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FORUM / RUGBY /  The Boks can rule on the ground.......

The Boks can rule on the ground.......

Started by Mozart55 REPLIES942 VIEWS· 22 Jul 2019, 17:06
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MO
MozartCaptain49,914 posts
22 Jul 2019, 17:06
#1
22 Jul 2019, 17:06#1
With Marx, Louw and Vermeulen....we have three of the 10 or so best fetchers on the planet. Put Kwagga at open side and you have another fetching option. Kwagga also adds out wide coverage which balances the tighter game played by Louw and Vermeulen. What that group lacks is a high volume hard yards runner....like Schalk. But perhaps that model has been supplanted by better ball movement.....exemplified by the brilliant offloading of RG Snyman. Still the Boks, even sans Marx and Vermeulen dominated Oz's Hooper on the ground because of Louw and , you haven't heard this from the fake media, because of the massive increase in physicality Elstadt provided over the too often disengaged Kolisi.
CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
22 Jul 2019, 17:39
#2
22 Jul 2019, 17:39#2

Louw - what a farce - he may be on the bench Saturday.   Was a liability last year in the AB  Springbok game last year, .   

MO
MozartCaptain49,914 posts
22 Jul 2019, 17:52
#3
22 Jul 2019, 17:52#3
Last liability I remember was old Stephanie falling over his own feet and pulling down Koch, conceding the penalty that led to the losing try.
MO
MozartCaptain49,914 posts
22 Jul 2019, 17:58
#4
22 Jul 2019, 17:58#4
Ja well maybe that wasn't 'ruling on the ground' more like 'rolling on the ground'....hahaha.
AU
AugenöffnerPro6,974 posts
22 Jul 2019, 18:03
#5
22 Jul 2019, 18:03#5

Louw was very good in that game. 

@Moz: Agreed. Disrupting their flow of possession will go a long way to winning this test. I am worried about team defence though. The All Blacks are clearly in decline, but they still have immense strike power. Far more so than the Wallabies.

sharkbok
sharkbokCaptain23,250 posts
22 Jul 2019, 18:06
#6
22 Jul 2019, 18:06#6
The breakdowns are an anomaly, depending on how a referee sees it. 
The pitches should be hard and fast in Japan, which should favour Southern Hemisphere teams. However, most referees will be from the Northern Hemisphere which should favour Northern Hemisphere teams- who are used to more competition at the breakdown, and less strict rules for entering from the side of the ruck. 
Having Marx and Vermeulen in the team is great, as they are allrounders - both are carriers and fetchers. Francis Low is also physical for a fetcher and can have a very high tackle count. I would agree that these 3 are all the top 10 fetchers in world rugby. 
Kwagga could also bring some pace and linking with the backs, as well as fetching ability. He could be very effective on a fast pitch like Japan. (I would not select him for a mud bath European EOYT tour). 
CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
22 Jul 2019, 18:18
#7
22 Jul 2019, 18:18#7

Sure knocking on the ball five meters out was very good and could have gibven the AB;s victory in that game..  Unpleasa nt reminder for the two of you.  

AU
AugenöffnerPro6,974 posts
22 Jul 2019, 18:28
#8
22 Jul 2019, 18:28#8

If you want to revisit the Wellington test we can review the defensive lapses of Damian and Steph. Remember those? Both allowing lethal bursts through the Bok defence. 

Then the home test. Louw was fantastic. You said it would never happen, but it did, just so we can see your nose reach new heights. 

BE
Beeno1Captain40,032 posts
22 Jul 2019, 18:57
#9
22 Jul 2019, 18:57#9

All this tedious vendetta against the world class, best no 7 in world rugby Du Toit must stop. How much more embarrassment can some oaks take. 

As of this moment Allende remains the best 12 in SA. Nobody has todate shown themselves to be better. 

If somebody better than Allende turns up Rassie will make the change. Unlike some Rassie knows what he is doing. 

Organhuffer has analyzed himself into a position of weird confusion. 

Dr Moz clearly didn't fix the faulty mozcroscope. The lens has numerous cracks and a thick film hindering observations. Hahahahahaha. 

Fancy trashing the best 7 in world rugby. A world class player. Beeno and Mallet on the same page. Also, under that post re Ten Points for the Boks the writer says Steph would walk into any test team. Obviously but not to all unfortunately. 

Organhuffer Juan Smith was a poor man's Steph Du Toit. Simply not the athlete and powerhouse Steph is. 

Your visit to the optician is long overdue Organhuffer. Lense problems are troubling some posters here. Hahahahahahaha. 


CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
22 Jul 2019, 19:06
#10
22 Jul 2019, 19:06#10

Louw was excellent in the Pretoria test by doing next to nothing and conceding 4 possession turnovers and a penalty as well.   

I am sure that you and Mozart will identify shortcomings in Du Toit and invent some real beauties as is your custom - but never anything of substance done positively by you pet hate players,   Even if nobody else in the world could found reason to blame a player.  After all - Mozart at one stage last year claimed that the three f you - Mozart. AO and Pakie - fiound thongs in rugby performance analysis that nobody else ever looked at.  

Your essential comments are not worth reading - useless concoctions at best.       

AU
AugenöffnerPro6,974 posts
22 Jul 2019, 19:10
#11
22 Jul 2019, 19:10#11

Damian is 6 years into his test career and still waiting for that breakout game. The Lambie of this generation. Damian isn't even a 12, he is a wing out of position. This player craves space. Note his lateral runs cramping the outside backs into the touchline. Sometimes he offloads to a poor soul who is swallowed up by several defenders. I'm still waiting for him to make a dominant tackle. 

Steph has his good and bad games. He lacks mobility for 7, which is exposed time and again. As a ball carrier, he isn't very penetrative. He also dies with most of that ball. He wasn't the best 7 last year, the year before that, or the year before that. He wasn't the best flank in super rugby this year, he was the 17th best flank. He is nowhere near the best flankers in world rugby. 

You make Damian and Lood your primary carriers and you end up with staccato phase play which is easily absorbed and defended, with little distribution. 

CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
22 Jul 2019, 19:19
#12
22 Jul 2019, 19:19#12

Look at the lead up to the De Jager try on Saturday - he lacks mobility. LMAO  

This from an idiot who supported the slower than a prop Alberts at 7 LMAO  

AU
AugenöffnerPro6,974 posts
22 Jul 2019, 19:25
#13
22 Jul 2019, 19:25#13

Alberts ran over players. He also demanded the attention of several defenders. As a decoy alone he was a nightmare before his injury in 2014. A very powerful ruck presence too. 

Steph rushes out of the line and is left flat-footed. Alberts, despite his size, was mobile enough to defend in the outer channels, even against New Zealand.

It's been a tough few days for you . Here, have a cookie. 


CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
22 Jul 2019, 19:49
#14
22 Jul 2019, 19:49#14

Alberts ran over player and on average made 2,2 meters per carry - LMAO..  Probably better to say he walked over players - running was slightly out of norm with him.

May I ask you a simple question?   Do you ever think before you write unsubstantiated BS on site?  It makes you look utterly ridiculous and stupid you know. 

CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
22 Jul 2019, 19:50
#15
22 Jul 2019, 19:50#15


AU
AugenöffnerPro6,974 posts
23 Jul 2019, 07:18
#16
23 Jul 2019, 07:18#16

Whichever way you slice it, Alberts was our last great blindside flank. No other flank has given us that level of momentum since 2014. In terms of speed, Steph can hardly be considered a speedster himself! Even worse, his slow acceleration and mobility in changing direction. Once he commits to a movement, he cannot readjust himself quickly enough. Hence the perpetual draw-pass that we see along the fringes. 

CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
23 Jul 2019, 08:20
#17
23 Jul 2019, 08:20#17

The worst prop or maybe lock that pretended to play as a flank and you claim that he was the best,  The guy who  never knew the meaning of ball protection and recovery and who never made a turnover at breakdowns.  

Mozart once gave the following explanation for the selection of Alberts:-

Matfield was the best line-out jumper in  the world - but his contribution outside of line-outs to the Tight 5 was not strong enough - so Alberts had to be in the team to off-set that.

Crazy - but true.  You have a player who could not perform properly as a Lock and one who could not perform properly as a loosie in the team.   Always one player short in the team nd you call Alberts the best - crazy but true,   Ask Read how easy it was to beat Alberts on the fringes.       .

AU
AugenöffnerPro6,974 posts
23 Jul 2019, 10:05
#18
23 Jul 2019, 10:05#18

You lambaste Alberts for security and recovery, for not winning turnovers? What do you think Steph does? Clean rucks? Win turnovers? You stepped over your planks again! 

CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
23 Jul 2019, 11:27
#19
23 Jul 2019, 11:27#19

Steph in one match made more turnovers than Alberts did in his career.   Easy to combat Steph did make a number of turnovers in games conveniently ignored by you and the other Idiot Speakers.   

AU
AugenöffnerPro6,974 posts
23 Jul 2019, 11:30
#20
23 Jul 2019, 11:30#20

You mean like the 5 turnovers you rejected by Louw last season? 

CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
23 Jul 2019, 14:12
#21
23 Jul 2019, 14:12#21

Listen dimness

I never rejected them - but Louw's turnovers are normally few and far between - 5 in 11 matches played.   His other aspects of play is normally just a bout average and nothing special.

SA
Saffolk Captain30,741 posts
23 Jul 2019, 19:27
#22
23 Jul 2019, 19:27#22
Louw effected one turnover and did stuff all else. So over rated. Vermeulen is past it, Dan du Preez outplayed him most weeks and Marcel Coetzee has been even better than Dan
AU
AugenöffnerPro6,974 posts
23 Jul 2019, 20:43
#23
23 Jul 2019, 20:43#23

Coetzee was weak. Actually, even worse than his previous failed stints for the Boks. This is a player I have been watching up north. Duane is many times the player Coetzee could ever be. A quiet game from Duane surpasses the laboured and strained best of Coetzee. Louw was the best loose forward in the last test. He, along with Whiteley and Duane, was the best loose forward on the EOYT last year. In fact, those three popped up more often among the best Boks than the likes of Steph and Kolisi. 

As for Dan? I think he'd be a significant improvement on the out of position Steph at 7. 

MO
MozartCaptain49,914 posts
23 Jul 2019, 21:08
#24
23 Jul 2019, 21:08#24
Marcel Coetzee was soooo slow, the lad looks like he was made up for the potato famine. What a porker. Dan du Preez is too stupid to play test rugby, his cranium is very small. Louw and Vermeulen are in a different league to these bog ordinary players.
SA
Saffolk Captain30,741 posts
23 Jul 2019, 21:39
#25
23 Jul 2019, 21:39#25
Oh wow so how on earth did Coetzee display his lack of speed given at no point did we see him operate in space. So being muscle bound is now a porker - Moz you need to upgrade those glasses. Louw has always been bog ordinary. Vermeulen was great in his day he is now just a slow oaf. Dan outplayed Vermeulen for most of the season and that’s a fact so how is it possible that on current form Vermeulen is better than Dan?
AU
AugenöffnerPro6,974 posts
23 Jul 2019, 22:10
#26
23 Jul 2019, 22:10#26

Hi carries lacked punch, just as they did with Ulster. We saw him in space on one carry deep in Wallaby territory. Louw has always been better. 

Dan had obscene possession stats, but Duane was the more productive carrier per carry and the more dynamic player.

@Moz: You're right, he isn't one of our brightest, but his explosive power and ability to offload upgrades Steph. I think we can live with that at 7. We still haven't seen Mostert at 7 though. Rassie is assessing/including many of the wrong players in my opinion. 

SA
Saffolk Captain30,741 posts
23 Jul 2019, 23:49
#27
23 Jul 2019, 23:49#27
Aug as per usual you are speaking horse shit. He had one carry and took 2 or 3 defenders with him you liar. You clearly have not watched a single Ulster game you liar Moz if you want evidence of slow look no further than Vermeulen’s long range try mid season - while great that he got to the tryline but hell it was both amusing and painful to watch.
MO
MozartCaptain49,914 posts
24 Jul 2019, 00:35
#28
24 Jul 2019, 00:35#28
Ja it was painful......for the opposing wing who finally closed the couple of metres gap after 60 metres, and then got monstered!
CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
24 Jul 2019, 11:54
#29
24 Jul 2019, 11:54#29

Sure the assessments of the identified Idiot Speakers are always balls-ups and totally so.  They lie and scrap the truth all the time.   

SA
Saffolk Captain30,741 posts
24 Jul 2019, 14:23
#30
24 Jul 2019, 14:23#30
Moz as I said you need new glasses bud. If Coetzee is slow Vermeulen must be going backwards
PA
PakieCaptain17,321 posts
24 Jul 2019, 16:13
#31
24 Jul 2019, 16:13#31

By my calculation, until he reached the 22 and the wing started interfering, Duane had covered 38m in 4.97 (make it 5) seconds for a running speed of 28km/h. Don't know what the average loose forward travels at but it certainly didn't look too shabby. Tahs 10 made no ground on him until he started battling with the wing.


AU
AugenöffnerPro6,974 posts
24 Jul 2019, 16:17
#32
24 Jul 2019, 16:17#32

There is nothing wrong with his speed. It's a rather flimsy excuse to omit him. 

SA
Saffolk Captain30,741 posts
24 Jul 2019, 16:27
#33
24 Jul 2019, 16:27#33
Absolute carthorse - I never had an issue with his speed but when posters say Marcel Coetzee is slow I just pointed out this example evidencing what a slow 8 looks like
AU
AugenöffnerPro6,974 posts
24 Jul 2019, 16:30
#34
24 Jul 2019, 16:30#34

Thor is physical. Coetzee is like a nerf ball being thrown by an 80 year old woman into a brick wall. 

SA
Saffolk Captain30,741 posts
24 Jul 2019, 16:33
#35
24 Jul 2019, 16:33#35
Coetzee is more physical than Vermeulen without doubt and has agility and speed which Vermeulen has lost
AU
AugenöffnerPro6,974 posts
24 Jul 2019, 16:35
#36
24 Jul 2019, 16:35#36

Where was that physicality for Ulster, or the Boks on Saturday? More physical than Thor...


SA
Saffolk Captain30,741 posts
24 Jul 2019, 16:43
#37
24 Jul 2019, 16:43#37
The reason Rassie has him in the squad was because of the impression he made for Ulster you idiot. I saw one run by Marcel on Saturday taking 2 or 3 defenders with him, that’s called physicality
AU
AugenöffnerPro6,974 posts
24 Jul 2019, 16:47
#38
24 Jul 2019, 16:47#38

His best run was a bounce off a defender into space and stumbling into contact. 

SA
Saffolk Captain30,741 posts
24 Jul 2019, 16:48
#39
24 Jul 2019, 16:48#39
Bullshit he carried defenders with him as he always does
CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
24 Jul 2019, 17:57
#40
24 Jul 2019, 17:57#40

Just one comment from AO:-

You lambaste Alberts for security and recovery, for not winning turnovers? What do you think Steph does? Clean rucks? Win turnovers? You stepped over your planks again!

I saw Du Toit making 2 turnovers in one test last year - that was just one example.  Prob lem sis you are talking BS continuously stooge.

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