Pollard is the clear choice

The Bok veteran returned to the team seamlessly against Tonga. His general play was authoritative, and his goal kicking superb. Watching those balls on a target line to the right pole with a slight draw gave one that, he can’t miss, feeling.

Some pundits on here still want Libbok, who with the pressure off also kicked well yesterday. But starting him against France would be a mistake. Why? Well for several reasons:

1) His big pressure game before the WC, the URC final, was  a c minus, despite scoring a good open field try.

2) He is a poor defender who would be targeted by France’s  fine loosie ball carriers.

3) His kicking woes are mental and until he breaks through that barrier he will be suspect under pressure. The RC knockouts are not the time to overcome that tendency.

4) His decision making is suspect, the Kolbe try against Ireland was there for the taking without throwing a high risk long pass.

5) Libbok is a Cullen like open field runner, gliding away from the defence. But outside him is a runner who can only run into things. Besides which, space against France may never eventuate ….operating in traffic is much more Pollard’s thing.

6) Who would chose a URC loser over a WC Winner. If Libbok was our flyhalf in the last WC final there is a reasonable case that missed goal kicks would have swung the result .

In this case I will  be in agreement with Harrassmiss because he is going to choose Pollard.

You forget, he also won a URC...and has consistently performed exceptionally well in yhe URC...

I agree that he's not all there yet, but he gives the Boks another dimension which Pollard wasn't able to do with his years of test xp...what we did to NZ and Wales in the warm-ups was no fluke...Manie manages to convert forward dominance into backline tries...it's a travesty that he hasn't more tests under the belt...part of the software problem...xp...Pollard should be in the mix, but discarding Manie cometely now would be a step back.

Pollard is a better pole kicker, but I think Libbock is better at getting the backline running. 
If Libock was kicking well, Pollard would not make my match day 23 unless it was a 5/3 split- and if Willemse was a better pole kicker, Pollard would not even make my 23

Pollard has become a small Delande.
He seems too focused on the defence to create for his outside players.

He runs into contact even when he is outnumbered -instead of looking to pass to a loose forward to carry the ball up, assuming there is no space for the backs. He has forgotten how to draw and pass or delay to allow the supporting runners to form a line.

Manie kicked pretty well when he came on against Tonga. I'd start Manie and keep Pollard on the bench in case Manie goes rogue with his kicking again.

Still think we'll see Pollard in the #12 jersey before this RWC is over.

Pollard has talent. Libbok doesn't have talent. This is the age old bok pseudo fan myth of the great attacking flyhalf who will magically unlock everything. The same clowns that are gushing over the severely flawed and failed Libbok are the very same clowns who couldn't tell which one of Libbok, Willemse, and Willie were playing 10 for 80 minutes. Let that sink in. The big Libbok gimmick? The cross-field kick. His passing is utterly ordinary, and he dare not play anywhere near the gainline. Just shuffle ball 20 metres in front of the defence with a pod screen to Willie. Pollard doesn't have to be in form, or even fit; he is a good 10, and a good 10 will always be better than a bad 10. 

Once again, the rugby noob unwittingly vindicates my suggestion.

LMAO!

Brian O'driscoll said last night that he would pick Manie as his starting flyhalf, and put Pollard on the bench for pole kicking.

I have also seen some positive comments from Eddie Jones and Ian Foster about Manie. 
His passing is better than any Bok backline player I have ever seen. 

Having players that can pass such as Manie and Willie Leroux gives the Boks a playmaking ability that is on par with other international teams. 

Most people would agree that the Boks backline attack is often not as good as some of the test teams, but not so with Manie and Leroux on the pitch.

Pollard is class, he doesn't give you flair but he can mix it up and is not that far off on his passing game. Those that saw him play for Leicester will know that he definitely turned their season around. He too had some amazing play. It is just Rasputins terrible game plan that limited his ability to play more expansive. 

As for Manie, the bok coaches were forced to embrace his style or he would not fit in to their normal way of playing. I think the boks will revert back to type. 

I'm really curious to see the match day 23. Will the go for 7/1, 6/2 or 5/3 split. 

If both Pollard and Am is playing either off the bench or starting, then I see a 5/3 split with either Willemse as the 10 cover and Moodie as the 13 cover for Am. 

You could start with Moodie on the wing. He is only 20 and have lots of stamina. So you could have an Arendse on the bench to come on in the last 20 or 30 min, Moody shifting to 13 if Am is gassed. Then would you go for Willemse or Willie. To me Willemse is the better option as Willie should not wear the bok Jersey again. 

So my prediction is the Rassie will either revert back to type and pick as close as possible team. With Willemse and Williams on the bench or if he has evolved. He would have have game breakers on the bench and go for a 5/3 split

The idiot? It's quite incredible that Pip and Squeak haven't the shame to be a lot more quiet. Berating Willemse for playing poorly at 10, gushing over how Libbok turns it around, only to be presented with time stamps for every time Willie played 10 for all but a couple of phases for 80 minutes. It's quite amusing. There is no substance to the Libbok myth. He cannot tackle, he cannot challenge the line, he does not ever put anyone into space, he cannot manipulate the defence, he has a limited range of skills, and cannot play under any kind of pressure. What's there to discuss? 

I'll say it again, if Rassie simply does the opposite of what Doos XL suggests we'll win this RWC in a canter.

Start Pollard, he will give us the option to build scoreboard pressure and also keep Frogs honest in their own half even if it is only a threat. 

Manie comes on to open it up against weary legs in the later stages. If the boys have built a score he might not be under that pressure to nail the kicks. 

The opposite? Well, he only squeaked it in 2019 with selections I called for, that you didn't like. So, you can chalk that one up to me. Had he listened in 2011, the Boks would have been in another final. Clearly, Erasputin would be better off listening to me than the stale peanut inside his rather dense geologic stratum one presumes to be a cranium. But do tell us once more that Pollard is not better in contact than Libbok. 

The idea that you can have Pollard on the bench in case Manie can’t make his kicks is assinine.How long do you wait before you sub him?

In the WC final you could have lost 9 points even if you subbed Manie at the half. . Pollard nailed all of his kicks to register all 12 Bok points at the half. Three of those kicks were difficult to very difficult.

With Manie kicking we could easily have been behind 6 to 3 vs ahead by 6 points. Here’s the match description of one of the kicks:

‘ Pollard will have a go at the posts from 50 metres. It's out on the right as well. Tough kick. The stadium falls silent. It swings round beautifully, look a classic golfer's draw from the tee, right to left it swings and over the bar. Three points, South Africa lead for the third time in the match.’

Even the minnows have reliable kickers…no coach in their right mind would put Libbok in ahead of Pollard.. But it’s more basic than that. Libbok has shown no ability to add value to a tight conflict, typical of WC knockouts.

Pollard is way more physical than Manie…not always a secure tackler but not the kind of tackler who becomes a target. And Pollard is dangerous in traffic, he has shown that throughout his career. Manie is dangerous in wide open space. Which do you think is more likely in a knockout?

Get real.

To open what up? When has he ever opened anything aside from his channel? Utterly delusional. Flatline for an entire year, but be heralded as the attacker that needs to replace Pollard to get the job done; Pollard is merely a better kicker of equal physical stature. How ignorant can a lifeform be? 

The gaps open up in the later part of the match. That could suit Libb ok. 

What gaps? Most the gaps I see are from the Bok defence, as we are not very fit. These are all talking points that don't happen as talked about on a forum. In a top level test, the final portion of the game is much tighter than you realise, and players with good tactical awareness tend to make the difference, players who can stamp their authority on the game. Libbok is not that player, and he never will be. He has no history of ever being that player; Pollard most certainly does. A weakling, who cannot tackle, who cannot challenge the line, who needs freely given space against a passive line to just look average without doing anything special, is the very last player that should ever be on the field. 

To Mozart's point: In 2003, we lost 15 points in the first half against England in the WC. Koen missed those kicks, and the damage was done for the rest of the game. We would have likely won that game if a better kicker started, and avoided that test against New Zealand! That's a campaign defining loss down to one half . Again, another assumption from the casuals who are poor students of the game. 

The gaps open up….hahaha…poor old HasBeen. This guy is a walking, talking cliché. 

"His passing is better than any Bok backline player I have ever seen. "

indeed, his actual value...fantastic natural talent who should have been in the mix 2 years ago.

Libbok's passing is much inferior to Pollard, Morné, Du Preez, Esterhuizen, Frans, Joubert, Stransky to name but a few. Libbok's passing is at the very best of itself, average. There is no aspect of his performances that has been very good. Libbok's showings have been the worst since Goosen in 2012. The pseudo fan has no analytical skills, or rugby acumen. After an entire season of mediocre rugby, it is clear that Libbok should never ever wear the now cheapened green and gold. A jersey that used to mean something. Libbok is an impediment to attacking rugby. He has contributed next to nothing. 

If you start with Pollard and build up a lead and then move him into the #12 slot why would you bring Libbok on?

I presume that Pollard will still be the kicker so what is Libbok's claim to fame other than losing his first WC game due to his duffed kicks.

By the way if you replay the Irish game and watch Libbok lining up those missed kicks he was never on target or close.

Unfortunately he was thrown in at the deep end as the Bok flyhalf and never had the opportunity of gaining experience and confidence in international games but was under pressure from the start.

His time will come and his confidence will be restored plus I am sure that he will deliver in the future.

The Boks cannot take a chance with him at this knockout stage of the RWC as every point scored is important.

Also Willemse will be in the mix so if Pollard is injured he plus Faf are just as reliable kickers as Libbok.

The Boks are going to progress with forward power so I agree with the 7/1 bench format that they have adopted for this RWC.

Debate settled?

Not really...we all like Pollie's kick for poles, but Manie's foot pass brought us within a deciding kick range...

Pollard is the clear choice at the RWC where the Boks weaponise the scrum so as to milk penalties.

Pollard is not the clear choice in the Rugby Championships where the format is different to the RWC. In the Rugby Championships the format is slanted towards scoring tries and teams are rewarded with bonus points for a certain amount of tries scored and there's also a bonus point for the closeness of the scores. Libbok is more suited than Pollard to the RC whereas Pollard is more suited to the RWC with his dead eye penalty conversions. 

There is a reason why the Boks have done better at the RWC than in the RC.

i remain a Pollard no 1 choice supporter when i comes to eh fl yhalf osition - b ut am not s ure how lonhg he can last.    His record indcates tha  he is injury prone with injuries being fo long ansences from Rugby - eg from 2016 to  2018.   He also played little rugby from 2022 to 2023 and was injurd when the original WC squad for 2023 was selected and subnitted to WR.   That is why he was not in the WC squad and when Marx was to be repalced Pollard was ma tch fit and could play - so  he was picked  repalce Marx.

That - when Mbonambi was injured left the Springboks without a Hooker in the final and was the reason fo the sub-par perormances ofc he Springbok forwards in he final.   That leavs Pollard sill a nu mb 1 choie - but I think much will be dne to srengthen the choice situation when it comes to finding suitable back-ups for Pollard.     Development of flyhalf  in SA was alays a moot point.   Those we had since 2004 always reprresent the 10 man rugby  game plan  which left the backs toothless and mosly  used only for defense and for kicking - with players like Morne Steyn be excelent iro kicking at goal and a 100% failure when it came to stategic kicking.   The perod 2012 to 2017 was major failure years for the Springboks turned around in 2018 and 2019 by Erasmus.    There is still room for improvement and that is here I beleive Brown will provid th necessary expetise to improve the backline as an attacking vehicle.   

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Manie kicked 4 from 5 in very windy conditions a d he had a major hand in Both Stormer tries...IDK if he's the answer for the Bokke yet, but I'm eager to see what he can do...he deserves a proper look at the very least.

Ja...I'm not confident that he's gonna make it either...but who else in the foreseeable future?...

That pressure conversion kick missed in the final moments of yesterdays game is a clear example of his class to turn a game out from a loss.

Not the first time.......

Arthur, the wind in CT on Saturday was something else...terrible conditions. 

Yeah given the windy conditions even the very best place kickers would have struggled. Blaming Maine is incredibly unfair, doubly so when he was the reason the Stormers where in with a chance of winning that game in the first place.