rugby seasons. Then there is Faf De Klerk as well.Du Preez is an interesting case. His reactions and mind are so quick I think one could safely take him as a third scum half option. We shall see.
By the way given one has three scrumhalves it is not necessary that one scrummie plays all the time or even in succee ding weks
CLclevermike
Coach57,555 posts
CLclevermikeCoach57,555 posts
15 Dec 2014, 09:49#3
Beeno
In the cases of Pienaar and Du Preez - they are both over the age of prime performance. They actually need a break after a game - a break of 14 days at least. It may not be the stamina issue - but it seems as if they cannot perform in succeeding weekends - maybe the spirit is fine - the body is not so willing. Be it as oit may the Japanese system - where teams play every 14 days - suits Du Preez better.
What is cear is that both has lost a lot of pace and that could also account for theup and down performances they both display.
However, that remains for the future - and I hope the matter ssorts itself out in Super 15.
GEgeneraltit
Pro3,164 posts
15 Dec 2014, 12:30#4
Ruan blows hot and cold...sometimes quite brilliant, other times mediocre to a let down...never really poor but hesitant...he has incredible talent there's no doubt about that but at times when he seems to switch off...cannot quite place it...he seems to lack confidence at times, which is strange for a man of his ability. Yes, he's started tipping the scales into the wrong side of age. The other issue about Ruan is that often felt in his earlier rugby playing days...he played flyhalf...indeed such a promising one that Jake commented and felt that we had a similar player to the Wallaby, Stephen Larkham...believe it or not. Maybe his rugby career started on the wrong foot and he should have stuck to flyhalf. Some players are good at both...Morgan Parra and Dimitri Yachvili, France, 2011 WC were used and switched effectively with the sub of Trin-Duc by Marc Lievremont.
However, despite saying this RP plays his best rugby in the NH a nd knows conditions there so a lot will depend on his form closer to September next year...scrumhalves are absolute key players...Reinach, FDP and Ruan should be in the squad and Pollard and Lambie (3X9's, with one that can play 10 and 2X10's). That should cover it.
SASaffolk
Captain30,741 posts
SASaffolk Captain30,741 posts
15 Dec 2014, 18:22#6
Pienaar is too passive, he lacks the hard edge......forget him
BIbiltongbek
Club Pro749 posts
BIbiltongbekClub Pro749 posts
15 Dec 2014, 19:52#7
Meyer is not going to forget Pienaar, we all know that.
BIbiltongbek
Club Pro749 posts
BIbiltongbekClub Pro749 posts
15 Dec 2014, 20:47#9
I get why SA players go overseas, I also get why they don't want to wait till they are 30 because they are afraid injury may curtail their careers before the big bucks come.
So what they are doing is using our system to make a name for themselves until the big money comes knocking.
The unfortunate thing for us as a national team is that we have to select them whilst having to compromise.
Hence my attitude that whilst they are overseas we must not select them, at least a coach knows what he has at home, and can arrange training camps etc during the Super XV.
If the player goes overseas then he must know he has to earn his position when he comes back.
And I fear that is not happening at the moment.
SASaffolk
Captain30,741 posts
SASaffolk Captain30,741 posts
16 Dec 2014, 00:09#12
Disagree overseas based players should be selected. As a coach you want access to every available player at your disposal.
Anything less and you sell yourself short. It's the modern way. You cant bla me players for bettering themselves financially it's their careers. They should not be excluded because of it
BIbiltongbek
Club Pro749 posts
BIbiltongbekClub Pro749 posts
16 Dec 2014, 00:14#13
Yet you only consider what they MIGHT add to the Springboks, and completely ignoring the negatives.
Consider what Frans Steyn, JP Pietersen, Jaque Fourie, Ruan Pienaar, Gurthro Steenkamp, Morne Steyn etc has added to the Boks over the last three years.
SASaffolk
Captain30,741 posts
SASaffolk Captain30,741 posts
16 Dec 2014, 00:19#14
Damn right all I consider is what they add to the Boks but I would not have selected those players. The only overseas based players I would consider would be Habana, JP, v/d Heever, Willemse, Goosen, v/d Walt and CJ Stander.
AGAgPleezDeddy
Club Pro900 posts
AGAgPleezDeddyClub Pro900 posts
16 Dec 2014, 01:17#15
Saffex and BB, would you be completely opposed to taking Fourie Du Preez to the World Cup as an experienced alternative to Reinach and Hougaard?
BIbiltongbek
Club Pro749 posts
BIbiltongbekClub Pro749 posts
16 Dec 2014, 01:21#16
Agpleezdaddy, you will most likely see Pienaar and Fourie du Preez at the RWC.
I think Reinach might lose out because he has a lot less experience than Hougaard.
MOMozart
Captain49,914 posts
MOMozartCaptain49,914 posts
16 Dec 2014, 01:25#17
The man is 25...experience isn't the issue. Slow passing, bumbling and butterfingers is more of the issue with Raainag.
AGAgPleezDeddy
Club Pro900 posts
AGAgPleezDeddyClub Pro900 posts
16 Dec 2014, 01:26#18
Personally I would take FDP, but not Pienaar. I wouldn't like to see both of them going.
BIbiltongbek
Club Pro749 posts
BIbiltongbekClub Pro749 posts
16 Dec 2014, 01:27#19
Test experience Mozart, and you would obviously prefer slow brain Pienaar or never available between injuries and club commitments Du Preez.
AGAgPleezDeddy
Club Pro900 posts
AGAgPleezDeddyClub Pro900 posts
16 Dec 2014, 01:29#20
Age isn't experience Mozart, I'd argue game time is and Reinach is a newcomer to international rugby - he's not hit his best form, but still managed to get two tries.
Not saying he should be first choice but he should definitely be in the World Cup Squad.
MOMozart
Captain49,914 posts
MOMozartCaptain49,914 posts
16 Dec 2014, 01:35#21
I'm not a great Pienaar fan, and F du Preez is a mystery at this point. But sadly Hougaard and Raainag aren't the answer...they don't have the basics, as we saw against Wales.
GEgeneraltit
Pro3,164 posts
16 Dec 2014, 01:44#22
Mozzie can you work the mathematics/science out...we only have these guys..."remember matter cannot be created or destroyed" except the evolutionists believe it's evolved...lolz
So what's your solution...who do you choose Mozart?
AGAgPleezDeddy
Club Pro900 posts
AGAgPleezDeddyClub Pro900 posts
16 Dec 2014, 01:49#23
One match can't be used to decide if a player is good enough or bad enough, Reinach is new to NH conditions and international rugby - he needs time.
Being in a squad with FDP will be massive, FDP can pass on advice and tricks of the trade.
sharkbok
Captain23,286 posts
sharkbokCaptain23,286 posts
16 Dec 2014, 02:30#24
Pienaar has become a Northern Hemisphere player. He will be useful as a backup at the world cup, not in the Southern Hemispere.
The bumbling of Hougaard is not required in the Northern Hemishpere. I think Reinach will replace him as the 3rd scrumhalf.
CLclevermike
Coach57,555 posts
CLclevermikeCoach57,555 posts
16 Dec 2014, 04:34#25
Mozart
As per normal you harped about Reinach running a few steps before passing is being wroong -however, you forgot about the fact thatthat is actuallythe game of Fourie du Preez more than anyone else.
Since it was always part and parcel of the Bulls game with Du Preez the key - it is very likely that Meyer instructed Reinach to do just that - allowing him to pass the ball back to the forwards if need be. Remember also that Matfield is invovled and he no dount would also insist on that.
What else did you find wrong with Reinach's game? If the issue of running a few steps is the only problem - why may Du Preez do it continuously and for Reinach it is a mortal sin?
MOMozart
Captain49,914 posts
MOMozartCaptain49,914 posts
16 Dec 2014, 04:38#26
If F du Preez is 60 per cent, he walks it Raainag is a sub, an alternative if we have to attack from behind. Pienaar is an alternative to F Du Preez.
CLclevermike
Coach57,555 posts
CLclevermikeCoach57,555 posts
16 Dec 2014, 04:58#27
Still no answer to my question - but a general comment of Du Preez being 60%? What 60% are you talking about? 60% fit or what?
I think in fact it is 60% fit - he plays well in 1 game and than plays very average rugby the next game - see what happened ever since his return to international rugby. It happened in the tests last year twice - ie the test against the Aussies in Cape Town he was good - in the succeding test in Johannesburg against the AB's a week lateer he was bog ordinary - in the test against the Welsh he was above average - in the test the next week against the Scots he was bog-ordinary.
Same thing happened this year - test in June against Wales and Scotland:-
* Wales test 1 - above average* Wales test 2 - average* Scotland - below par - injured
At this stage we have no indication of what Du Preez actually produces that is of real value - only reputation is saving him. So I assume your 60% relates to reputation and fitness - which makes him a poor selection.
