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What is conspiracy theories and what is not?

Started by clevermike40 REPLIES742 VIEWS· 06 May 2020, 15:06
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CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
06 May 2020, 15:06
#1
06 May 2020, 15:06#1

Claims from the both White House and conspiracy theorists worldwide that the new coronavirus was developed by Chinese scientists have been shot down by Western intelligence agencies.

On Sunday, US Secretary of State Mike Pompeo said: “I can tell you that there is a significant amount of evidence that this came from that laboratory in Wuhan.”

But The Guardian reports that intelligence sources say the allegations are not supported by information gathered by the Five Eyes network, a secret information-sharing alliance between the UK, US, Australia, New Zealand and Canada.

So why is speculation about the origins of the global pandemic continuing to spread?

How popular are conspiracy theories?

Conspiracy theories are not a new phenomenon, and most people subscribe to them even if they don’t realise it, according to experts.

“Everybody believes in at least one and probably a few,” Professor Joe Uscinski, a political scientist and author of American Conspiracy Theories, told the BBC. “And the reason is simple: there is an infinite number of conspiracy theories out there. If we were to poll on all of them, everybody is going to check a few boxes.”

In 2018, an international study by researchers at the University of Cambridge and YouGov found that 60% of British people believed at least one conspiracy theory about how the country is run or the veracity of information they have been given.

Why do people believe conspiracy theories?

People’s pre-existing notions and prejudices tend to influence which conspiracy theories they are more likely to believe.

For example, the 2018 study showed that 47% of Brexit supporters believed the government had deliberately concealed the truth about how many immigrants lived in the UK, versus just 14% of Remain voters.

And 31% of Leave voters believed that Muslim immigration was part of a wider plot to make Muslims the majority in Britain, compared with 6% of Remain voters.

The phenomenon isn’t confined to the UK. The study -  conducted over six years in a total of nine countries - found that in the US, 47% of Donald Trump voters believed that man-made global warming was a hoax, compared with 2.3% of people who had voted for Hillary Clinton in the 2016 presidential election.

But conspiracies work both ways: people with more progressive views are more likely to believe conspiracy theories that undermine right-wing figures.

“People feel they belong to their group but it also means that people feel a certain sense of antagonism towards people in the other group,” Professor Sara Hobolt, a political scientist at the London School of Economics, told the BBC.

“When you actually look at the demographic data, belief in conspiracies cuts across social class, it cuts across gender and it cuts across age,” added Professor Chris French, a psychologist at Goldsmith’s, University of London.

The experts point out that while humanity’s ability to recognise trends and notice things that “don’t look right” was crucial to the successful evolution of our species, it can also be to our detriment.

“We are very good at recognising patterns and regularities. But sometimes we overplay that - we think we see meaning and significance when it isn't really there,” says French. “We also assume that when something happens, it happens because someone or something made it happen for a reason.”

Fake theories become even more popular when the normal world order is upset - such as during an unprecedented global pandemic.

”Conspiracy theories become more prominent in times of crisis and this has a lot to do with uncertainty,” Karen Douglas, a professor of social psychology at the University of Kent, told Harper’s Bazaar.

“People need explanations for significant events, and when information from official channels is incomplete, inconsistent, or continually unfolding – as is the case with coronavirus – we often look for quicker, simpler explanations.” 

Do conspiracies matter?

Conspiracies may not be based in reality but they can have an influence on the real world.

“Conspiracy theories are, and as far as we can tell always have been, a pretty important part of life in many societies, and most of the time that has gone beneath the radar of the established media,” said John Naughton, one of three University of Cambridge professors who led the 2018 research.

Speaking to The Guardian after publishing their findings, Naughton added: “Insofar as people thought of conspiracy theories at all, we thought of them as crazy things that crazy people believed, [and that] didn’t seem to have much impact on democracy.”

But events in recent years have proved that disregarding facts in favour of wild theories can have a significant impact on national and international government policy.

“Whatever else you think of Trump, he is a born conspiracy theorist. Trump was a kind of catalyst, in that somehow his election had the effect of mainstreaming conspiracy theories,” Naughton continued.

Perhaps unsurprisingly, conspiracy theories don’t make people feel any better, Professor Douglas told Harper’s.

“Rather than decreasing uncertainty, research suggests that conspiracy theories actually increase it,” she explained. “The same goes for feelings of powerlessness and disillusionment. People might look to [fake news] to try to gain a sense of power and trust, but instead they feel worse because it feeds into their fear.”

Viren Swami, a professor at Anglia Ruskin University and expert in the psychology of conspiracy theories, says that this feeling of powerlessness can have damaging and potentially lethal results.

“Conspiracy theories give people a sense of agency at a time when they lack control. So, if I’m at home self-isolating and I’m anxious and fearful and disconnected from the wider world, a conspiracy theory can help to personify the problem,” Swami told the magazine.

“Suddenly, I have someone to blame, whether it be a Chinese laboratory worker or the American government. The problem with this is that instead of feeling anxious, I now have permission to act, to do something. And that can led to anything from a spike in xenophobia to people believing absurd and potentially very dangerous false medical advice.”

Indeed, the FBI  has identified fringe conspiracy theories as a domestic terrorist threat, according to a pre-coronavirus intelligence bulletin seen by Yahoo! News.

The internal document, dated May 2019, warned that such theories “very likely will emerge, spread, and evolve in the modern information marketplace, occasionally driving both groups and individual extremists to carry out criminal or violent acts”.

The 2020 presidential election was likely to further fuel the dangerous trend, the bulletin added.

No lets get to the real problem.  


I highlighted a real conspiracy story above.  The reason is that the term is abused and often enough by the media.   The Five Eye network report was not entirely clear and indicated that further investigations was necessary.   The Chinese as a result threatened the Australia Government with sanctions if any further investigations were proceeded with.   That was hidden by the Guardian in their response.  Why should the Chinese threatened sanctions if the investigations are taken further,  Instead the Guardian in fact started a new conspiracy  theory despite the Five Eyes further investigation. 

The question remains – what is really conspiracy theories and what is not?   I would say that where there is documentary evidence of anything it is NOT a conspiracy theory and the facts must be investigated properly.

In other words conspiracy theories are fairy tales started to divert attention away from real investigations based on real factual information.   The latter is widely the case in the USA,  For instance while the Democrats attacked Trump for collusion with Russia in the 2016 election – there is written evidence that the factual situation was  that it actually was Clinton and the Democrats who colluded with the Russians in 2016.   While Trump asked the new Ukraine President to look into corruption allegations against Biden and his son – the Democrats twisted it into a political issue.

The following is an endemic problem all over the world and leftists use it extensively:-

But conspiracies work both ways: people with more progressive views are more likely to believe conspiracy theories that undermine right-wing figures.”

In the USA in particular such stories is used 24/7 by leftist media outlets and believed by the leftists in the Democratic Party and by some members on site,  


DB
DbDraadCaptain26,388 posts
06 May 2020, 21:08
#2
06 May 2020, 21:08#2

Lots of conspiracy theories turn into conspiracy facts...it's extremely naive to think everything is what it seems.

CE
CeradynePro9,374 posts
06 May 2020, 22:52
#3
06 May 2020, 22:52#3

Who would be more connected to Five Eyes, Pompeo or The Guardian?

Bear in mind that it is the Guardian are talking about. 

The Five Eyes (FVEY) is also not such a mysterious secret organisation. It is merely the a treaty between the Intelligence Communities of five allied countries, ie the USA, UK, Australia, Canada and New Zealand. The purpose is to share mutual intelligence. Simple as that. 

Where it becomes a bit complicated is where the other extended agreements come into play. That is where other countries are added under certain circumstances. Generally there is the other less overt one, referred to as the Five Eyes Plus Three were certain kinds of intelligence is shared between FVEY including Singapore, Israel and Japan, IIRC. 

There are also other versions of FVEY Plus 3 combinations where you have FVEY and other countries working together for common causes. All of them have  original FVEY countries but with three other different countries involved. You have, for example FVEY+3 against NK, FVEY+3 against Russia, FVEY+3 against China, etc. 

And then, just to compliment matters even more, there is a Six Eyes, Nine Eyes, Thirteen Eyes. 

That is apart from all the other numerous ad hoc intelligence treaties. 

DB
DbDraadCaptain26,388 posts
08 May 2020, 09:05
#4
08 May 2020, 09:05#4

 

RO
RooinekCaptain18,117 posts
08 May 2020, 09:44
#5
08 May 2020, 09:44#5
"In other words conspiracy theories are fairy tales started to divert attention away from real investigations based on real factual information.  "
Wehe . . . so the naive and gullible buffoon who just yesterday gave us this hilarious fake news story about the Labuschagne "brothers" . . . this same dull-witted retard has the arrogance and the gall to lecture other posters on believing fairy tales?
LMAO!
PL
PlumCaptain21,007 posts
08 May 2020, 09:53
#6
08 May 2020, 09:53#6

Rooi,

Why not attack the argument? 

Doesn't it get boring going after the man instead of his ideas? 

Insults are a good intro/outro but really, if that's all there is, then what's the point. Perhaps you see some value in it that I don't.

Care to share?

RO
RooinekCaptain18,117 posts
08 May 2020, 09:59
#7
08 May 2020, 09:59#7

Plum, ou Maaik is a confirmed liar. I have no interest in his arguments or what he thinks about anything as I have no respect for liars. I do however think it's worth commenting on his brazen audacity in lecturing other people on fake news when he was the gullible dimwit who swallowed fake news just yesterday.

Okay?

On another point, I'm surprised you're still addressing me given that you think I'm Sonny Bill. I would certainly not waste any time on a poster that I thought was Sonny Bill so what's your excuse?

PA
PakieCaptain17,321 posts
08 May 2020, 10:05
#8
08 May 2020, 10:05#8

There is always some conspiracy going on somewhere. If we think this is just a normal little virus that popped out and now everyone is trying their level best to fix it as best they can and reporting the numbers to the best of their abilities and silencing frontline doctors in the best interest of the people and locking in healthy people who are at minimum risk from this virus for their own protection while destroying livelihoods and economies in the process, we need to think again.

Or to take our situation locally, if you really think the ANC, who hasn't given two shits about public health for decades now, is banning cigarettes "for the people's health", you need to think again. Likewise, if you think they're restricting online trade, which no other country is doing as far as I know, because they care about other businesses who cannot trade online or about too much traffic or whatever lame excuses they came up with, you also need to reconsider.

What is going on here, who knows. But it's not a simple little virus outbreak being honestly handled in the best way possible by all concerned.

DB
DbDraadCaptain26,388 posts
08 May 2020, 10:15
#9
08 May 2020, 10:15#9

Yes Pakie, but it looks like more and more people are speaking out and starting to question the narrative. It's hilarious to hear the radio presenters trying to steer the experts into confirming their narrative and not succeeding. Journalists have become bullies and just like school bullies, they also crumble when confronted without fear. Lots of people waking up.  

DB
DbDraadCaptain26,388 posts
08 May 2020, 10:42
#10
08 May 2020, 10:42#10

“If you destroy a free market you create a black market.”

—House of Commons, 3 February 1949

Churchill added: “If you make ten thousand regulations you destroy all respect for the law.”

PL
PlumCaptain21,007 posts
08 May 2020, 10:47
#11
08 May 2020, 10:47#11

Plum, ou Maaik is a confirmed liar. I have no interest in his arguments or what he thinks about anything as I have no respect for liars. I do however think it's worth commenting on his brazen audacity in lecturing other people on fake news when he was the gullible dimwit who swallowed fake news just yesterday.

So an audacious liar is not capable of making a pertinent enough point to break through the ceiling of your perceived characterisation of them? There's more value in solidifying the characterisation than there is in anything else they have to say? 

Let's remove them all, shall we...lairs, cheats, criminals, the arrogant, the hypocrites...bye bye. As a networking guy, I'm surprised that you're happy with that amount of redundancy. I'm not.

On another point, I'm surprised you're still addressing me given that you think I'm Sonny Bill. I would certainly not waste any time on a poster that I thought was Sonny Bill so what's your excuse?

See the above...

RO
RooinekCaptain18,117 posts
08 May 2020, 11:25
#12
08 May 2020, 11:25#12

Oh dear . . . looks like Plum is no longer able to distinguish between real life and this trivial message board.

With regard to this message board, my answer to your questions are yes. In real life and in general, I may make a few exceptions.

DB
DbDraadCaptain26,388 posts
08 May 2020, 11:28
#13
08 May 2020, 11:28#13

 

SH
sharkbokCaptain23,209 posts
08 May 2020, 11:31
#14
08 May 2020, 11:31#14
Plump is a moralising twat. He seems to see himself as the objective impartial moderator that considers all possibilities until he gets outsmarted by Cloudy and then he loses his rag. Or when one of his alien conspiracy theories is challenged he cries himself to sleep face in the pillow. 
PL
PlumCaptain21,007 posts
08 May 2020, 11:34
#15
08 May 2020, 11:34#15

... say's Rooi as he takes his ball and goes home. 

PL
PlumCaptain21,007 posts
08 May 2020, 11:37
#16
08 May 2020, 11:37#16

Hi VrotVis.

Did you hear, Tyson is making a comeback?

Perhaps you should look him up and ask him if he'll hit the stink off you for once and for all.

It only sounds silly until you realise that we've tried everything else. 

SH
sharkbokCaptain23,209 posts
08 May 2020, 11:44
#17
08 May 2020, 11:44#17
Yes crybaby, how many times have you announced your departure from the board? Only to return a few months later snivelling with your tail behind your legs... 10 pillows later...
RO
RooinekCaptain18,117 posts
08 May 2020, 11:46
#18
08 May 2020, 11:46#18
"Plump is a moralising twat. He seems to see himself as the objective impartial moderator that considers all possibilities until he gets outsmarted by Cloudy and then he loses his rag."
Indeed, Plumchum has become a lot braver since Cloudy hasn't been around to humiliate him and send him off on one of his self-pitying tirades .
PL
PlumCaptain21,007 posts
08 May 2020, 11:54
#19
08 May 2020, 11:54#19

Yowsers, you two are prickly this early on a Friday. Save some energy for tonight boys. Who knows? Hell may freeze over and you may get laid.

 


RO
RooinekCaptain18,117 posts
08 May 2020, 12:48
#20
08 May 2020, 12:48#20
"Save some energy for tonight boys. Who knows? Hell may freeze over and you may get laid."
Pfffffhahahaha!
This from the weak loser who had to pretend that one of our lady posters was making advances to him and who was prepared to ruin her reputation just to make himself feel more like a man!
PL
PlumCaptain21,007 posts
08 May 2020, 13:12
#21
08 May 2020, 13:12#21

Simp much, Rooi?

Rooi >>> Googles "simping"

haha

DE
DennyCaptain12,893 posts
08 May 2020, 13:12
#22
08 May 2020, 13:12#22

I don't post these days but I couldn't resist the opportunity to add my 2 cents about a coward who's slunk off the board numerous times in utter humiliation. Instead he tried the tough guy stuff on a lady poster. Clean Cut kakked in his face, insulted him, humiliated him, called him out amongst other things a Poodipper and not once did he retaliate or put up an ongoing argument like he did with Cloudy. Noted that now he and the low life Clean Cut are the best of buddies(talk about choosing your friends) even though Clean Cut has never apologized, neither has Plum demanded an apology.

Let's sit back and wait for Cloudy's returns so that once again the self important "tough guy" can show us what a macho man he is.

RO
RooinekCaptain18,117 posts
08 May 2020, 13:34
#23
08 May 2020, 13:34#23

True that. 

Klown used to regularly accuse Plumchum of things like sodomizing his girlfriend and using anal probes on himself, calling him a sick f#$k and a pervert . . . and Plumchum just took it on the chin and rather vented his anger and pent up frustration on Cloudy who never said anything remotely as rude or hostile to him.

I don't think Plumchum is the bravest, noblest or most chivalrous poster we've ever had on these boards.

DE
DennyCaptain12,893 posts
08 May 2020, 13:43
#24
08 May 2020, 13:43#24

‘It's good that you defend yourself ... don't let him back you up. Stand firm, Lara.

He's a sick fuck ...  a pervert ... with some strange beliefs ... not the type you'd want over for a barbecue and a few cold beers.

Dismiss him for the piece of shit he is and don't allow him to get you riled up.’


PL
PlumCaptain21,007 posts
08 May 2020, 14:02
#25
08 May 2020, 14:02#25

Welcome back Den Den


Glad I could bring you out again. Sunlight...disinfectant, you know the drill.

Wanna tell us some more about those rednecks in the USA that you look down upon? Perhaps the bogans in OZ? If you don't mind, please finish off by telling us how you hated being discriminated against. Ja know , just to round out your story neatly.

Go on, what's the skinny?



RO
RooinekCaptain18,117 posts
08 May 2020, 14:05
#26
08 May 2020, 14:05#26

Hmmmm . . . sounds to me like Plumchump is struggling to . . . ummmm, how did it go again . . . break through the ceiling of his perceived characterizations of other posters.

Plumchum would do well to hold himself to the same standards that he holds others . . . he'd definitely come across as less of a stinking hypocrite if he did.

CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
08 May 2020, 14:06
#27
08 May 2020, 14:06#27

Now lets get back to what is in the starting thread,   It deals with conspiracy theories and I just look at some of the theories and comments on what was written.   I did not accuse anybody on site and plainly ask for comments,   

What do we get in return  - personal attacks and lies.   I saw an article about the Labuschagne's and put it on site and Rooinek said it was drivel.  I then thanked Rooinek for correcting it,    What followed on that was a personal attack on me.  

What is clear is that Rooinek and SB is thriving on conspiracy theories involving Trump and  streams of fake news stories are posted on site,   Most of those are plain lies,   They fall for it totally and produce  garbage on site,  None of them can even remotely reject what I wrote - hence the false deviation.    

   

   

DB
DbDraadCaptain26,388 posts
08 May 2020, 14:10
#28
08 May 2020, 14:10#28

Maaik, Rooinek has been looking for a reason to distance himself from you for a while now . Relax,, the mask was bound to drop sometime.

DE
DennyCaptain12,893 posts
08 May 2020, 14:11
#29
08 May 2020, 14:11#29

Is that your best? Man, you make me sick.

Now rack off, you and your dogs have a dinner date with Clean Cut. The guy who called you a Sicko... a Pervert.... a Poo-dipper...conveniently forgotten Huh!? The guy who swore he'd never invite you around. This isn't funny anymore.

And oh, you're not my cup of tea either.......how many more times do I have to tell you not to address me Huh?



RO
RooinekCaptain18,117 posts
08 May 2020, 14:11
#30
08 May 2020, 14:11#30

"Most of those are plain lies . . . "

Ou Maaik, if you'd like to see a plain and blatant lie followed by a cowardly disappearance, just click here.

Things that you're too stupid or biased to understand are not lies. A lie is what you said in that post I linked you to.

I know you're stupid, but do at least try to understand the difference.

DE
DennyCaptain12,893 posts
08 May 2020, 14:14
#31
08 May 2020, 14:14#31

"…..sounds to me like Plumchump is struggling..."

Precisely what happens when you're a witless and humorless, Bore.

PL
PlumCaptain21,007 posts
08 May 2020, 14:14
#32
08 May 2020, 14:14#32

Rooi, as you can attest to, I'm all for civility and only if you really persist, will I get my nibblers out. 

And even then, I'm always happy to go back to being buds. As you can also attest to.

Trust you to do draw the opposite inference from that to what you should have. 

Perhaps it's exactly why you're referred to as bitter. 


RO
RooinekCaptain18,117 posts
08 May 2020, 14:17
#33
08 May 2020, 14:17#33

Plumchum, I'm not sure what your nibblers are and I'm not sure I want to see you getting them out . . . but you're being a stinking hypocrite on this thread and if you can't see it for yourself then go ahead and do what you must. Just don't put up any pictures of your nibblers, okay?

DE
DennyCaptain12,893 posts
08 May 2020, 14:21
#34
08 May 2020, 14:21#34

The clown is saying that Clean Cut didn't "really persist" ......Geeez!

PL
PlumCaptain21,007 posts
08 May 2020, 14:23
#35
08 May 2020, 14:23#35

"Is that your best? Man, you make me sick."

No. Not even close. I'd bring out the best for the best...the shitty fong-kong versions, well I save those just for the likes of your levels Tannie Denise. Horses for courses

"...how many more times do I have to tell you not to address me Huh?"

You came here to talk about me...you even said you couldn't resist the opportunity. But I shouldn't address you? Honestly, you're sounding a bit frantic. Menopause tannie?




PL
PlumCaptain21,007 posts
08 May 2020, 14:28
#36
08 May 2020, 14:28#36

Hey tannie, are you gonna hit with one of your famous lines again ?

"Got it?"

or perhaps...

"Now run along?"

Haha beta!



DE
DennyCaptain12,893 posts
08 May 2020, 14:30
#37
08 May 2020, 14:30#37

Friggin hypocrite who had a mouthful to say about me in my absence and then in Afrikaans nogal, then cries like a baby when I tell him he's not my cup of tea.

Yep, that's about right, the Clean Cut is his level.

PL
PlumCaptain21,007 posts
08 May 2020, 14:33
#38
08 May 2020, 14:33#38

Your absence?

Did the menopause get you so hot that you transcended this realm?


DE
DennyCaptain12,893 posts
08 May 2020, 14:44
#39
08 May 2020, 14:44#39

" Just don't put up any pictures of your nibblers, okay? "


CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
08 May 2020, 15:06
#40
08 May 2020, 15:06#40

Rooinek is a guy that was atrocious when I joined another forum.   He carried on with his conduct and eventually I left the site,   When coming back on the request of Denny I found the fight between Denny and Mozart carrying on.  

I found differences with Mozart about Meyer and his selections and at times the relationship became bitter and not what it should have been - but that is beside the point.   I then started to comment on the Beeno's Trumpet and generally I avoided  getting involved om religious discussions and pleaded for it being discussed on site,    

By 2016 I favour Cruz as RP candidate, Rooinek favoured Rubio and Beeno favoured Trump,  Both Rooinek wrote and said that Trump will lose, but after listening to the ABC election result discussion it became clear that there were very real reasons why Trump go elected.  

That followed by a fire storm of absolute garbage from the media on site basically posted by SB and Rooinek.   I started to point out the fake news garbage and they did not like it,  That lead to the present situation.   I differ with Mozart and AO on rugby issues and  I will always do when they come up with unsubstantiated issues nobody else in the world accepted as fact.   

In the case of Rooinek and SB - they turn totally ballistic   when opposing facts are provided and that caused the present nervous collapse by Rooinek.   Hopes it blows over.         

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