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FORUM / MIKES GRIPES /  Hindustan Times reports that Elon Musk says Russia will win the war

Hindustan Times reports that Elon Musk says Russia will win the war

Started by Beeno122 REPLIES374 VIEWS· 11 Jul 2023, 07:50
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BE
Beeno1Captain40,032 posts
11 Jul 2023, 07:50
#1
11 Jul 2023, 07:50#1

If true the billionaire genius catches up with Beeno who has said this from almost day one.

Elon gives his reason which are all sound. 

We have had gullible halfwits, brainwashed zombies, insisting Ukraine would win month after month. These boneheads were immune to the facts. They were and still are immune to the facts that prove Nato instigated this war. 

However the truth as always finally gets known and people get to know what is going on. 

The astonishing thing is dispite their sources being wrong time and again these jackasses will be back at the trough feeding on Globalist media propaganda with never a thought they are being made monkeys of yet again. BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA. It's truly hilarious how daft they are. 





MO
MoonroverPro1,973 posts
11 Jul 2023, 11:05
#2
11 Jul 2023, 11:05#2

"enemies of Russia” had “repeatedly tried to take the Crimean peninsula from Russia and use it to steal and ravage Russian lands."

Voroshilov 19-2-54

History repeating itself.

ST
Stavanger1Pro4,532 posts
11 Jul 2023, 11:23
#3
11 Jul 2023, 11:23#3

Good old Elon, the worlds smartest idiot.

PL
PlumCaptain21,007 posts
11 Jul 2023, 15:02
#4
11 Jul 2023, 15:02#4
Russia have lost around 70k troops while Ukraine has lost 350k. Putin has now built up a considerable force and seemingly has no intention of slowing down. Ukraine are struggling to fill their ranks and are putting totally green soldiers on the front. Some of their best units have over 80% of their soldiers killed or injured to the point where they won't be returning to the front. This is like egging on a child to fight an adult just so you can feel like you are a good person. It's got nothing to do with who is right and who is evil but rather all about limiting the damage the child is going to take. Ukraine would have gotten much better deal out of this had they negotiated from the outset. Now, Russia are going to crush them and take a much bigger slice of the pie. How are you supposed to negotiate when you have nothing in the tank? At least at the start of the war Putin wasn't quite sure how much aid the West would provide and that unknown could have worked in Ukraine's advantage at early negotiations. What do they have now? What will they have in another six months from now when Europe completely loses its appetite to help them? When the Ukraine war effort stops benefiting those supposedly helping Ukraine, they're gonna be dropped like a stone and have to give up far more of their country than they initially would have.
AJ
AJHPro3,183 posts
11 Jul 2023, 15:24
#5
11 Jul 2023, 15:24#5

In the mean time their Ukrainen Warlord Leader is still doing the rounds siliciting money to secure his families future.

All his and his families banks accounts should be frozen in any country that they exist and after the war returned to the people of Ukraine to assist in rebuilding their country.

Freaking clown in war atire flyng around the world collecting cash.

What a hero he is to the stooges.

ST
Stavanger1Pro4,532 posts
11 Jul 2023, 19:25
#6
11 Jul 2023, 19:25#6

Russia have lost around 70k troops while Ukraine has lost 350k.

You really think its credible Ukraine has taken 5 times the causalities Russia has? 

Putin has now built up a considerable force and seemingly has no intention of slowing down.

Is that why Russia is mostly sitting on the defensive at the moment?

Ukraine are struggling to fill their ranks and are putting totally green soldiers on the front. Some of their best units have over 80% of their soldiers killed or injured to the point where they won't be returning to the front.

Hmm this is starting to suspiciously sound like Russian cool aid. I'm absolute certain that some Ukrainian units have taken high causalities and they have had to use green troops at times. But their is clear indications that some elite units on the Russian also suffered significant causalities such as the elite 1st Guards Tank Army and the VDV (Russian airborne forces). I think its pretty clear at this point the Ukrainian's have showed the greater will to fight and have out performed their Russian counterparts.

This is like egging on a child to fight an adult just so you can feel like you are a good person.

It's got nothing to do with who is right and who is evil but rather all about limiting the damage the child is going to take.

No we just realise appeasement is a terrible idea and giving Putin what he wants will just encourage him and others like to try something like this in the future. 

Ukraine would have gotten much better deal out of this had they negotiated from the outset.

There was nothing to negotiate. Russia made up a load of lies about Ukraine to justify its invasion. Tell me how could Ukraine negotiate to stop the genocide in Donbas, its rather difficult simply due to the fact there was no genocide in the Donbass, how could Ukraine negotiated denazifying Ukraine when its not a Nazi state. Its such a load of shit that they could of negotiated. Putin wanted this war and if you don't see that you're deluded.

Now, Russia are going to crush them and take a much bigger slice of the pie.

How are you supposed to negotiate when you have nothing in the tank? At least at the start of the war Putin wasn't quite sure how much aid the West would provide and that unknown could have worked in Ukraine's advantage at early negotiations.

What do they have now?

Again with the Russian cool-aid...is there vodka in it?

You do realise Ukraine has committed less than a third of the equipment the west supplied to it in the current counter offensive? The initial attacks didn't go so well so they have switched to an indication campaign against Russia command and logistics hubs as well as heavily targeting Russian artillery, their still probing for weak points. Ukraine has hundreds of thousands of troops across the whole of the front line and hundreds of tanks and armoured vehicles as well as more accurate missile systems. Ukraine isn't remotely close to being defeated at present. 

What will they have in another six months from now when Europe completely loses its appetite to help them?

You mean the countries that are looking to make long term commitments to supporting Ukraine.

https://www.politico.eu/article/eu-draws-up-plan-for-sustained-military-aid-to-ukraine/

When the Ukraine war effort stops benefiting those supposedly helping Ukraine, they're gonna be dropped like a stone and have to give up far more of their country than they initially would have.

You can barely contain your delight at such a thought. If the aid stops, you will be able to come on here and tell everyone how right you have been all along. As for giving up more of their country...Russia tried to capture pretty much the whole country at the start of the war, what are you smoking!

DB
DbDraadCaptain26,388 posts
11 Jul 2023, 19:39
#7
11 Jul 2023, 19:39#7

"Good old Elon, the worlds smartest idiot."

Ah, yes...lot's of smart idiots around these days...how can you be so sure everything you believe is 100% legit? ...especially if some very smart people seems to be questioning some of it.

ST
Stavanger1Pro4,532 posts
11 Jul 2023, 21:01
#8
11 Jul 2023, 21:01#8

Ah, yes...lot's of smart idiots around these days...how can you be so sure everything you believe is 100% legit? ...especially if some very smart people seems to be questioning some of it.

Oh no one can be 100% sure. Absolutely due to my own personal biases and life experiences I have and will end up believing somethings that's are not true but I like to think I can admit that, as opposed to someone here who will duck and dive. However having read some of Elon's comments on the Ukraine war I don't place any value on them.

MO
MozartCaptain49,914 posts
11 Jul 2023, 23:09
#9
11 Jul 2023, 23:09#9

Gosh Russia will beat Ukraine….wait, wasn’t that supposed to happen 15 months ago!

BO
bobbok...Captain10,129 posts
11 Jul 2023, 23:52
#10
11 Jul 2023, 23:52#10
ButtPPlug, your sources please
Stav , the 5 to 1 ratio, probably wishful thinking
SH
sharkbokCaptain23,198 posts
12 Jul 2023, 00:11
#11
12 Jul 2023, 00:11#11
Plum

Hall Of Fame

10431 posts

Jul 11, 2023, 15:02

Russia has lost around 70k troops while Ukraine has lost 350k.

-----------------

I too would like to see your sources ButtPlug.

DB
DbDraadCaptain26,388 posts
12 Jul 2023, 05:22
#12
12 Jul 2023, 05:22#12

"However having read some of Elon's comments on the Ukraine war I don't place any value on them."

Yet his Starlink has done more for the Ukranian war effort than the cluster bombs would...I bet he's more informed than you think...

BO
bobbok...Captain10,129 posts
12 Jul 2023, 05:58
#13
12 Jul 2023, 05:58#13

Well unlike the Russians Ukraine won't use em to kill civilians, that railway station cluster bombing killed over 50, injuring 300 + ............ they won't be c.bombing Russia, but simply to help defend their homeland.

ST
Stavanger1Pro4,532 posts
12 Jul 2023, 07:31
#14
12 Jul 2023, 07:31#14

Yet his Starlink has done more for the Ukranian war effort than the cluster bombs would...I bet he's more informed than you think...

No I don't think he is. I think he's just saying stuff to get attention and to make him self look smart.

DB
DbDraadCaptain26,388 posts
12 Jul 2023, 08:06
#15
12 Jul 2023, 08:06#15

"...and to make him self look smart."


His achievements do that for him...he's literally a rocket scientist!

ST
Stavanger1Pro4,532 posts
12 Jul 2023, 09:10
#16
12 Jul 2023, 09:10#16

His achievements do that for him...he's literally a rocket scientist!

Doesn't make him an expert on politics or warfare.

PL
PlumCaptain21,007 posts
12 Jul 2023, 10:25
#17
12 Jul 2023, 10:25#17
Wasn't Putin at first using a small force because he though my he'd get negotiations sooner? I think he wasn't expecting Ukraine to fight back as much as they did. Again, becsuse obviously one has to say this...I don't support or want Russia to win.
ST
Stavanger1Pro4,532 posts
12 Jul 2023, 11:01
#18
12 Jul 2023, 11:01#18

Wasn't Putin at first using a small force because he though my he'd get negotiations sooner?

I think he wasn't expecting Ukraine to fight back as much as they did.

Basically over estimated his own armies abilities and underestimated Ukraine's resolve to fight. 

Again, becsuse obviously one has to say this...I don't support or want Russia to win.

Well a lot of what you suggest is basically tantamount to giving Russia what it wants.

PL
PlumCaptain21,007 posts
12 Jul 2023, 16:07
#19
12 Jul 2023, 16:07#19
Lol so if a guy is holding a gun and says "gimmie your wallet", I probably shouldn't give him my wallet, right? ...because doing that means I am supporting his effort. This is your logic and surely you know exactly how lame it is. Here's the reality of the situation... Ukraine are gonna to get even more fucked by Russia. You just can't deal with the fact that this is the real world and the good guy doesn't always win. And so, what allows you to keep living in lala land is pretending that Ukraine could still win. That Russia may give up and/or Ukraine gets enough support from the West to allow them to beat Russia. There are a million reasons why that is not going to happen. Not the least of which is that Western aid is tapering and Ukraine are struggling to fill their ranks with the majority of their best forces already being removed from the table. This while Russia is amassing ever larger forces and receiving help from the bottomless money pit that is China. Does this seem to you like a position from which Ukraine will gain anything by dragging this out for another six months, year...two years? Perhaps you dispute that this is the position that Ukraine find itself in? I'd love to know what part of the above is not accurate. I'm not supporting Russia. I'd much prefer they never invaded Ukraine. But I refuse to keep buying the nonsense that Ukraine should keep fighting this losing battle and offer up even more land and lives in the process. It's very simple. From the start, I said that Ukraine should have negotiated with Russia and the West should have helped them negotiate. Had that happened, they'd have gotten a far sweeter deal. But now, following the "Ukraine until the last man" logic, Ukraine is going to be demolished and they're going to end up negotiating from a far weaker position. Is that not extremely obvious to anybody reading this? TLDR I hope my life never depends on the type of comic book depiction strategist you appear to be.
SH
sharkbokCaptain23,198 posts
12 Jul 2023, 16:54
#20
12 Jul 2023, 16:54#20

Putin tried to take all of Ukraine within a few days, but failed.
He was never going to negotiate - he wanted all of Ukraine- evidenced by his attempt to take Kyiv.

The only time Putin wanted to negotiate, is when his attack stalled and he started losing land to counterattacks

The special military operation deemed Ukraine to be part of Russia, hence why it was not a war. 
The plan was to replace the Kviv government with Russian Oligarchs or bribed sympathisers to Russia. 



SE
SebPro2,680 posts
12 Jul 2023, 17:04
#21
12 Jul 2023, 17:04#21

People that know absolutely fa spout absolute shit that is fed to them but wishfull  indoctrinated information. 

Musk as clever as he is  but lacks any military knowledge is 100% correct...pure simple logic reveals the obvious.

ST
Stavanger1Pro4,532 posts
12 Jul 2023, 18:33
#22
12 Jul 2023, 18:33#22

Lol so if a guy is holding a gun and says "gimmie your wallet", I probably shouldn't give him my wallet, right?

...because doing that means I am supporting his effort.

This is your logic and surely you know exactly how lame it is.

Well here is the problem with you're analogy, you're assuming Ukraine isn't also holding a gun and has no other option and that's a good idea for other people not try and prevent people holding other people at gun point.

Ukraine are gonna to get even more fucked by Russia. You just can't deal with the fact that this is the real world and the good guy doesn't always win.

And so, what allows you to keep living in lala land is pretending that Ukraine could still win. That Russia may give up and/or Ukraine gets enough support from the West to allow them to beat Russia.

Are you of all people seriously going talk about the real world. That's up there with Mike's nonsense.

It's you that are leaving in lala land.

Lets look at invincible Russia's recent war record.

1905 Russo-Japanese War. Russia defeat.

1914-1918, World War I,  Russia defeat

1919-1921, Polish-Soviet War, Russian defeat.

1939 Battle of Khalklin Gol, Russian victory and a pretty good one at that..

1939-1940 Winter War, Russian victory but Russian's military performance was extremely poor.

1941-1945 World War 2, Russian victory played the primary role in winning but was part of an alliance that included both Ukraine and the western allies.

1979-1989 Soviet-Afghanistan War, Russian defeat.

1994-1996 First Chechen War, Russian defeat.

1999-2000 Second Chechen War, Russian victory. (bribed a lot of Chechens to switch sides)

2022-ongoing Russo-Ukraine, ongoing but again the general consensus is the Russian military has under performed.

Russia's war record is mixed at best. Its an absolute myth that Russia is undefeatable.

There are a million reasons why that is not going to happen. Not the least of which is that Western aid is tapering and Ukraine are struggling to fill their ranks with the majority of their best forces already being removed from the table.

Have you been watching the news recently. In the last couple of days alone the west announced more aid and there is indications that they are about to make commitments to provide the aid long term out to 2027. The French are sending Storm Shadow Missiles to Ukraine, the Germans are sending more Patriot air defence systems, Leopard tanks and self propelled artillery, the Turks have announced they are setting up a drone manufacturing plant in Ukraine and sending them self propelled artillery will send the Turkish navy to protect Ukrainian ships exporting grain, while a coalition of European nations have agreed to train Ukraine in how to fly the F-16 and potentially other planes. The American's are sending cluster bombs.

As for the majority of their best forces, maybe some of them have been larger wiped out, but there is every indication that the Russian's are suffering just as badly and I'd put top dollar on the overall quality and morale of the Ukrainian's army to be higher than that of Russia's. 

This while Russia is amassing ever larger forces and receiving help from the bottomless money pit that is China.

LOL. I notice you didn't even try to provide any evidence to back up the causality claims which sounds suspiciously like the number Russian propaganda channel claims any chance you can provide evidence of the bottomless supply of money from China which has its own economic problems at the moment. Sure Russia's army has got larger, filled with mostly conscripts but so has Ukraine's, who have gone to full mobilisation something Russia has not done. And its not like Russia has all this excess manpower and equipment sitting around back in Russia. Did you notice that Prigozhin recently little road trip to Moscow met no ground opposition?

Does this seem to you like a position from which Ukraine will gain anything by dragging this out for another six months, year...two years?

Its a position that doesn't conform to reality, so their is no point speculating on it.

Perhaps you dispute that this is the position that Ukraine find itself in?

I'd love to know what part of the above is not accurate.

Pretty much all of it.

I'm not supporting Russia. I'd much prefer they never invaded Ukraine.

But I refuse to keep buying the nonsense that Ukraine should keep fighting this losing battle and offer up even more land and lives in the process.

More Russian cool-aid. There is no indications Ukraine is losing, whether they can win or not is another question but if they where on the verge of defeat like you indicate care to explain why they are the ones on the offensive. And after the miserable amount of territory Russia captured in its Winter offensive, care to explain how Russia is going to "fuck Ukraine"?

And on a geopolitical level this war has already been a catastrophic Russian defeat. Valdimir Putin's is NATO's employee of the decade!

It's very simple.

From the start, I said that Ukraine should have negotiated with Russia and the West should have helped them negotiate. Had that happened, they'd have gotten a far sweeter deal.

No you said some utter nonsense about American's being able to supply Russian's with VPN's so they could convince them to stop the war.  

Here is the only deal that would of satisfied Russia, installation of a pro Russian government, the permanent annexation of Crimea and the Donbass to Russia, the end of Ukraine's aspirations to join either NATO or the EU and consequently the end of democracy in Ukraine and defacto end of Ukraine as a sovereign state.

But now, following the "Ukraine until the last man" logic, Ukraine is going to be demolished and they're going to end up negotiating from a far weaker position.

The Ukraine until the last man logic, is another piece of Russian propaganda. War's never end in a fight to the last man. As for a far negotiating position that's far weaker, its far stronger than Ukraine being a satellite state of Russia.

Is that not extremely obvious to anybody reading this?

TLDR I hope my life never depends on the type of comic book depiction strategist you appear to be.

What's extremely obvious is your bias. Frankly reading you're posts I think a comic book is a bit too advanced for you. Seriously if you want to have a proper debate try read analysis from both sides and not just parrot Russian talking points. 

People that know absolutely fa spout absolute shit that is fed to them but wishfull  indoctrinated information. 

Very apt description of yourself.

TH
TheTraditionalistPro4,003 posts
13 Jul 2023, 06:57
#23
13 Jul 2023, 06:57#23

Putin has now built up a considerable force and seemingly has no intention of slowing down.

Liberals have deep self perception problems which usually lead to warped conclusions or whatever.

A considerable force to do what.

The western/white/liberal world or whatever is advancing toward negotiation terms:

either Ukraine wins the war as a non NATO member or Ulraine wins the war as a NATO member.

Considerable force to what. Occupy the whole Ukraine, take on NATO.


— END OF THREAD —

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