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FORUM / RUGBY /  Youngsters I want to see involved with the Boks

Youngsters I want to see involved with the Boks

Started by Saffolk 25 REPLIES295 VIEWS· 03 Feb 2015, 20:19
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SA
Saffolk Captain30,741 posts
03 Feb 2015, 20:19
#1
03 Feb 2015, 20:19#1

If I was the coach, these youngsters would be involved in my set up straight away.

 

Fullback: Jessie Kriel, this kid is the real deal has it all and is equally at home at 13


Bubbling under – Andries Coetzee, SP Marais

 

Wings: Senatla, has already set the 7’s world alight and should go down as a Bok great


Kolbe – I am all for the big guys, but this little lad punches way above his weight and has the ability to rip defences apart.


Bubbling under – Sithole, Rhule and Jordaan

 

Centres: Kobus v/Wyk – wasted on the wing, played all his age group rugby at centre, I want to see him at 13. Has the same skill set as JJ, but might have a harder edge.


Andre Esterhuizen – a powerhouse at 106kg, needs to be moulded into a SBW


Bubbling under – Pat Howard, Tyler Fisher, Frans Venter, Odendaal, Mnisi, Stokkies and Vorster

 

Flyhalf: None


Bubbling under – Tim Swiel

 

Scrumhalf: Faf de Klerk – the find of last season


Bubbling under – Groom, Schrauder and Luithers

 

Props: Thomas du Toit – this kid has the world at his feet, our new Os


Kitshoff – came of age only to be struck down by injury


Bubbling under – Ollie Kebble, Morne Mellett and Maks v/Dyk

 

Hookers: None


Bubbling under – Cooper, Malcolm Marx and Scara

 

Locks: Willemse – how Meyer has missed out on this lad is beyond me. He should be Etzebeth’s Bok partner now


Jacques du Plessis – the next big thing since Eben and PSDT


Bubbling under – Jean Kleyn, Jandre Marais and Ruan Botha


Loosies: Mtembu – this lads all round skills really impressed me last season


v/d Walt – lost to France but has test rugby written all over him


CJ Stander – setting Munster alight this season, if Meyer had any brains he would secure his services instead of Ireland claiming him in a years’ time.


Kriel – toured but got no game time, he is worthy


Bubbling under – Elstadt, Labascagne, Etienne Oosthuizen, Oupa

 

 

Then we have a list of youngsters who have tasted test rugby and now need further investment:


De Allende, JJ, Goosen, Pollard, Hougaard, Reinach, v/Zyl, Marcel v/d Merwe, Malherbe, Coenie, Nyakane, PSDT, Lood, Lewies, Carr Arno Botha and Kolisi.

 

It’s a sad state of affairs that the only entrenched Bok youngsters are Willie, Serfontein, Lambie, Etzebeth and Coetzee.

 

MO
MozartCaptain49,914 posts
03 Feb 2015, 20:46
#2
03 Feb 2015, 20:46#2
You don't have a set up Dave. Thank heavens. But I did note that you think van Wyk has a harder edge than JayJay. Historically those little reservations were usually the first degree of separation. About time, wimps don't make it in international rugby.  
SA
Saffolk Captain30,741 posts
03 Feb 2015, 22:49
#3
03 Feb 2015, 22:49#3
If it was my set up we would be winning 90% of our tests.
As for JJ, I know all I need to know about him. He is our best 13 by some distance. His performance against NZ confirmed that. His beating of Savea is something the likes of Fourie or Jean could only dream of doing.
My point was harder edge, there is nothing wrong with JJ's edge.....but we all know he is hardly the chest beating kind of player.....he relies on skill and pace.


MO
MozartCaptain49,914 posts
04 Feb 2015, 00:28
#4
04 Feb 2015, 00:28#4
Hahaha...nothing wrong with JJ's edge. Hell I've seen girl scouts with more presence...he is .....nothing.  
SA
Saffolk Captain30,741 posts
04 Feb 2015, 00:56
#5
04 Feb 2015, 00:56#5
Ah well until your buddy Meyer starts winning tests and proves me wrong, I'll stick with the classy JJ....he will continue to pick your picks and will continue to lose.
MO
MozartCaptain49,914 posts
04 Feb 2015, 01:06
#6
04 Feb 2015, 01:06#6
Lose? What do you think the Bools did with JJ and Step? The only decent segment of their 2014 was when Victor started. 
SA
Saffolk Captain30,741 posts
04 Feb 2015, 01:12
#7
04 Feb 2015, 01:12#7
Crap Matfield was a liability for the Bulls much like he was for the Boks.
The Bulls have Ludeke as a coach, he is no different to Meyer, equally conservative and poor......the Bulls form had stuff all to do with Jan and JJ.....they must have received the least ball of all the S15 sides in the comp.
There is a pattern here......poor coaches who cant select......look no further than Meyer......you wont agree as your selections are just as poor.
Good on you if winning 5 of the 9 big games last season is good enough for you......I on the otherhand have an issue with that and that is purely down to our incompetent coach who is losing the plot and is going to sell us down the river this WC


MO
MozartCaptain49,914 posts
04 Feb 2015, 02:46
#8
04 Feb 2015, 02:46#8
 They got no ball......waaaaaaaaaaaaahahaha.
MO
MozartCaptain49,914 posts
04 Feb 2015, 02:54
#9
04 Feb 2015, 02:54#9
Actually we had a fair year up till the YE tour.  And frankly I agree HM made some mistakes on that tour. Not having a real alternative to Schalk for Wales, where Warburton took Coetzee to the cleaners. Pathetic half backs in Lambie, Reinach and Hougaard.....the dropped balls, charged kicks, kicks directly into touch after eschewing penalties. A horror show of incompetence.

If you are raising our YE tour  flop Dave.....look no further than the players you support. 
CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
04 Feb 2015, 03:38
#10
04 Feb 2015, 03:38#10
 Mozart
We did not only have a poor EOYT - we had a seriously poor year in tests.   The only real positive was beating the AB's at Ellis Park and the comprehensive win against Wales in the first June test.   
The rest of the tests were cases where we were lucky to win, ie the second Welsh test and the Argentina  tests.   We lost against Australia away and the EOYT was no difference to our lukewarm performances throughout the year.
The main problems all along has been the poor performances of certain players you always support - the main culprits being Morne Steyn and Victor Matfield.  You blame Coetzee and others for the loss against Wales, yet you do not mention that the real failure was Mohoje.   In the case of Matfield we fielded a Tight 4 combination - in the case of Mohoje, we had a two out of three loosie situation.   
To my mind the problem was not the backline players that cause the lukewarm performances - it was a serious case of under-performance by the forwards.            
MO
MozartCaptain49,914 posts
04 Feb 2015, 04:44
#11
04 Feb 2015, 04:44#11
Forwards and half backs. Blundering at halfback and no power in the rucks. Go back to competent half backs and get a power loose trio. The difference between Vermeulen/Mohoje/ Coetzee and Vermeulen/Louw/ Alberts is night and day. You simply didn't grasp what Alberts did for us in 2013 Mike, but the results are obvious....we could no longer control the tight/loose. Against France ln 2013  for example, we simply blew them off the ball. 
BE
Beeno1Captain40,032 posts
04 Feb 2015, 10:24
#12
04 Feb 2015, 10:24#12
 I would like to see Louw, Burger and Vermuelen. The trio I said many yeras ago was the best in the world. How true that proved.Willemse and Etzebeth at lock would be great. The fact is the Boks could have the most formidable pack in the world but we keep shooting ourselves in the foot with complete duds like matfiled and Mohoje in particular. At least Marcell gets stuck in for 80 minutes.
Half backs should not be aproblem. Pollard will gain more expereince and we might even have the canny fourie du preez back to guide the backline. Otherwise we have anumber of competent half backs.Given the forward dominance we could achieve the half backs will have a field day. So its vital we get the pack right so wee matfiled and mohoje etc must vamoos! 
Meyer must pick his RWC on merit and rather get fired than bow to anc racist demands. Let the world know what' s going on here etc.





SA
Saffolk Captain30,741 posts
04 Feb 2015, 11:10
#13
04 Feb 2015, 11:10#13

Ah yeah of course its the players I support.......what a bloody joke......lets excuse our conservative coach with his pathetic selections......our EOYT was a flop as was the year as a whole given we only won 5 of our 9 big tests = FLOP

 

Reinach, Lambie, Coetzee and Hougaard......are amongst our best players......Reinach and Lambie were outstanding against England......Hougaard was outstanding against Oz and NZ.......Coetzee has been outstanding most of the year.

 

You are blind to how poor Meyer is but then again you would be as you see positives in selections like useless Matfield, Steenkamp, Morne and co......it all adds up.

 

Sadly however, the results speak for themselves and you can support these losers all you like, but it wont change the facts.

 

Meyer is a poor coach, mostly because he gets 50% of his selections wrong  

MO
MozartCaptain49,914 posts
04 Feb 2015, 16:10
#14
04 Feb 2015, 16:10#14

I'm not even going to bother to set you straight again Dave....in your heart of hearts, you know I'm right.

 

 

Hasbeen.....start Louw, Schalk, Vermeulen...lock with with Willemse and Etzebeth....halfback with f du Preez and Pollard,  and you have taken a giant step forward over our YE teams.  

SA
Saffolk Captain30,741 posts
04 Feb 2015, 17:44
#15
04 Feb 2015, 17:44#15
Moz you could not be further from the truth if you tried. With utmost conviction I stand by everything I say in particular how poor Meyer is and what liabilities Matfield and co are. 
Just as I am convinced how good the likes of Lambie, Coetzee and co are.
I am right you and Meyer are wrong. 5 out of 9 proves it.
MO
MozartCaptain49,914 posts
04 Feb 2015, 17:55
#16
04 Feb 2015, 17:55#16
 Five out of nine....dontcha mean nine out of 13....ten out of fourteen if you include the World match. Not the best, but as I pointed out the Lambie, Hougaard and Raai-nag selections were a mistake.

But help me, which are the nine big games you reference?
SA
Saffolk Captain30,741 posts
04 Feb 2015, 19:08
#17
04 Feb 2015, 19:08#17
Moz you could not be further from the truth if you tried. With utmost conviction I stand by everything I say in particular how poor Meyer is and what liabilities Matfield and co are. 
Just as I am convinced how good the likes of Lambie, Coetzee and co are.
I am right you and Meyer are wrong. 5 out of 9 proves it.
SA
Saffolk Captain30,741 posts
04 Feb 2015, 19:26
#18
04 Feb 2015, 19:26#18
 No I mean 5 out of 9. Hardly going to count games against the likes of Italy, Scotland and co unless you are of the opinion they carry a large amount of credibility.
Hell my mother could coach the Boks to victory over Italy...its a given.
Meyer failed with 5 out of 9 against the big boys NZ, Oz, England, Wales and Ireland.
MO
MozartCaptain49,914 posts
04 Feb 2015, 19:40
#19
04 Feb 2015, 19:40#19

So the Bargies never beat OZ in 2014...they never made the 2007 RWC semi? I accept Italy and Scotland were weaker opponents....but actually relative to most years we had very few weak games.

 

The record is nine out of thirteen.....or 69%. A po or year but the Lambie/Hougaard/Reinach madness was bound to hurt.

SA
Saffolk Captain30,741 posts
04 Feb 2015, 20:01
#20
04 Feb 2015, 20:01#20
The Argies are nothing and you know it. We should always beat them. Yes they are improving and their time might come but to classify them as top tier is laughable.
What counts is 5 out of 9. That's the true measure. 
Lambie, Reinach and Hougaard are positives.
The negatives in order are Meyer, Matfield, Morne, Steenkamp, Bakkies, Pienaar, Alberts, Jean, Louw, Jannie, Schalk and du Preez
MO
MozartCaptain49,914 posts
04 Feb 2015, 20:58
#21
04 Feb 2015, 20:58#21
Hmm as I recall they beat France at home , the week after the Frogs beat Oz. So in the last three months they have beaten Oz and France. I suppose those teams aren't top tier as well.
SA
Saffolk Captain30,741 posts
04 Feb 2015, 22:40
#22
04 Feb 2015, 22:40#22
One off wins are hardly the measure. Hell we snuck a draw against the Argies thanks to a Frans intercept.
If the Argies are now also the measure in your eyes then that appears to mirror your standards in players. To find favour in old man Matfield says it all.
MO
MozartCaptain49,914 posts
04 Feb 2015, 22:58
#23
04 Feb 2015, 22:58#23
To find favour in Kirchner and Werner Kruger says it all.
SA
Saffolk Captain30,741 posts
04 Feb 2015, 23:22
#24
04 Feb 2015, 23:22#24
Moz I found favour in them over 5 years ago and Kruger was never a starter so try again.
Spot the difference. You would have had a point had your poor examples featured in my side right now.
Weak Moz
MO
MozartCaptain49,914 posts
05 Feb 2015, 04:05
#25
05 Feb 2015, 04:05#25
Dave your list is replete with examples....SP Marais for example....the perfectly ordinary injury prone Kitshoff for example.  If we get 4 regular Boks  out of the lot I'd be surprised. Just a list of names....great test match players are few and demonstrate it at an early age. JJ is already in the Murray school of players time has passed by.
CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
05 Feb 2015, 06:22
#26
05 Feb 2015, 06:22#26
 I did not want to get involved in this thread because in some ways Dave is totally unrealistic with some of his "selections"   Some of the youngsters have potential - but they have some way to go to get ready for international test rugby.
Insofar as some of the older players in the Springbok squad or on the fringes is concerned there are serious reservations as well.   Players lie Frans Steyn, Morne Steyn, Willem Alberts and Victor Matfield are big no-no's - they were defective in Super Rugby and tests  last year.   
I do not agree with Dave about Louw - he is a classy sort.   I have my doubts about Burger though - he to my mind is an impact player - not a starting one.   We will see whether he gets through Super 15 this year without further injuries.  
I was not impressed by Spies on Saturday - he is just not an acceptable loosie.   The Bulls had the upper hand because Labuschagne and the youngster Liebenberg did massive work in ball protection and recovery.   When Labuscagne was benched - that component of their play went to pieces - nobody did proper work on it afterwards and Saracens started to score tries.     
Jacques du Plessis is to my mind a lock - not a loosie.   I think he should be in the Springbok squad - where he can be basically be used as a lock and only in exceptional circumstances play as a loosie.
Like Jesse Kriel as well - he is one for the future though.                 
— END OF THREAD —

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