Stormers without De Jongh against Bulls

The following from news24:-
"Stormers co-captain Juan de Jongh has suffered a hamstring injury which will see him miss out on their Super Rugby derby match against the Bulls at Loftus Versfeld on Saturday.

De Jongh, who did not run at full pace during the Sunwolves match last week, has sustained a grade one hamstring strain but is likely to be sidelined for only one week.

The Cape outfit's head coach Robbie Fleck admits that De Jongh had not been pushed in the build-up to the 17-all draw against the Sunwolves in Singapore last week.

"Like I said from Singapore the day after the game, Juan was struggling with the injury a bit during the Sunwolves game," Fleck told reporters.  "He couldn’t run to his full potential. He was battling with it a bit in the build-up to the game but we thought he would be able to play with it.

"It is one of those borderline injuries where you can play at a push.

"But this is an important game for us and obviously we’d like to have our strongest team available for it. So it is a big blow."

Injury to front-row JC Janse van Rensburg, as well, has added insult to injury for Fleck with an ever-growing list of players that are already on the sidelines due to lengthy lay-offs.

The former Lions prop, who will most likely be replaced by Oli Kebble in the starting XV, has been ruled out for up to three months following a knee injury.

Some good news for the Stormers is that Springbok lock powerhouse Eben Etzebeth and the returning-from-suspension wing Leolin Zas will both be back for this week's vital match.

"Eben is definitely ready to go again," Fleck said.

"And it is always good to have a player back from injury or suspension so it is good to have Leolin back in the mix too.

"It is a pity that Juan isn’t playing as the battle between our midfield and their Bok midfield of Jan Serfontein and Jesse Kriel would have been an interesting one.

"But it is what it is and these things happen in rugby."

Did De Jongh actually played against the Sunwolves or did he go AWOL as happened so often in the past?   De Jongh is no loss to the Stormers and his presence would only have disrupted the Stormers backline and assisted Kriel in looking good.  

  

Jessie Kriel is the best outside centre since Gerber- according to Saffex Heineken Meyer
He needs to move to wing or somewhere else- as he has limited effect at 13
The Stormers backline was looking good a few games ago- but has now returned to being poor. 
Jonny Kotze is a prop playing as a backline player- and Who Jones is not much better- where ever he is now

 I can remember a game against the Hurricanes in 2015 against the Hurricanes where De Jongh did not play and Jones did a much better job at 13 than De Jongh did in all matches for the preceding 3 years.  

 Jesse Kreil has done very well this season. BIG improvement in his passing game.He must be in the reckoning for the Boks.

 Yes he probably is ... but then again so is Ruan Pienaar, Beast, Jannie, Kirschner, Kolisi as well as Morne Steyn
Most of the obvious talents will be left out ... as always ... 
So if we're going to have a team of chumps, why not include Jesse Kriel ... he'll fit right in. 

Take a look at Jesse  Kriel vs Horne last weekend......5 to 15 metres by Horne in the tackle, every time. JJ redux.

 Mozart - I promised not to respond to BS - but just want to remind you that Horne played on the wing - Folau was the no 13 center.  So did Kriel had to defend against both the 13 center and 11 wing? 
However, we discussed two centers above - De Jongh's stats against the sunwolves were really sick - so n o comments other than to say what happened is standard AWOL  by your favourite center.
Just for clarification - please.     

i dont like kreil in the centers, but hes a class fullback which i think is his best position.
its ok for him to moonlight in the centres during super rugby, but for the Boks he should play 15.
his fullback instincts are very natural.

ive also never had a problem with de jong at centre, i wouldnt pick him there for the Boks with all the talent available there, but if there was a spate of injuries, wouldnt have any problems with him filling in the role.

he can as mikey pointed out go AWOL from time to time, but everyone does. he dosent as mikey pointed out go AWOL every single time though.

mikey, pls stop staring daggers at me,

Naruto, ou Maaik has been waging a hate campaign against Juan de Jongh for as long as de Jongh has been playing.

I'm with you, I think he's bit small for test rugby but I wouldn't look for anyone else to be a stopgap if the Boks have injuries.

I've learned there's really no point in arguing with ou Maaik when it comes to players like Juan de Jongh, Willem Alberts or Victor Matfield. The chances of ou Maaik changing his mind about those players is roughly equal to the chances of of Alutwat/Desert Fool/Gonzo the Gimp singing the praises of Patrick Lambie.

   I was just asking a fair question.

 Well said Rooi....and I suppose we all have our pet hates/blind spots.

Yes, we all have blind spots. Mine is Skulk. I see a slow, cu. mbersome plodder who can't bust a tackle getting in the way of every backline move . . . you guys all see this mega-talented superstar winning games just by pitching up. 
I recognize I'm in the minority which is why I'm calling it a blind spot but I just don't get the fuss about Skulk. I reckon he's lost us two RWC knockout games effectively doing his impersonation of an unfit donkey playing flyhalf.

 I'm going to take the leaf you never took out of your book and not respond to nonsense Tokkie.

 You spoke about Horne and Kriel opposing him - yet Horne played on the  wing and Kriel at center,   If you said the players involved were Folau and Kriel your statement could have had some merit - but Kriel and Horne represent a totally clouded up statement.     

Oh I see, you apparently think there is a rule that only opposing players in the line up can tackle each other....I sense another Mong humiliation about to happen. 

 Mozart
I was just trying to save you from embarrassment by pointing out an anomaly in your statement.   Nobody says that "only opposing players in the line up can tackle each other" - but it is normal in 80% or more that that would be the case.  
That effectively means that Kriel - who made 10 tackles in the game under discussion and missed 2 - probably made circa 2 attempted tackles on Horne - which removed the situation from the generalized statement "Take a look at Jesse  Kriel vs Horne last weekend......5 to 15 metres by Horne in the tackle, every time. JJ redux."   That statement would have had merit if it happened that most of the tackles made by Kriel produced the result you said was the case,  Exceptions should never be the case to prove something.
You unfortunately made a reference to Engelbrecht as well and a similar statement made iro of Engelbrecht and De Jongh came to mind.  At least De Jongh was an opposing center - which Horne was not.  However, what you described in that case happening was physically proven to be impossible, taking into account the territorial gain of De Jongh in that match.
I also think Kriel was very average in the Super Rugby games  he played in this year - but I prefer to use realistic comments on such issues.    

 I never said he missed the tackle....I said it took him 5 to 15 metres to get Horne to the deck. Now go and look at the game and tell me I'm wrong,  with appropriate time stamps. And if you aren't willing to do that, just cork it.

 Mozart
If it happens in one case - it never is never "every time" as alleged by you.   However, I prefer to stick to facts - not prejudice and distortions.  

So you can't meet the challenge...no surprise there.

 This is ridiculous - there is no challenge.   I pointed out to you that you have made a statement that "every time" was not the right word to be used in this case - since tackles by Kriel (a center) of Horne (a wing) was the exception to the rule and if you claimed that it happened every time the tackle had been of Folau - your statement would have substantial merit.
However, you went further and referred back to a match involving Engelbrecht and De Jongh - where you were caught out as being peddling a lie.   It was at the time proven that statistically it was impossible for it to happen as you were using the "every time" fib in that case too.
       

Follow the bouncing ball.....I'm saying Kriel had to tackle Horne several times, and every time he failed to put him to the deck without Horne making 5 to 15 metres. You are welcome to disprove this with time stamped incidents....failing that shut up.

 How many is several times - twice?  You have distorted things so often in the past - it would not be worthwhile to trust you in this case as well.  

Bulls by 5 points  

 Might be Devil Dude, especially with WP's loosies. I would have preferred Elstadt starting. WP by 10.

By a the skin of their teeth actually, but we live in hope!

Devil's Advocate
 
Status: Bok regular 
Posts: 1216RE: Stormers without De Jongh against Bulls
May 19, 2016, 17:00:02

Bulls by 5 points 

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