URC: Is it too watered down?

I think most of us on here miss the old days of super 12. We would get up early to watch one of our teams take the might of New Zealand. If like me, we enjoyed the intensity, near test like environment but also had a the flair and expression just to add that little bit of entertainment. 

We had the likes of the Brumbies with Gregan, Larkham and smith. Then there were the Waratahs, always a tough nut to crack and the Reds were formiddable. Most if not all New Zealand teams were tough too. I remember they would the Highlanders home ground the house of pain. Our SA teams were pretty solid too. 

The point I'm getting at is that after 11 rounds of dog fighting we could have a match between no 1 and 12. Still couldn't predict the winner and 12 could or would win. 

Now, I look at how far rugby has regressed. We have log jammed calendars, multiple competitions and every union or board wants their slice for profits. Yet, the game has suffered. We see the boks, and not for the first time field and inexperience team for the sake of development. Super Rugby has come apart at the seems. Then we have European teams that is a constant seesaw. One minute the Tigers are the champs but then the next season gets hammered. 

We look at the stands and the grounds are hardly full. 

Here is my take. As much as I like it, I'm no longer as invested or captivated by rugby like I use to be. I would postpone my wedding just to watch a super rugby game or a test match. But recently I was quite happy not to be home and miss the test match. The same can be said with the URC games where SA is involved. I would just watch the highlights later. Keep track of the score maybe. 

I think like the printing press, the genie is out and we can't get back to where we once were. 

Back to the URC, I think that there are a lot of week teams in the comp. SA and Ireland are probably the only two that have put decent teams out. Then Scotland have taken the rational path and put out 2 competitive teams and not become greedy. Italy is always one of those countries that on the rare off day may surprise you. Yet. they only have one team really that can trouble you. 

Finally, we have the Welsh, for many years were real contenders and alway pushing everyone close. Yet, they have so much infighting at home and hardly anyone showing up at their games. 

What would make the URC better? I for one think of the following. Either cut the amount of teams or create a two tier system like what they did in Japan but not quite. You play for promotion and relegation. The best teams should compete against each other.

I'm just tired watching 2nd string teams being put out. We had the Irish team send weakened teams last year. Now, we have those boks that we have left being rested. 

So we missed out in October having the boks, then there is the Nov tour. Back to December with a month Frantic rugby. Before the competition takes a break in February for the 6 nations. Then it only really picks up momentum in April again and probably the only time to really want to see the games. 

Everything before then is just a numbers games and who has the best squad. The matches are no longer that captivating. 

I wish we had brave administrators that did it for the love of the game on not money. 

However, the players are not faultless either. Japan and France have also devalued there worth and shown that if you dangle enough money, they would be gone. 

My only solution to this problem is for the SA to go back to, if you don't play at home, you will never get selected for the boks. 

Excellent points to end rugby in SA, it will give density to competitions.

I'm enjoying the change of competition and style of rugby.Suppose the cost

of playing against weaker teams must be taken into account,also dismal crowd at the 

Zebre home game too.

Ja, I think the European teams would struggle to keep up + we could field 6 teams easily. 

The SA economy is simply to weak. Could have work if the Rand was stronger and players didn't feel the need to go abroad. 

Not to mention safety factors, that is why Kolbe is staying in France. 

I went back to Cape Town recently, man the place has gone backwards. People now camping on the sidewalks, can't go out at night or for a walk. 

SA has serious problems. 

One of my friends just went back after spending 4 months in the UK. Got a real eye opener. Was always an optimist about SA but now he wants to leave desperately. 

He was one of the lucky ones with a great job, made good money, bought a few properties and did well out of that, but now wants to dump everything in come to the UK

Fundamentally, SA is the problem

Super rugby wasn’t dying….it was killed. Excellent post Corn, I was thinking along similar lines last weekend watching the Bools who so clearly weren’t motivated.

We're basically a banana republic run by crime syndicates now Dave. I wish that was an exaggeration.

We all thought things were going to get better with Zuma gone, but things have gone even further downhill since Cyril took over back in 2017...long before Covid. The new leadership hides their corruption better...talks of Western Cape secession getting louder, but I can't really see that happening...the amount of homelessness and informal settlements are growing exponentially...as does the crime that goes with it. Unemployment rate at 45%...ANC is an utter and complete failure and their cronies have infiltrated every sector of society...going to be almost impossible to fix this.

Draad

If Cera was alive today he 'd say "I told you so".....his words exactly  The new leadership hides their corruption better

Most shockingly, I was having a video chat with my friend and all of a sudden he was in the dark. LOAD SHEDDING, for 2 hours. No idea when it's going to happen. 

What is worse, if you have solar panels, the charge you more than a R1000 a month, a month to generate electricity, with you own capital. 

No, this ANC is a crime syndicate, that extorts and perverts justice to their means. 

People are to hunger, tired and ill to take not what is going on. 

We're basically a banana republic run by crime syndicates now Dave.

And who was running it before.

The whole world talked up the noble perfect black to replace the evil racist white. Now what?

"And who was running it before."

The ones who implemented a racial inequality system...very unfair to the largest part of the population and caused a lot of heartache and pain...they also abolished it after 46 years...

This what-about-tism can't excuse the corruption and incompetence of the current lot though...

So many inversions. That is a sign of times, people finding solace in inverting. That probably is one wayfor them to cope with all theirs contradictions.

Starting with this one:

If the English and URC comps did collapse, would this allow World Rugby to reset and finally implement a global calendar?

So, so, rugby at the moment is a mixed bag of nations that can sustain a domestic league(national leagues) and countries that can not and rely on the international scene to make it.

Added to that, a peculiarity in rugby, international teams are paid by clubs that must release for free players.

A globalistic scheme. Their global competition is paid by nations so that they can pocket profits.

That story of having a global calendar is pushed by this situation.

An irony of some sort: world of rugby must skin the very competitions they live off.

So from an international point of view, the number of teams to be sustained must be lowered.

The international squad and a couple of teams to feed them. That is all. Domestic leagues able to sustain themselves and that answer a domestic demand must shrink, concentrate their wealth on fewer teams to be transfered to the international stage.

Would the French clubs hoover up all the playing talent?

No. They run a quota policy. And second, their domestic league will be reduced in order to make room for the international stage.

International games are very taxing, they demand corporal sacrifice. Players out of them are side lined for weeks.

SA rugby will be added to the former 6Ns, this will put such a pressure on domestic leagues that either they show the middle finger to the internationalists or they submit and recede.

This what-about-tism

And the what aboutism thing.

Pitiful. Nothing in store.

What about questions are among the most important questions to ask.

Asking a what about question reveals nothing.

What about questions do not forcefully refer to side tracking, on the very contrary, they can address core features.

What about questions may be relevant or irrelevant as any other questions.

What is commonly refered as what aboutism covers:

 a weaker form: people speak of apples. What about oranges.

a stronger form: relying on a minor feature to divert.

Example: people speaking about assault on freedom in the US at the start of the republic.

Not being able to set shop on this avenue is painted as a major assault. That is what aboutism.

When speaking of assault on freedom, the only relevant question was what about the slavery of the negroes.

Just as in the case of SA, speaking of the corruption of the previous government is the only relevant question and will remain the only one relevant forever.

Imagine if we still had

The list is the product of the demand from the North. It does not exist without it.

Again, the problem of rugby is that it is played by few nations, and among them, even fewer are able to run sustainbly a domestic league (EN, FR, JA)

If SA rugby had to limit the number of players to match their domestic demand, the number of players in this list would have been diminished by two thirds at least.

Another global scheme and how nations must cripple themselves to support internationalism.

The whole world talked up the noble perfect black to replace the evil racist white. Now what?

People who inherited problems they have no means to solve.

Always the same tune with with people (as a reminder, being white skinned does not mean being a white person, people in Europe were white skinned and they were not white. They did not consider themselves as members of that large global group known as white people)

White people claim they are the most intelligent people in the world history. They transfer problems to their inferiors for theirs inferiors to solve them. How this could work.

White people have set SA on the course of being a larger Kolmanskop. White people have no other solution that transfering the situation to theirs inferiors and enjoying the sight.

Sadistic enjoyment.

The SA economy is simply to weak. Could have work if the Rand was stronger and players didn't feel the need to go abroad.

Of course not.

There should have never been rugby in SA. This sport was forced on a larger population by a minority to make a political statement.

Just as it is now forced on European nations in a sort of chickens coming home to roost backlash.

Thinking that SA rugby could have made it if it was thriving is denial of the situation.

Rugby in Europe is shared by nations that are geographically close. This situation comes with benefits. Like concentration. Rugby nations are concentrated over a small superficy.

Attaching SA rugby to it denies this point. Globalists sell the idea that since European nations do not share the same time line, travelling to SA will be nothing.

An english club going to France suffer one hour jet lag (a very relative one hour by the way as people on the western coast of France are pretty close to the british isles and the jet lag is in fact under the hour, something like 30 minutes)

SA economy, strong or not, could not have compete with the whole economy of the european rugby nations. The density of clubs is too much for a single nation to compete.

.talks of Western Cape secession getting louder, but I can't really see that happening...

That would be something to see. Denial of many things. It could be laughable if the current war against Ukraine would not pinpoint how ludicrous the desire is.

Not to mention safety factors, that is why Kolbe is staying in France.

No. Blatantly incorrect.

Keeping a watch on SA rugby players has allowed to lift certain interrogations.

This player is a SAn as he is greedy as greedy can be. Greed is what governs his loyalty and it is known that loyalty of greedy people goes to the highest of the bidders.

There was never a contract to be considered.

In his current contract, this player earns more money to play fewer games and perform less.

That is all.

This player is a fine example of how SA rugby players burden their team.

This player was offered a fine contract by a SA rugby side yet to come with more strings attached.

The contract was less rewarding.

The contract represented more of the franchise pay roll (in his current club, he is a top earner but without concentrating too much of the pay on himself, other players are paid lavishly, meaning less pressure)

Consequently, he is allowed to play fewer games and perform less without being reduced to the chunk of the wage bill spent on him.

This player was injured during international duty (international duty paid for by his current club) He has not played a single game since then.

He might return to fitness to take up his November international duties and the irony would be for him to get injured during the games.

The SA franchise not only would have paid him less but would have expected way more from him. He would have been expected to play many games and perform them to reflect the fact that maybe 30 per cent of the wage bill was spent on him.

Safety concern was brought to the table as this guy has not the backbone to tell that well, he is greedy.

as the wealth in the European game has attracted so many southern hemisphere players, diluting our comps to the point of breaking them.

No. SA rugby was tasked to bring rugby to Africa. A major failure.

SA rugby is a peculiar case. Playing rugby means partnering and SA rugby has no local partners.

It is a failure to localize. Always a part of a global scheme.

Many Pacific islanders have come to peddle their trade in Europe. They were not part of a competition before that so to speak.

English, French, Ireland, Wales, Scottish players remain at home for the most. NZ and AU have their way to keep the best players.

Of all southern nations, SA rugby is the one that is the most subsidized by the North. It relies on panhandling.

SA rugby was unstainable in the first place. It is a rugby that has no roots, no soul, no attachment. It is a product of global schemes run by globalists.

Just for Trad:

Whataboutism or whataboutery (as in "what about…?") denotes in a pejorative sense a procedure in which a critical question or argument is not answer ed or discussed, but retorted with a critical counter-question which expresses a counter-accusation. From a logical and argumentative point of view it is considered a variant of the tu-quoque pattern (Latin 'you too', term for a counter-accusation), which is a subtype of the ad-hominem argument.

I would almost have gone to have a home and and away matches first and let the top two qualify. But what messes this whole thing up are the Welsh teams. I don't think a single on is competitive enough. Where as Ireland, all 4 teams are better than the Welsh teams. That said, Munster is dropping down at the moment and got beaten by a Welsh team. So maybe I'm being to hard on them 

I guess, the league works, clubs have to play 25 games a year in order to make it viable, I don't think that 11 games would be enough. Even if you add the derby games, it would only be 14, still well short of the total amount of game. 

The European cup adds an additional 4 games, which brings teams up to 18 games. 9 of those games would be at home. 

SA is definitely in a Downward spiral with this Government...and everything that has got something to do with Government structures, joins the Rotten Tomatoes.....they want to control everything including SA Rugby....and off course with there Agenda,s in play....no wonder that Rugby players and normal citizens leave.

The problem is that the ANC likes socialism and how communism works. It is very evident in the government employee structure. 

However, if you look how Russia and China implemented it is that they were very active in assigning jobs. On top of that, there was and is competition within the system. You have to do well at school to go to university, even though more people could go and have now benefited greatly which is one part I like about the system, you can't ignore the competition and work ethic. 

Where as in SA we drop the pass rate for schools, university entry and we use race. But nothing gets done by schools, teaching or creating better educational structures. 

So it will never work. 

Not that I'm advocating for communism, but definitely belief in the fundamentals of education and that it should be affordable as well as a level difficulty 

Just for Trad:

SA is definitely in a Downward spiral with this Government...

Funny. SA is definitively on a downward spiral, a spiral that was initiated by the former regime and the current government has been failing to negate.

SA is like a plane, guy starts to fly it, then hands down the controls to another guy, waves goodbye and jumps off with a parachute. The new pilot takes a look at the gas gauge, it is about to go deplete.

Current government has been set to manage the crashlanding. Crashlanding that would have happened nevertheless.

Fall guys.

they want to control everything including SA Rugby....

What the GINI coefficient in SA is, 65 or something. Funny.

Draad you are wasting your time - Trad is fucked in the head

Owner of a primitive brain and a simple mind. Does not make people fucked in the head.

A bit of continuation for the fun of it.

The critical question about SA rugby is its continuation. And the obvious answer to it is its termination.

Critical thinking: termination of SA rugby.

Rant: ANC fails to sustain SA rugby, ANC is destroying SA rugby.

The ANC or any government for the case will work wonders. A critical thinking government would terminate SA rugby though.

you can't ignore the competition and work ethic.

Competition in SA. Ah. In fact, one key of the previous regime was to refuse competition with the locals. They voted specific laws to curtain any competition from them.

And that is talking about competition coming from black people. Rejection of competition happened already and violently.

Work ethics. Ah. Beavering away at shipping away wealth is not work. Work is something else.

Beavering away at shipping away wealth is gorging at the trough.

 Where as in SA we drop the pass rate for schools, university entry and we use race. But nothing gets done by schools, teaching or creating better educational structures.

The delusion. It happens in many places.For various causes. Again, an irony as SA rugby fail to provide training and drilling etc

There is no hope in education for SA at the moment, the train is long gone. Educated people in SA will only mean educated unemployed people.

No industrial hope either, the needle wont buy a future for SA.

SA was put on a crash course. Kolmanskop incoming.

Trad, some of your stuff makes sense and the the rest don't. Read the room and join us on the topic.