GEgeneraltit
Pro3,164 posts
03 Mar 2015, 09:41#2
It is apartheid in reverse...political clap trap...pure manipulation, lies and deception.
Two wrongs never make a right...fairness and integrity in selection should never be based on colour,creed or class...when will mankind ever learn.
RORooinek
Captain18,117 posts
RORooinekCaptain18,117 posts
03 Mar 2015, 09:55#3
A few years ago a Springbok team with no whites was inconceivable . . . especially in the forward pack . . . but it's definitely not as outlandish as it used to be . . .
1. Beast Mtawarira
2. Scara Ntubeni
3. ?
4. Giant Mtayanda
5. Marvin Orie
6. Siya Kolisi
7. Oupa Mohoje
8. Tera Mtembu
9. Rudy Paige
10 Elton Jantjies
11 Lwazi Mvovo
12 Howard Mnisi
13 Sbura Sithole
14 Courtnall Skosan
15 Odwa Ndungane
16 Bandise Maku
17 Trevor Nyakane
18 ?
19 MB Lusaseni
20 Nizaam Carr
21 Kurt Coleman
22 Lionel Mapoe
23 Akona Ndungane
I'm just short tighthead props. Any suggestions?
03 Mar 2015, 10:08#4
Rooi, this thread is going to get ugly! Beans is going to have a field day.
As for your team, here are a couple of guys that could be included Cornal Hendricks, Bryan Habana, Gurthro Steenkamp, Chilliboy Ralepele, Brian Mujati. Just off the top of my head.
BObobbok...
Captain10,129 posts
BObobbok...Captain10,129 posts
03 Mar 2015, 10:18#5
I'm surprised that the current cricket team without Duminy & Philander in the lineup haven't come under fire .
03 Mar 2015, 10:51#6
blobbok, yet, they haven't come under fire YET!
03 Mar 2015, 10:57#7
It is as easy to pen down a team "non white" players but we can hardly call the above team a Springbok team now, can we. What are our chances even against teams like Scotland and Italy, let alone NZ, Oz, Ireland and England?
To add to that the number of over 30s in that team is enough to give Saffex and ou Maaikie heartburn for weeks.
And BTW, forget about Mujati. He will never play for SA again. The SA govt put a stop in that.
RORooinek
Captain18,117 posts
RORooinekCaptain18,117 posts
03 Mar 2015, 11:01#8
Oh look, here's the pedantic and sanctimonious nit-picker Ceradunce telling us what we're allowed to think or say.
sharkbok
Captain23,285 posts
sharkbokCaptain23,285 posts
03 Mar 2015, 18:25#9
The plan is to restore past imbalances of society by favouring non-white people.While their does seem to be some merit in this idea, the question then what is balance. What is the target for affirmative action goals.
Is it just making sure that 80% of everything is non-white, even if the majority of rugby players in South Africa have Afri-kaans as their first language.
I doubt the Sharks would currently be a competitive team without the majority of players having Afri-kaans as their first language. Things may change in the future, but at the moment rugby has most of it roots in South Africa amongst Afri-kaans people.
Even most of the coloured players have Afri-kaans as their first language. Breyton Paulse I believe is a commentator in Afri-kaans since he retired from rugby.
GEgeneraltit
Pro3,164 posts
03 Mar 2015, 18:58#10
I THINK sharkbok understands the intentions of the false patrionising the world has for dark skinned, disadvantaged people, which is due to a huge complex that whities internationally have for these guys because of horrendous abuse...Hitler against Jews, Broederbond against English,Eugene Terblanche against Blacks, Australian government against Aboriginies and the white majority in SA against non-whites...the few that understood this and wanted to fix this were caught up by mass propaganda installed by manipulators (Ian Smith was genuine) and scoundrels with morals worst than Harold Wilson,Lenin,Stalin and Castro.
America chose a black president for precisely the same reasons...the biggest bog house hypocrits in the world...what's happened to this wonderful people the indigenous Red skins...I had a good friend who was a Sioux...a beautiful, sensitive young lady...one of the most prettiest and intelligent persons I ever met.
Absolute crap and bullcrap.
04 Mar 2015, 00:02#11
Any team that is forced to have 7 darkies in their match day 23 is in for a very black day at the office.
We can't even find 7 darkies to play in my club first XV. How the hell are we gonna find 7 players to fit into the provincial and international squads.
oh fok.
04 Mar 2015, 00:56#12
Likely Bok team this year featuring 7 non white players.
1. Beast2. Bismarck3. Coenie4. Etzebeth5. PSDT6. Louw/Coetzee7. Mohoje8. Vermeulen9. Du Preez10. Pollard11. Habana12. De Allende13. JP14. Hendricks15. Le Roux
16. Nyakane17. Strauss18. Jannie19. Flip20. Carr21. Reinach22. Lambie23. Serfontein
SASaffolk
Captain30,741 posts
SASaffolk Captain30,741 posts
04 Mar 2015, 11:00#13
Rooi.....Nyakane at 3 in your side
POpolyboy
Club Pro601 posts
04 Mar 2015, 13:47#14
Is "darkies" a commonly used non offensive term used in SA to describe non whites?
RORooinek
Captain18,117 posts
RORooinekCaptain18,117 posts
04 Mar 2015, 14:14#15
Polyboy, the word is considered offensive but, while I'm not condoning its use, it's definitely not as offensive as some of the alternatives.
AGAgPleezDeddy
Club Pro900 posts
AGAgPleezDeddyClub Pro900 posts
04 Mar 2015, 18:08#16
I think it is considered a little offensive, but I'm sure Chippo doesn't mean it in an offensive way.
04 Mar 2015, 18:25#17
I dont mean it in an offensive way at all. sorry if it came across like that.
For what its worth, i'm a darkie... but i cant stand the quota system
SASaffolk
Captain30,741 posts
SASaffolk Captain30,741 posts
04 Mar 2015, 19:12#18
Its fucking disgusting that those wankers in SA can even suggest a quota number in the national side, 20 odd years down the line
DBDbDraad
Captain26,388 posts
DBDbDraadCaptain26,388 posts
04 Mar 2015, 19:13#19
IMO it is not offensive. In the Western Cape we have what we call: coulered, white and black. The Koi San people are the majority and are known as "coulered" They have a great but eunique sense of humor. They nicked the whites "whiteys" and the Africans from Northern decent "darkies" because they are darker than the Koi people. The "Darkies" have their own nics for the the other groups. As a rule "whites" will be reluctant to use these terms because our recent history. It is unfortunate, but because of AA we still need to state our race for employment equity when we start a job. As a rule SAcans are quite relaxed when it comes to racial issues and it is rare that someone would use racial slurs to be offensive on purpose, but we have a way to go still before we will have Apartheid truly behind us because we mostly still live quite segregated.
AGAgPleezDeddy
Club Pro900 posts
AGAgPleezDeddyClub Pro900 posts
04 Mar 2015, 20:13#21
Don't fret Chippo, we know it wasn't meant offensively mate. Agreed regarding the quotas.
04 Mar 2015, 20:21#22
Pretty sure De Allende isn't classed as white, so fulfils part of the quota.
JWJust_win
Captain18,570 posts
JWJust_winCaptain18,570 posts
04 Mar 2015, 20:25#23
"Darkie" sounds offensive to me even if no offense was meant. There are many people who feel empowered to be racist when they hear such words.
Good on you for explaining yourself Chippo clearly you didn't mean any harm.
SASaffolk
Captain30,741 posts
SASaffolk Captain30,741 posts
05 Mar 2015, 16:01#24
de Allende is not black or coloured.....looks of Greek, Portuguese or Italian decent?
05 Mar 2015, 16:25#26
Racism will always exist.
Anyone who thinks otherwise is delusional.
We might not express it in public because it's politically incorrect to do so ... but have one race push another race's buttons and see what surfaces.
It's all a matter of tolerance.
There are many hypocrites like Just_Win about ... playing the decent citizen ... patting himself on the back ... telling the world what a nice fella he is ... that is until his TV's swiped by someone who's not of his race ...
POpolyboy
Club Pro601 posts
05 Mar 2015, 16:44#27
Chippo it reminded me of an incident a few years ago when ex All Black "Andy Haden" used the exact same term to describe, ironically, that he was sure the Canterbury Crusaders had a unofficial "quota" for the number of "darkies" in their playing 15. (I think it was 3). I think the inference was they were there for the power, pace and brawn but not their rugby brain. No offence taken from your remark which was why I phrased my question in a polite way. Haden however has a rep of being a Di.k.
SASaffolk
Captain30,741 posts
SASaffolk Captain30,741 posts
05 Mar 2015, 16:44#28
Either way, de Allende would not be classified as black or coloured and would not be one of the 7
05 Mar 2015, 17:33#29
Howcomes Steenkamp is part of the quota? He' s not black or coloured, just his a ridiculously strong tan.
RORooinek
Captain18,117 posts
RORooinekCaptain18,117 posts
05 Mar 2015, 18:06#30
Saffex, have you heard Damian de Allende speak? I also thought he was of some kind of Mediterrannean ancestry but he was interviewed the other day after his man of the match award and he sounds like he's from the dodgy side of Mitchell's Plain.
I'm sure if someone dug around a bit we could get him to qualify as one of our non whites!
As for the term "darkies" in South Africa, I'm not sure what dusty little towns some of you okes are posting from but if you use the term "darkies" here in Johannesburg, you'll find out very quickly that it is an offensive term. Don't take my word for it, next time some of you are in a business meeting with some BEE guys, refer to them as "darkies" and be sure to let us know how the rest of the meeting goes!
Having said that, I'm not accusing Chippo of being racist or anything . . . but polyboy asked the question and I gave an honest answer. It's an offensive term.
05 Mar 2015, 18:10#31
ANC has been after Bok rugby from the outset. Seen by many as one of the last bastions of white influence. With things getting more desperate politically for them expect them to demonstrate their power and influence to the masses with further quotas and interference yet to come.
I fear this World Cup could well be the last great Bok team we see for sometime.
SASaffolk
Captain30,741 posts
SASaffolk Captain30,741 posts
05 Mar 2015, 19:11#32
de Allende is SA born so the accent will not give his ancestry away......but who knows.....I did a google and it did not come up with much on him.
JWJust_win
Captain18,570 posts
JWJust_winCaptain18,570 posts
05 Mar 2015, 19:24#33
Cleancut : yes we all have our biases & prejudices but tolerating open racism (not that Chippo was) does promote it.
Being able to separate ourselves from others to protect the group is part of our make up as humans but it goes too far too often. Good stirring though
sharkbok
Captain23,285 posts
sharkbokCaptain23,285 posts
05 Mar 2015, 19:37#34
Samuel L Jackson often calls black people niggers in his movies. One example that springs to mind in Pulp Fiction.
Is it racist to use an offensive term to describe race- if you are of the same race?
It is like calling myself a whitey, have I offended myself and others who are Caucasian. I have a split personality so I will answer that tomorrow....
BObobbok...
Captain10,129 posts
BObobbok...Captain10,129 posts
05 Mar 2015, 19:48#36
The few de Allendes I knew in Cape Town claimed to be of Portugese descent, catholic & white . But, it might be a wise move for Damian to claim to be 'coloured', that black 7 quota requirement aint going to be easy to fulfil .
BObobbok...
Captain10,129 posts
BObobbok...Captain10,129 posts
05 Mar 2015, 19:54#37
Sharkbok, as the late great Peter Fatialofa, Samoan captain & legend once said , " you can call me a coconut, but you better make sure that we're friends " .
GEgeneraltit
Pro3,164 posts
05 Mar 2015, 21:05#38
Well I think it all depends in the tone and what's in the heart...there will always be ugly and bitter words when there's hurt...whether it's racial or even national...the right attitude is always to respect each other as individuals and not in groups...the perfect solution is to be colour blind and treat each individual on his/her merits alone.
The real truth is that there are good and bad people from every race and nation.
Grouping and generalisation is very inaccurate.We are expected to love, respect each other irrespective of race, background, nation...changing attitudes requires effort and unselfishness and that is putting your fellowmen before yourself or preconceived opinions and notions .
sharkbok
Captain23,285 posts
sharkbokCaptain23,285 posts
06 Mar 2015, 03:51#39
The next strategic transformation will be amount of starters, not just the match day squad.
Their is certainly enough talent coming through like Kolbe, Senatala so these guys need to get some chances at test level.
It will be harder in the forwards as their is more talent as outside backs than forwards. Paige is looking good so far for the Bulls but nothing to suggest international standard yet.
GEgeneraltit
Pro3,164 posts
06 Mar 2015, 07:52#40
There are obvious good players right across the colour bar...it should be natural selection based on merit only...there must NOT be a steriotype selection that's colour orientated that's my belief and my point.
Obviously there must be programs in place to uplift sport amongst the under priviledged and to further develope but selection alone must be based on merit and integrity...so many of this group and so many that group is programmed and does not make sense...give credit when it's due...ANC policy is tainted with bias. Selection must always be colour blind.
Affected selection is not right. If there are 7 or more coloured and blacks that are the BEST then they must be in the squad but on the otherhand, the same applies to whites...forced policy is nonsense.
