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FORUM / MIKES GRIPES /  The Truth of the Matter: Russian Deaths in Ukraine

The Truth of the Matter: Russian Deaths in Ukraine

Started by bobbok...48 REPLIES1,804 VIEWS· 22 Mar 2023, 08:19
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RooinekCaptain18,117 posts
24 Mar 2023, 14:54
#41
24 Mar 2023, 14:54#41

Just answer the question you cowardly, low-class moron. Which of those is a crime? What did I mention that was a crime that he might be prosecuted for?

Your stupid response to my post was to ask me "have (sic) he been prosecuted for the crimes" . . . now I'm asking you what crimes?

Idiot.


CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
24 Mar 2023, 15:31
#42
24 Mar 2023, 15:31#42

Moron

You are a total nun-plussed doos.   That type of issues could be proved in a court of law when there is a crime committed and the blame on the defendant is that he is what you said is the case of Mc Gregor.as reqason for the crime committed.    

I asked you specifically for proof of your allegations about Mc Gregor and so far you have provided zero.   You are a notorious liar on site and has been ever since 2015 - nowadays it si different - when anybody support peace in Ukraine and a peaceful and fair settlement of the problems - he or she is suddenly a supporter of Putin - because you have no real contribution to make.   So is that the case with McGregor too?    If it is it shows two things - your brain has been taken over by propaganda shit and secondly you ave no idea how to evaluate BS.            

   

CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
25 Mar 2023, 03:53
#43
25 Mar 2023, 03:53#43

Rooinek Doos

You, have no evidence supporting your lies as to McGregor and now like the coward you always are you bolted from this thread.   

CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
25 Mar 2023, 04:45
#44
25 Mar 2023, 04:45#44

Stav

"You come up with  "How do you know" and whenever "the rightwing media state something" you say I believe it on site - but the same questions can be asked of you. 

We can provide evidence to back up what we say. You have been asked in the past to do so but you never do, you just ignore that and repeat the same talking points."

This answer is pure BS.   I have given you historical and other facts repeatedly  going back in history to the 13 hundreds  and there never was an independent country of Ukraine until 1991. What there was from 1919 was a so-called Republic that was part of the USSR - which is not the case as the present Russian Government.     I also indicated that  the Communist Regime believed that the Ukrainians betrayed the USSR in WW2 and  in 1953 decided to incorporate areas that never before in history was part of Ukraine into the so-called USSR became part of Ukraine.   That is a FACT as well.   I often gave FACTUAL information about how the Independent State of Ukraine was established in 1991 and made reference to the Constitution.     The present problems in Ukraine stemmed from the funding and organizing the 2014 COUP in Ukraine and referred to a video in which the then Assistant Secretary of State indicated how the USA decided on who should be in the Interim Government of Ukraine after the Coup.    Whomsoever she suggested got the posts she mentioned.   You ignore the reasons for breaking out of the Civil War in  Ukraine and the fact that the Crimea had its own Parliament as provided for in the 1991 Constitution and that Parliament had to deal with the situation where the total discarding of the 1991 Constitution  as a result of the 2014 Coup left a void insofar as the Crimea is concerned.   The resultant  decision of the Crimea Parlaiment and referendum was without any proof on your part was illegitimate   I mentioned the factual issue of the banning of using and teaching of Russin in schools in Ukraine - the arrest of the Russian speaking members of the Ukraine Parliament - FACTS as well - and the general oppression of the 32% Russian speaking citizens living in Ukraine.  I dealt with the 2015 Minsk Agreement on a cease-fire and how the unconstitutional Regime in Ukraine could be legitimized through a new Constitution for the country.

WHAT DID YOU CAME UP WITH - newspaper reports from the propaganda reports in Ukraine and now a remark made by an ex-President of Russia that dealt in the main by the effort to somehow get rid of Putin as President of Russia and made comments on the  historical facts about the non-existence of Ukraine as a country in Europe ever since the fall of Kiev to the Mongolian Golden Hoard in the 13 hundreds.   The Kiev area was part of the Rurikid kingdom - who was previously governed from Novgorod.   By the way the Russian Orthodox Church moved there headquarters to Moscow from Kiev after the fall of that city - which became part of the Polish-Lithuanian Confederation and there is close similarity between the Polish and Ukrainian languages largely because Ukraine was part of the Polish kingdom for hundreds of years until the 1770's when the kingdom was divided between Russia, The Holy Roman Empire under the Habsburgs and Prussia.

ANYAY WHAT DID YOU EVER CAME UP WITH - NO PROOF OF ANYTHING BAR NEWSPAPER REPORTS.

"The problem is that whenever the lies are exposed you still find some excuse for what you wrote on site of which you have no proof anyway.

You never expose any lies, you just repeat nonsense conspiracy theories without backing them up with evidence".     

What did I lie about as claimed by you.   You believed the MEDIA  BS and lies about the Collusion between Trump and Putin - concocted by the Obama Administration, the Democratic Party and the Clinton Election campaign  and refused to accept it was based on lies - those are very real lies and based on fake propaganda which you fell for totally.  That makes you a liar  that can never be relied on to produce any factual information.   It was the main media political story for 5 years and it still is.    When you were confronted with factual information and asked for what you based your arguments on - you came up with a newspaper report from the Guardian and then could not understand why i thought it funny - The Guardian is total propaganda BS - end of story.  

For the real facts you are talking total shit.   I referred to the fact that the REVOLUTION WAS FUNDED BY THE USA  EMBASSY AS WELL AS a video of Nuland in which she discussed the appointment of a new Government in Ukraine.   You call it a revolution - but if a revolution is funded by a foreign power who decides on who should be in Government after the Revolution  it is a coup - whether you like it or not.    You call it a revolution - which is your description shouting against facts - so in your book a revolution is a description of being a regime change provided for in the Ukraine Constitution?       

That same women admitted the existence of Bio-labs in Ukraine under oath in the Senate - which you claimed do not exist.   They do exist even a new one was built and operated in Odessa in 2018.   Why did Nuland admitted in the Senate the bio-Labs exist - she could not do it otherwise since she would end up in jail for lying to the Senate about it.   I really laughed my arse off about your explanation based on zero facts why the US Government wants the pathogens destroyed to prevent it from falling in Russian Hands.    If they do the US government will end up in hundreds of court cases being implicated in research that could endanger  the whole world population through pandemics like the Covid 10 one - which also came from a US funded Bio-lab in Wuhan.    Do you think the criminal regime in Washington would survive that one?   

           

                           

 

CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
25 Mar 2023, 04:45
#45
25 Mar 2023, 04:45#45

Duplication

DB
DbDraadCaptain26,388 posts
25 Mar 2023, 11:30
#46
25 Mar 2023, 11:30#46

Maaik, why are you getting so upset with Rudeneck?...I know he can be a pain, but chill, don't let it get to you too much .

ST
Stavanger1Pro4,532 posts
25 Mar 2023, 11:30
#47
25 Mar 2023, 11:30#47
This answer is pure BS.   I have given you historical and other facts repeatedly  going back in history to the 13 hundreds
No you go off on historical tangents which are frequently inaccurate and often irrelevant to the topic being discussed, not doubt deliberately as a way of avoiding questions. You claim things as fact but provide no evidence to support the claim.

and there never was an independent country of Ukraine until 1991.
So what...every country came in to assistance at some point in time. Ireland didn't exist till 1921, there never had been an Irish state until that point. All your doing is repeating Russian propaganda that attempts to undermine the existence of the Ukrainian state. Hitler spoke the same way about Poland before he attacked it.
 I also indicated that  the Communist Regime believed that the Ukrainians betrayed the USSR in WW2

You never said it was what the communist regime believe, your where arguing that point yourself. And its another of example of historical ignorance. Yes there was some collaboration with the Germans in the west of the country at the start of the invasion. It didn't last once the Germans turned out to be so brutal. Far more Ukrainians fought in the Soviet army against the Germans. Hundreds of thousands of Ukrainians where decorated for bravery fighting against the Germans.
That is a FACT as well.   I often gave FACTUAL information about how the Independent State of Ukraine was established in 1991 and made reference to the Constitution.

Typing fact in capital letters does not make something fact. FACT
The present problems in Ukraine stemmed from the unding and rganizing the 2014 COUP in Ukraine and referred to a vcideo in which the then Assistant Secretary of State indicated how the USA decided on who should be in the Interim Government of Ukraine after the Coup.

Alright Mike, brilliant, here's your chance to prove me wrong and shut me up.Please provide a link to where evidence is providing of the funding and organizing of the 2014 COUP as you call it. I assume this is funding by the US/CIA. Also please provide a link to the video of the assistant secretary of state picking the Interim Government of Ukraine.

Now here's the thing Mike. I don't want a history lesson, I don't need to hear about Russia/Ukraine/Crimea going back to the 13th century. I don't want to hear about the corrupt Democrats unless its specifically in relation the funding and organizing of the coup. I want you to provide evidence to back up those two claims.
Surely there is some evidence like audio recordings or a paper trail for the money.

Whomsoever she suggested got the posts she mentionedHere's the thing you won't be able to post a link to a video because I know what you refer to is actually an audio recording of part of a phone call.
https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-26079957

I already explained this to you in my previous post. Who she referred to was the leader of the main opposition party in Ukraine at the time and always the most likely man to take over once Yanukovych was toppled from power, not someone the American's plucked out of thin air. Its not a case of her choosing anyone, its merely a discussion on who they think is the person bested suited to take over out of the 3 main opposition leaders and Yatseniuk was the guy they thought best suited due to his previous economic and government experience.
You ignore the reasons for breaking out of the Civil War in  Ukraine and the fact that the Crimea had its own Parliament as provided for in the 1991 Constitution and that Parliament had to deal with the situation where the total discarding of the 1991 Constitution  as a result of the 2014 Coup left a void insofar as the Crimea is concerned.
When did I ignore them?
the resultant  decision of the Crimea Parlaiment and referendum was without any proof on your part was illegitimate

Of course it was illegitimate, Russia had illegally seized Crimea and then ran a referendum with their military present. Its farcical to suggest the referendum was legitimate.

I mentioned the factual issue of the banning of using and teaching of Russin in schools in Ukraine
No you misrepresented that.
- the arrest of the Russian speaking members of the Ukraine Parliament - FACTS as well
Another misrepresentation, Zelenskyy himself was primarily a Russian speaker before the war. Many of the current Ukrainian government can also speak Russia. Yes opposition members have indeed been arrested but they where arrested due to their ties to Russia. Now I doubt the if the arrests have merit in each case. But I do no its being done under the rather extreme circumstance of Ukraine being invaded by Russia and no doubt done due to fears these people might work with the invading Russians. You our course conveniently leave out the context of the arrests.
and the general oppression of the 32% Russian speaking citizens living in Ukraine.

They where not being oppressed. Yes there was some unhappiness over Ukrainian language laws, but that's a far cry from warranty an invasion from Russia, and invasion which has killed thousands of Russian speakers. And again you leave out the context of the Ukrainian language laws being a partial by product of Russian stealing Ukrainian territory back in 2014.
I dealt with the 2015 Minsk Agreement on a cease-fire and how the unconstitutional Regime in Ukraine could be legitimized through a new Constitution for the country.
Minsk was always a flawed solution, open to different interpretations by both sides. Its 100% dead now anyway thanks to the Russian invasion.
WHAT DID YOU CAME UP WITH - newspaper reports from the propaganda reports in Ukraine and now a remark made by an ex-President of Russia that dealt in the main by the effort to somehow get rid of Putin as President of Russia and made comments on the  historical facts about the existence of Ukraine as a country in Europe ever since the fall of Kiev to the Mongolian Golden Hoard in the 13 hundreds.

Irrelevant. Ukraine has every right to exist as a sovereign nation as it has done since 1991.

The rest of your post is just rehash of the some nonsense you have posted for years.

DB
DbDraadCaptain26,388 posts
25 Mar 2023, 11:40
#48
25 Mar 2023, 11:40#48

"Oh well, you Puitin apologists will be glad to know you have Julius Malema in your corner. Read here. No big surprise that a hater like Julius is on the same page as you lot."

I don't like agreeing with you, but you're right..Zuma and DD Mabuza are also  thick as thieves with Russia...and now Malema...it should be obvious who the bad guys are...

PS: The ANC is looking at legal options to let Putin visit South Africa without having to arrest him as per the international warrant of arrest...screw the ANC and whoever their allies are, Putin included.

CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
25 Mar 2023, 13:27
#49
25 Mar 2023, 13:27#49

Draad

I do not support the Ukraine invasion nor do I support Putin - what i do not support is the politicians in the USA and those include mostly Democrats and some Republicans  in corruption and money-laundering in Ukraine with Taxpayer money being laundered back to he USA for the benefit of Politicians.     Corruption in the Ukraine was always a major problem - it was the most corrupt country in Europe and US politicians  got involved in corruption in that country.   Manaford (Trump's initial Campaign Manager in 2016) was involved as a partner of Podesta in corruption in Ukraine.   Incidentally Mueller mentioned Manaford in his investigations but no 2 (Podesta)  was never mentioned by him. 

Clinton used the Clinton Foundation got $38 million after the IMF gave asszistance to the une of $15 billion to Ukraine and the money went to a Bank that since then has been closed town due to corruption.    The Biden, Pelosi and Schoff corruption in Ukraine going back to 2014 was discussed in detail before on site.   Be assured there are plenty of evidence on those activities found - but the FBI and Justice Department has constantly refused to even investigate  corrupt activities of US Politicians.  

The War in Ukraine increased corruption of politicians to an unlimited extent.   Take for instance the FXP case.   Shortly after the arms assistance in Ukraine was announced by Biden the House voted a bill giving $1 billion to Ukraine as budgetary assistance.   Three days after approval Pelosi and Schiff was in Ukraine to deal with issue and a major part of the money was invested by the Ukraine Government in FTX - like all investments in FTX the money vanished in thin air.  What has been exposed was a grant of R70 million in assistance to fund the mid-term election in November last year.    There was also $230 000 given to Senator Romney to assist in funding of a so-called independent candidate he supported against the Republican candidate in the Utah Senate election.   Where the rest of the money went may come out when the House investigate it - but it is already clear that much of it ended up in corrupt payments to politicians and bureaucrats.

Asange claimed at one stage based on documents that he Arms Industry thrive when the USA is involved - the big thing was that backhanders are ingrained in the arms procurement process. 

We all know where FTX have gone and the source for backhanders went with it.   So what happened next.  This week an assistant of Zelenskyy was caught with $15 million in cash on the Hungary Border.   Where did that money come from and where was it going.   It obviously involved corruption.   

I was from the start against the war in Ukraine and believed it could have been avoided buy negotiation and that USA political corruption led to sabotaging of negotiation by the USA.   The present scenario in Ukraine is  atrocious and was avoidable if there was an international will to stop it - but there was no will to do anything about it.

                                       

— END OF THREAD —

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