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Springbok Team for Saturday

Started by clevermike68 REPLIES854 VIEWS· 24 Sept 2014, 13:50
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CL
clevermike
Coach57,555 posts
CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
24 Sept 2014, 13:50
#1
24 Sept 2014, 13:50#1

The team is as follows:-


15 Willie le Roux,  14 Cornal Hendricks,  13 Jan Serfontein,  12 Jean de Villiers (c),  11 Bryan Habana,  10 Handré Pollard,  9 Francois Hougaard,  8 Duane Vermeulen,  7 Teboho “Oupa” Mohoje,  6 Marcell Coetzee,  5 Victor Matfield,  4 Eben Etzebeth,  3 Jannie du Plessis,  2 Adriaan Strauss,  1 Tendai Mtawarira


Replacements:


16 Bismarck du Plessis,  17 Trevor Nyakane,  18 Marcel van der Merwe,  19 Bakkies Botha,  20  Schaklk Burger,  21 Cobus Reinach,  22 Pat Lambie,  23 JP Pietersen


This potential;ly has some of the worst selections Meyer cpould have made and puts the chancs of SA winning on Saturday in serious jeopardy.  


*   The fact that we have a disfunctional center combination with  De Villiers seriously out of form and Seefomtein at 13 - a center that can defend - but has serious deficiencies in attacking play - and the slow poor defender Pietersen on the bench.


*   Hougaard was shockingly poor in the Wellington test and he is retained;


*    Mohoje is at best a bench player for his Super 15 franchise and is an extremely limited loosie,


*    The lock combination is a joke in bad taste - disfuccntional Tight 5 is a certainty.


*    Jannie du Plessis -  OMG.


I was hoping for a Springbok victory - but the team has too many questionable selections to even hope for one.


SA
Saffolk
Captain30,741 posts
SA
Saffolk Captain30,741 posts
24 Sept 2014, 14:01
#2
24 Sept 2014, 14:01#2
Oh look Bakkies is back.......the Meyer circus continues.....what a fucking idiot  
BO
Boklogic
Pro1,978 posts
BO
BoklogicPro1,978 posts
24 Sept 2014, 15:02
#3
24 Sept 2014, 15:02#3
 Dave u f u c k i n g c u n t. If we had Bakkies against the AB's, we might have won..Lood de Jager is a prick just like u buddy..
In other news, I see public pressure has handed that guy who cant make the Cheetahs starting team (Oupa Mahoje) a run on start..We are much weaker for it..
SA
Saffolk
Captain30,741 posts
SA
Saffolk Captain30,741 posts
24 Sept 2014, 15:47
#4
24 Sept 2014, 15:47#4
Oh Chicken what is 3+1  
3K
3ku1
Pro2,580 posts
3K
3ku1Pro2,580 posts
24 Sept 2014, 15:58
#5
24 Sept 2014, 15:58#5
 Solid Team. I agree some selection questions. But who else you got? Maybe theirs no one putting their hand up currently and saying, im the incumbant. So its tried and true unfortunatley. My three concerns from SA Pov.
Jannie Du Pleesi: Useless, and slow
Victor Matfeild: Was solid againgst Nz. But generally lacks physicality, is slow, and lacks efficiency as a defender. 
Teboho M ohje: Very green, like some have said he cnt even bench for Cheetahs. Maybe hell go good, maybe he wont. But Hooper has prooven to be worldclass, and should outplay Tebohe. 
CL
clevermike
Coach57,555 posts
CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
24 Sept 2014, 16:10
#6
24 Sept 2014, 16:10#6
 boklogic
If you add up what Bakkies has done in all the tests he played in since November last year  - you will find one really big f #ck-all.   With him and Matfield as locks the Springbok scrum was detroiyed and that is a fact.
Bakkies Botha
But lets be fair and look at Bakkies performancess in the tests he played in:-
Scotland    
Botha0/000/3/6200104/31/200/0
France
Botha0/000/0/3000014/14/000/0
Wales
Botha0/000/0/4300010/01/000/0
Sum Total
Botha0/000/3/13500028/46/200/0
Three tests played  -

*   13 ball carries gaining in total 5 meters*     2 ball possession losses;*     8 tackles made - 4 missed tackles*     8 line-out takes
Some-total - virtually F#ck all - and you say he would have helped us to a win against the Al Blacks.    Afraid with him and Matfield togehter the loss would have been bigger.
Jean de Villiers 
My problem is not only with Bakkies Botha abnd Slapgat Matfield -  I am eually worried by Jean de Villiers.   His performances were also crap:-
Argentina
de Villiers0/001/5/61500011/00/020/0
de Villiers0/100/3/2900105/00/010/0
Australia
de Villiers0/000/4/727120012/20/020/0
New Zealand
de Villiers0/001/2/102710019/40/000/0
Some-Total - 4 tests 
de Villiers0/102/14/2578221227/60/040/0
The above from m international center is just not up to standard.   If you compare last years performances with the above - you would be shocked.  He has gone backwards by the proverbial miles.
Hougaard  
And then we have Hougaard - he was useless in all tests played - end of story
Jannie du Plessis
OMG
sharkbok
sharkbok
Captain23,294 posts
sharkbok
sharkbokCaptain23,294 posts
24 Sept 2014, 17:05
#7
24 Sept 2014, 17:05#7
Mike where are the stats of Lood Foot to compare with? 
Lood had one good test against a minnow, but since then has been very quiet. 
I dont think Bakkies is the answer, but Lood has not really done himself favours with average performances and then also being the clown that ended the game against the All Blacks by trying to take the outside break next to the tryline. His only option was to cut inside, even though that Hougaard should never have passed to him anyway.Stats do not mention that Hougaard and Lood Foot combined to through the match away. 
MO
Mozart
Captain49,914 posts
MO
MozartCaptain49,914 posts
24 Sept 2014, 17:21
#8
24 Sept 2014, 17:21#8
Bye bye Lomp. I guess he did run sideways and get dumped into touch to lose the test in a mistake as bad as Morne's missed touch. HM is nothing if not consistent.
PA
Pakie
Captain17,321 posts
PA
PakieCaptain17,321 posts
24 Sept 2014, 17:25
#9
24 Sept 2014, 17:25#9
As I said a few weeks ago, Lood will quietly disappear from test rugby within the next season (if he's not gone already) never to be heard from again. By the measure of test locks, he is too soft. Maybe he develops some grit over the coming years, but I won't count on it.
BO
BokBF
Club Pro421 posts
BO
BokBFClub Pro421 posts
24 Sept 2014, 17:38
#10
24 Sept 2014, 17:38#10
 

Dropping Lood for Bakkies is possibly his poorest selection to date. I agree that Lood has been a passenger in almost all of his tests to date and to be pushed into touch by Barrett was embarrassing. However we need to be thinking about RWC 2015 and Bakkies (lets all hope) should not be there.

Lood needs to be given as much game time as possible to grow a pair and harden up.

I am happy for Matfield to be in the mix as I feel he does add to the squad.

 

Hogat gets another cap….where has the pride gone in the Jersey. I can only shake me head in disbelief.

SA
Saffolk
Captain30,741 posts
SA
Saffolk Captain30,741 posts
24 Sept 2014, 17:43
#11
24 Sept 2014, 17:43#11
 

The team is as follows:-


15 Willie le Roux,  14 Cornal Hendricks,  13 Jan Serfontein,  12 Jean de Villiers (c),  11 Bryan Habana,  10 Handré Pollard,  9 Francois Hougaard,  8 Duane Vermeulen,  7 Teboho “Oupa” Mohoje,  6 Marcell Coetzee,  5 Victor Matfield,  4 Eben Etzebeth,  3 Jannie du Plessis,  2 Adriaan Strauss,  1 Tendai Mtawarira


Replacements:


16 Bismarck du Plessis,  17 Trevor Nyakane,  18 Marcel van der Merwe,  19 Bakkies Botha,  20  Schaklk Burger,  21 Cobus Reinach,  22 Pat Lambie,  23 JP Pietersen

 

JP on the wing, Serfontein at 12, de Allende at 13, Jacques du Plessis ahead of Oupa, Willemse ahead of Matfield, with Willemse at 4 and Etzebeth at 5 and Marcel ahead of Jannie, Lood ahead of Bakkies, Carr ahead of Burger and Bismark should be starting.

 

I also am not convinced about Hendricks, he has finished nicely but his defence is poor and I think players like Kolbe, v/Wyk, Senatla  and Sithole are better



SA
Saffolk
Captain30,741 posts
SA
Saffolk Captain30,741 posts
24 Sept 2014, 17:45
#12
24 Sept 2014, 17:45#12
Agreed Moz, Meyer is consistently useless  
OI
oimatey
Pro1,870 posts
OI
oimateyPro1,870 posts
24 Sept 2014, 17:48
#13
24 Sept 2014, 17:48#13
Solid team. Boks should spank the Wallabies.
Tight 5 has been so much better since Strauss and Matfield started. Embarrasing set pieces in Argie tests became strengths. Leave Bismarck on the bench to fester a little more - it will do him good.
Scrumhalf continues to be the weak point as was predicted when FDP went down. Can't blame Meyer for going with Hougaard but would not be surprised if Reinach came on at the half depending on how the game is going.
Meyer being smart and playing politics as all good Bok coaches have to with the Oupa selection. Who knows though, Hendricks was a much maligned "Cheetahs bench player" Meyer selection who has made the starting wing position opposite Habana his own and proven to be a fantastic finisher - rising high on the recent rank of wings by many here. Still thinks he lacks aerial skills necessary which has been one of the issues with our lack of pressure in the kicking game but maybe that will come as they did with Savea. 
Habana, JDV and LeRoux all need to step up - been far too quiet. That happens and we walk this test easily.

CL
clevermike
Coach57,555 posts
CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
24 Sept 2014, 18:03
#14
24 Sept 2014, 18:03#14
 Sharkbok
Herre are De Jagers stats as requested - like the other players I only provide the stats if the locks played 40 + minutes:-
Wales
de Jager0/000/0/73000011/10/100/0
Scotland
de Jager2/1100/1/856100017/15/100/0
Argentina
de Jager0/000/1/4000006/65/010/0
De Jager doid not do well enough in the Argentina test - but the forwards all look bad - because of the pathetic scrumming and ball recovery situation - but he was instrumental in the rolling maul try - which was saving our bacon.
I took th ree tests of Botha and the only three of DE Jager - and De jager worked ten times harder than Botha did and produced twice the results.   


PA
Pakie
Captain17,321 posts
PA
PakieCaptain17,321 posts
24 Sept 2014, 18:11
#15
24 Sept 2014, 18:11#15
Worked ten times harder for only twice the results? That's not very efficient.
CL
clevermike
Coach57,555 posts
CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
24 Sept 2014, 18:12
#16
24 Sept 2014, 18:12#16
 oimatey
With respect - Matfield's roole in the Tight  5 is a negative.  Our Tight  5 was Ok last year - this year they collapsed in a heap in virtually all games.   That is one reason for our rugby being deeriorating since last year.   All results in the RC showed that detrioration clearly.  
I have serious doubt about Hendricks - his defense and unreliabiliy under high balls are two negatives that can  bite as badly.
I think that the elderly playes like two of th e three mentioned have gone down thisyear and I cannot see them getting back to alst  years level at all.   
I have a bad feeling about the test on Saturday - and I do think that Meyer has botched up some selections.         
AJ
Arthur John
Pro1,748 posts
AJ
Arthur JohnPro1,748 posts
24 Sept 2014, 18:15
#17
24 Sept 2014, 18:15#17
 All I wish to say is:
Don't expect any success at  WC2015.
Shocking selection.
MO
MonsterBok
Club Pro442 posts
MO
MonsterBokClub Pro442 posts
24 Sept 2014, 18:17
#18
24 Sept 2014, 18:17#18
This team is lame, is this the best South Africa has to offer. 3,5,9 are sh!thouse and need to be culled badly. We'll see how long grandpa lasts before they bring geriatric Burger on. Is this a f**king retirement competition? And they'll bring Bizzie on to be the passenger he' been for some time now.They won't cull JDV because he's captain of the world.Willie, Habana and JDV need to wake up or f**koff!
CE
Ceradyne
Pro9,374 posts
CE
CeradynePro9,374 posts
24 Sept 2014, 18:20
#19
24 Sept 2014, 18:20#19
 "De Jager doid not do well enough in the Argentina test - but the forwards all look bad - because of the pathetic scrumming and ball recovery situation - but he was instrumental in the rolling maul try - which was saving our bacon."

He was also instrumental in waving the Arg scrumhalf through for a try......


@Pakie.
"Worked ten times harder for only twice the results? That's not very efficient."

Well spotted.
CL
clevermike
Coach57,555 posts
CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
24 Sept 2014, 18:30
#20
24 Sept 2014, 18:30#20
 Bullshit zeromoron
We'll discssuss this isue further on Saturday.   


sharkbok
sharkbok
Captain23,294 posts
sharkbok
sharkbokCaptain23,294 posts
24 Sept 2014, 18:43
#21
24 Sept 2014, 18:43#21
Lets just get rid of the whole team and replace them with a whole lot of new players that are not test level. The old players in particular must be dropped, even if it was the current young players such as Lood Foot and Hougaard that screwed up the best chance of winning the game. 



OI
oimatey
Pro1,870 posts
OI
oimateyPro1,870 posts
24 Sept 2014, 19:06
#22
24 Sept 2014, 19:06#22
Yea Mike, I know how you feel about Matfield and I'm wasting my breath trying to convince you otherwise , but I just don't see it. He's never been known as a physical lock so you can't expect that now but what he does bring is leadership, experience and set-piece prowess especially at kick-offs and line-outs. He is widely regarded by most experts as the best in the world at that. The difference in the overall play of the Bok pack when he was out against the Argies vs when he was in against Aus/NZ was significant. Frankly, the pack has been carrying the team as the backline has for the most part been out of sync and in lala land.
The Boks two best games scrummaging game this RC have been with Matfield at lock. If he was even half as physically deficient as is claimed that would not have been the case. Besides, scrumming and a lot of other aspects of forward play is more about technique and cohesiveness than it is about weight and brute strength. Lood has terrible technique. Far too upright. Once the emotional bluster and adrenaline from his first Bok appearances wore off his technique was exposed.

Would like to see this guy come back into the fold though:



The one in Yellow !!
CE
Ceradyne
Pro9,374 posts
CE
CeradynePro9,374 posts
24 Sept 2014, 19:20
#23
24 Sept 2014, 19:20#23
 
clevermike

Status: Hall Of Fame
Posts: 13063 RE: Springbok Team for Saturday
September 24, 2014, 16:30:10  Bull[removed] zeromoron
We'll discssuss this isue further on Saturday.   



Why Saturday? Do you want a reminder/link to where it was discussed at length? You will probably need it because that is another thread where rode off into the sunset again.
NT
ntanga
Club Pro336 posts
NT
ntangaClub Pro336 posts
24 Sept 2014, 20:11
#24
24 Sept 2014, 20:11#24
 I'll reserve my judgement till Saturday, the Boks might win this but they have to do it in style.  
SA
Saffolk
Captain30,741 posts
SA
Saffolk Captain30,741 posts
24 Sept 2014, 21:24
#25
24 Sept 2014, 21:24#25
 Oi matey you have to be a complete idiot to conclude that the Bok tight five has improved since the inclusion of Matfield. What utter bloody garbage.
CL
clevermike
Coach57,555 posts
CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
24 Sept 2014, 22:09
#26
24 Sept 2014, 22:09#26
 Zeromoron
That team is about the worst Meyer could come up with.   I do not think they have a snowballs chance in hell to win on Saturday.  That is why I prefer not to discuss tthis lot Meyer calls a team before Saturday.   I may get insulting.
   
CL
clevermike
Coach57,555 posts
CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
24 Sept 2014, 22:18
#27
24 Sept 2014, 22:18#27
 oimatey
Which were those two games when the scrummaging was acceptable.   I guess the F rst Welsh test and the Scottish test.    For the rest the scrums ranged from average to extremely poor.   The World team game with Matfield and Botha at lock, the scrumming was a disgrace.   In Australia it started off well and disintegrated - same against New Zealand.
The problrem is not this year and what happened when Matfield played a or did not play.   Poor scrumming this year - comparative to last year can at best be described as very poor.   
As to line outs - not so optimistic as you poeple are.   That last line out against the All Blacks was intended as a start for a rolling maul.   Matfield fumbled the ball and the opportunity was gone.   
He does take line outs - but at times it was not clean balls and the  Aussies in particular manage to force rucks when Mtfield was jumping for the ball.   
sharkbok
sharkbok
Captain23,294 posts
sharkbok
sharkbokCaptain23,294 posts
24 Sept 2014, 22:18
#28
24 Sept 2014, 22:18#28
Meyer said that: "We felt we needed a "couple of cool" and experienced heads late in our matches and that is where Bakkies, Schalk, JP, Pat Lambie and Bismarck du Plessis will play a vital role - all of them have more than 30 caps."
So Lood Foot is considered a "hot head" because he messed up the best chance of winning the game against the All Blacks by trying to take the impossible outside gap that allowed wee Barrett to push him out. 
A "cooler head" would have ran inside towards his support players so as to not get isolated when he was tackled to ground. 
It must be embarrassing to think of Brainless Bakkies as a "cooler head" than your own....
CL
clevermike
Coach57,555 posts
CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
24 Sept 2014, 22:23
#29
24 Sept 2014, 22:23#29
Shakbok
 Meyer has buggered up badly with the selections this time around.   Not that he was any better in the last two tests.   The Aussie test Morne bbuggere up - the AB test it was a mixtrure between Hougaard, De Villiers and Matfield.
Now letas get back to the "cool heads".   Problem is the cool heads are not eprforming so what is the use of those cool heads or is oit to cosole the otherplayers after another loss???  
      
CE
Ceradyne
Pro9,374 posts
CE
CeradynePro9,374 posts
24 Sept 2014, 22:42
#30
24 Sept 2014, 22:42#30
  clevermike

Status: Hall Of Fame
Posts: 13068 RE: Springbok Team for Saturday
September 24, 2014, 20:09:50  Zeromoron
That team is about the worst Meyer could come up with.   I do not think they have a snowballs chance in hell to win on Saturday.  That is why I prefer not to discuss tthis lot Meyer calls a team before Saturday.   I may get insulting.

So, the bottom line is that you are not prepared to revisit Loodvoet's showing in Argentina. Correct?


MO
Mozart
Captain49,914 posts
MO
MozartCaptain49,914 posts
24 Sept 2014, 23:08
#31
24 Sept 2014, 23:08#31
HM should ignore all the opinions and choose who he thinks will win the game....and he is. All these other experts know zip and arent half as loyal to the cause. Old style Bok loyalty is out of the window. Oupa may be the exception where HM had to accept political reality , but I'm optimistic. Go Boks! 
CL
clevermike
Coach57,555 posts
CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
25 Sept 2014, 01:04
#32
25 Sept 2014, 01:04#32
 Neither are the morons prpeared to revisit the despicable performances of players like Bakkies Both.
Mozart
We will have a nice discussion o n  Saturday night about this coming game.  
CE
Ceradyne
Pro9,374 posts
CE
CeradynePro9,374 posts
25 Sept 2014, 01:30
#33
25 Sept 2014, 01:30#33
Bakkies didn't wave through an Argentinian scrummie to score a try. Let me tell you ou Maaikie, Bakkies cannot be as kak as Loodvoet was in that test in Argentina, even if he tried.
SA
Saffolk
Captain30,741 posts
SA
Saffolk Captain30,741 posts
25 Sept 2014, 03:06
#34
25 Sept 2014, 03:06#34
Bakkies has been useless in his return to test rugby....utterly useless.
But alas we have some idiots on here who will tell us Meyer knows what he is doing even though we have lost once again
HA
hakwa
Pro4,146 posts
HA
hakwaPro4,146 posts
25 Sept 2014, 03:45
#35
25 Sept 2014, 03:45#35
 Boks should win this one
MO
Mozart
Captain49,914 posts
MO
MozartCaptain49,914 posts
25 Sept 2014, 04:13
#36
25 Sept 2014, 04:13#36
Bakkies was the consensus MOM against the Worlds...Sapp is behind the times again.
CL
clevermike
Coach57,555 posts
CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
25 Sept 2014, 06:13
#37
25 Sept 2014, 06:13#37
 Mozart
That was because Botha managed to score a try and afterwards went AWOL.   Was bloody poor as a matterof fact and MOM means nothing - is normally based on one incident in any event.   Dare I remind you of our scrumming performance in that game? 
And what was he in the rest of the games he played in?   He was piss- poor against the Welsh and was replaced by  De Jager who did five times the work Botha did.         
MO
moolaa
Pro2,380 posts
MO
moolaaPro2,380 posts
25 Sept 2014, 06:36
#38
25 Sept 2014, 06:36#38

 Pretty average looking Bok side. Starting to show exactly why they've struggled at times recently; it's all down to a serious lack of depth in SA rugby, despite your huge playing numbers compared to Oz & NZ.

Still, they should be too good for an even more average side in Oz.

MO
Mozart
Captain49,914 posts
MO
MozartCaptain49,914 posts
25 Sept 2014, 07:36
#39
25 Sept 2014, 07:36#39
 So now being chosen as the MOM means nothing....especially when you are on the defensive because you declared Lomp to be the  next big thing. It must be embarrassing. Or it would be if you weren't too much of an imbecile to figure out what has just gone down
CL
clevermike
Coach57,555 posts
CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
25 Sept 2014, 12:25
#40
25 Sept 2014, 12:25#40
Mozart the Moron
What is emnbarrassing is  your praising of a failed player after the Scotds test last year and  your support of a player who has been way below par in the tests he played the past year.   Same as the fact that  you ignore stats when it does not fit your book and use then otherwise.
Your ideas about rugby is BS and I suggest you start p raying for a Springbok victory on Saturday - if they lose your embarrassment will be complete.      


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