white believes meyer will revert to type,,,

Former South African World Cup-winning coach Jake White has hit out at the side's new coach Heyneke Meyer.
  South African newspaper Die Burger reported White's comments at a fundraising function in Kempton Park.

White felt Meyer was reflecting his long time spent with the Bulls in Super and Currie Cup rugby in his coaching style. However, White added that Meyer would always face criticism because of the time he spent with the Bulls and because of that it was inevitable that experience would be reflected in his coaching of the Springboks.

"Heyneke's coaching style is not a style that will help the Boks to win," White said.

"If you can't score at least four tries against Argentina, then there is a big problem."

The Bulls association would mean that the more pressure Meyer felt, the more he would revert to what worked with the Bulls.

"If, for example, he must choose between Gio Aplon and Zane Kirchner, he will choose Kirchner," White said.

Meanwhile, Springbok captain Jean de Villiers said the side had to step up after their draw with Argentina when they faced Australia in Perth next week.

"We need to learn from our experiences, and we're growing as a team, but you can't keep making the same mistakes," de Villiers said.

"By Saturday next week we will know if we've stepped up or not. We're building as a team. Our discipline needs to improve, our execution, and our set-phases have taken a step backward," he said.

De Villiers was looking for a 40 percent improvement although he said margins were very small in Test rugby.

"We believe we were a better team than how we played on Saturday. Even thought there has been a lot of criticism of our attacking play, I thought that was actually quite good," he said.

De Villiers said he believed in Meyer as coach and while there had been criticism of his game plan he believed it was the players who should be questioned for failing to execute the game plan.

"It's a new coach trying to get a message and game play across to the team. We will all stand up for what we believe in. We believe in the coach and what we're doing is right," he said.

I want Meyer, and the Boks to succeed, and I know Meyer has had only 5 test matches, but so far, Jake White is right.

 Good old Jake true to form - what a wanker this guy is

Jake might be a wanker to you Saff but he has achieved a lot for SA rugby and is doing good things in Australia. Jake is also correct by what he's saying in terms of HM reverting to the only thing he knows, ie. skop, jaag en donder hence his kak choice of players. Yeah, we all know it's only been five games but, eish, that gameplan....

Saffex I know you dislike Jake White - but you eally have to deal with what White said here - not your personal dislike of the man. Although I agree substantially with what White says here - I think people should bear some side issues in mind in this case.

When the issue of renewal of Jake Whites contract came up with SARU in 2007 - the Bulls started a campaign against him - they wanted him replaced by Meyer - at the time the Bulls coach.    They got the sopport of the Cheetahs for that one and some other Unions - who had their own personal agendas - and especially Cheeky Watsons lot -  succeeded on technical grounds to eliminate White, but when the issue of successor came up, the whole Meyer scheme fell appart and Pieter De Villiers was appointed.   Fact is the whole issue was stoked up as a political move and they also used repeatedly what Thabo Mbeki allegedly said - up to a point where White allegedly tried to find out whether Mbeki really said what the Watsons and others said he did say.   The liars got caught out and they really had to stop that one.

However, what was clear was that Meyer was up to his neck involved in the process to get rid of White and replace him - not a very nice savoury way to get a job,   That is why I am not really surprised by what White said in this case.   In a way Meyer played the same game as Mallett did earlier - and we know what happened to Mallett after his luvk ran out and he had to start replacing the players he inherited from his predecessor - he flopped badly.

Meyer is in a slightly more difficult position masmuch as he had to replace ssome players earlier than expected and as White pointed out - his recourse was immediatly to revert to his previous main support base - namely Mattfield and Fourie Du Preez - some of his Bulls stalwarts.   When that was not successful - he went for some under-par Bulls players to fill the vacancies.    Kirchner was mentioned in the comments of White - but there are others as well.

As to the game plan issue - there are many commentators who was very critical of the "High kick and charge" methods apparently preferred by Meyer and what White said was nothing new.  

What Jean De Villiers said must be seen as a captain supporting his coach - any criticism would for him be fatal.   I do not buy "the quite good" myth about the game last Saturday - the backline was bad beyond words.  

What is more important was the apparent bust up between Meyer and Erasmus - the latter is nowhere in sight anymore.   Where is Rassie and what happened in his case?

Like Strauss - the ex-POM cricket captain - there are Kevin Pietersens all around him - and life is going to become increasingly difficult for him in an era where there are also polecats of various varieties around who - for their own agendas -  will make his life hell.   In a way I sympathise with Meyer - but he brought it onto himself by his past and present actions.

Hahahahahahahaha whata poor piece of  fiction this is Mike. They were celaver enough to oust White but then were beaten to the line by ou pdv. Bwahahahahhahahaha what a laugh!!!! This is wors than ou windpomps conspiracy theory regading the deliberate ruining o fthe Lions. Hehehehehehehe hilarious start to the day!!

The only thing of substance here Mike is your repeating my query as to where Rassie is. Have you any evidence of a bust up?

All this is myths and fables Mike which you should not be peddaling as it blackens Meyers good name - unless of course you have any proof?

Mike please,  Strauss is 35 and he has battled to make runs and he has stated that he discussed his retirement some time ago with Flower - before the Petersen flare up - of retiring. He said at his age he was not going to get better as a cricketer and felt he had run his course. 35 for a test opening bat is old. So no more rumour mongering on that score Mike - unless you hav e some evidence of course!

Beeno squashing Mike's many rumours in the bud by asking for facts.  Hilarious rumours about Jake being ousted by Meyer and then ou pdv getting the job. A classic!  Hahahahahaha

Now all we need is for muncher and ragtad to suck all this in and it becomes an established fact like Flips penalty count.

Beeno

There is no conspiracy theories in the case of the White saga - it was lal over the media at that stage - and was clear for everyone to see if they had open eyes and read extensively on the issue.   The main orchestrators were the Bulls - and the sole objective was to get Meyer in as coach.   The other issue - not a conspiracy theory at all - was the bust op between Matffield (who wanted to be captain of the Springboks) and White.   Both are documented facts - so no conspiracy theory at all.  

A classic you mentioned - it was exactly like that.   The Bulls organised the whole saga and got the Cheetahs to support them.   They then got in Cheeky and some of his political cronies in other smaller unions and the scene was set.   They all had different reasons for getting rid of White = the Bulls because of the Meyer factor and the Mattfield saga, the Cheetahs for one or other obscure other reason and Cheeky because White would not have Puke in his team.

However, the scheme of the Bulls fell apart when it came to voting for the National coach appointment.   De Villiers won by one vote and got appointed.   Go and check the records - and you would find it as a fact of life.

Your comments are really laughable - but one can expect that from you.    You also completely lost the point I made about Strauss and Pietersen.   That really was hilarious.   I merely stated the obvious - a person like Meyer will have envious buggers around him that would leak info and carry on undermining him - it is unfortunately a fact of life found many times all over the world.  

 The big issue here is the continued use of bulls players and staff. Why on eath did Meyer take most of the Bulls staff with him. It is clear that the bulls haven't been the same union in the last three years and were extremely lucky to finish where they did. There are better coaches in the country that could be used for forwards, defence and backs. 

For me a national team should have the best coaches. If we don't have them in the country then bring them in. I would love to see the coaching staff of Rassie as technical coach, Proudfoot as Forwards (Look what he had done at the stormers with the youngsters), Jacques Nienaber Defence, Basil from the bulls for conditioning, Eddie Jones as backs coach. I have no problem of having Meyer at the helm, but he really needs to be come inovative and start getting the most out of the players and coaching staff

The other issue I have with Meyer is that he made promises to players such as Sadie and Englebrecht that if they joined the bulls that they would become springboks. In part JJ is in the squad with out really proving himself. He has hardly scored any tries against his name, but also have the worst defensive record, but yet he still made the team. One could argue that the bulls influence over the boks helps them to recruite the top players because they can almost guarantee that the players will become boks. Look at all the other players in the past that wasn't even in the starting 15 but yet they still made the springbok squed. Hilton loberts, Maku, Hougaard etc. The bulls had at one stage 22 players in the springbok squad. How is that possible? 

Call it what you will but it has been well documented that Meyer has made promises to players if they joined. Then there is the issue with Stander, fantastic player for the bulls and he performed acceptionally well in the Super 15, but when news got out that he will be going to Ireland he got dropped and has hardly featured this season. Also look at how Potgieter got recruited. Personally I think Meyer made a lot of promises to bulls players and that is why they are in the team.

As for his game style, dare I say that at this stage Oom Piets game plan looks even better. 

My final point is that I believe experience is over rated. Look what happed to Piet Helium, he relied to heavily on them and in the end had to sacrifice his plans to suite the seniour players. For me a senior player should be a role model and the ultimate professional and that is what I believe Jake got right.

He brouht back Os when he retired, brought back Percy when the whole country forgotten about him and was even bood at Loftus during a Springbok game. Jake got rid of his senior players such as Joubert, Barry, vder West Huizen to name a few and backed youngsters. He had the right formula for success.

And those that say that he didn't coach the team and used other people, that is what good coaches do. They bring the best people together. People that say that he didn't do anything really show how stupid they are. Modern coaches are more managers like in footbal rather than coaches.

Mike the Cheetahs reason for getting rid of White must have been very obscure as is this whole idea of Meyer being at the forefront to get rid of Jake. You still provide no evidence.

What very likely got rid of White is the same cabal that got rid of the Lions - they  had big enough support to that  without Meyers help. The desire to get in a coach of colour was what shafted white. This was because of political pressure and the likes of Watson etc. They thought that given the strength of the Boks ou pdv would have a glorious reign.

I think my theory makes more sense and is better than blaming the Cheethas and bulle with no evidence Mike.

Beeno conspiracist theorist par excellence!

on the real post by sasue i know of personal expierence that HM is very one track mind. he does not come across when one speaks to him as a person that is very open minded and takes advice from other people. so in that sense i do feel jake might have a point. he does pick players and staff that he knows and he does not go beyond his means, which is a strong suite if things are going well and everything is going as it should but that is a double edged sword. if things go down hill fast then if one can take advice and be more open minded things can get out of hand quickly

@beeno in regards to beeno's rubbish conspiracy post (seems like jake is also part ot the global eilte trying to overthrow goverments and bring about a NWO) poor fellow cant seem to do anything right in your eyes hey beeno (please note my sarcasm )

@kingcorn and mike i agree with your posts 100% your facts are spot on. please can you bestow some rugby IQ to the rather below par beeno

Beeno

You are talking crap in this case.   The idea to get rid of White was initiated by the Bulls.   They got the help of Venter - who at that stage was the Chairman of the Cheetahs and they obviously got th support of some of the minor unions who disliked White - some for so-called political reasons (especially the Cheeky crowd).   There is no way that that scenario can be compared with the present situation as to the Kings (Queens) saga.   The latest one goes hand-in-hand with disastrous display by the Lions over the last few years in the Super Rugby competition - the White saga was to get rid of a very able coach involved in winning of the 2007 WC,   

Be it as it may - if the Bulls did not organize the ousting - nothing would have come of it.   The Bulls wanted Meyer as the Springbok coach and that was the end of the story.   Nothing more.   Remember the Bulls and the Cheetahs lost the Meyer appointment by 1 vote in the final analysis - so if they were on the other side, the outcome would have been different.   Meyer definitely played a role in the process and that is also a fact.