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FORUM / RUGBY /  Boks in name only....

Boks in name only....

Started by Mozart56 REPLIES1,372 VIEWS· 05 Apr 2020, 06:44
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SA
Saffolk Captain30,741 posts
06 Apr 2020, 20:58
#41
06 Apr 2020, 20:58#41
Bullshit you don’t make player of the year being blown away - he was on par with Brüssow in size and the power stakes but was a far better athlete The only reason Luke never found favour is because he had a misguided, worthless political agenda As a player he was an ideal 6 - good on the ground, but his greatest strength was his link role with the backs Great player but a completely wasted talent. On rugby merit he was our best 6 at the time. Schalk played 6 but with his size was far better suited to 7 or 8
CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
06 Apr 2020, 21:02
#42
06 Apr 2020, 21:02#42

Mozart 

In a way I agree with you - threatening to vomit on the Springbok jersey was an insult which he should never have said,  Fact is he subsequently said he regrets ever making that remark,  

Rugby is a team sport and having said that caused a major problem in the team,   When returning form Perth in 2008 after watching the test there I was on the same plane as the team and when collecting the luggage I was standing next to Burger,   Everyone wanted to talk to him and other team members and take photos with them and  they were jovial and friendly.  On  the other side of the luggage "belt" was Watson - he was sulking and not a single member of the public or any team member said anything to him.   

AU
AugenöffnerPro6,974 posts
07 Apr 2020, 01:01
#43
07 Apr 2020, 01:01#43

Watson as good as or better than Brussow? Brussow dominated the Tri Nations. Absolutely dominated McCaw, Pocock and George Smith. Think of it, he played the fool with a Wallaby loose trio that comprised 6.Elsom, 7.Smith, 8.Pocock. What did Watson ever do at test level? Brussow, alongside Morne and Fourie, turned our Lions tour around. Watson did nothing in 10 tests. Saffy, you are deluded. It's starting to have the appearance of something more serious than that.  

CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
07 Apr 2020, 03:53
#44
07 Apr 2020, 03:53#44

Which Tri-nations series did Brussow dominate opponents?  

AU
AugenöffnerPro6,974 posts
07 Apr 2020, 04:51
#45
07 Apr 2020, 04:51#45

"Which Tri-nations series did Brussow dominate opponents?"



And you called yourself a student of the game. Your knowledge of Bok rugby is laughable. 

CE
CeradynePro9,374 posts
07 Apr 2020, 10:33
#46
07 Apr 2020, 10:33#46
Two names I saw in the posts. Dlulani. He can not really be rated. He was a great player and he was just handed his chances when his career was cut short by a serious neck injury. I don’t think that really deserves to be included in lists on this thread. AFAIK he is still with the Bulls in some capacity. Didn’t he take over from Wynie Strydom? Mujati. I agree that his time in the Bok team was dodgy. To add to that his move from the Lions to WP was as also a shady affair at best. I would not blame that entirely on him, though. I would put a large part of the blame on his agent and, of course WP. They were well known for exploiting ways to strong arm players and coaches away from other sides. Think Cobus vd Merwe, Duane Vermeulen, Tiaan Whatshisname (hooker), Habana, Jaque Fourie.... Having said that, Saffex is right about his performance in England. He was really good when he played for Saints and he was one of their key players for a number of seasons. The Saints front row was formidable at the time.
CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
07 Apr 2020, 11:03
#47
07 Apr 2020, 11:03#47

Back to normal please.

Top of my list would be Morne followed closely by Albers - the pace-deficient loosie that was no loosie at all.  For the rest I am going with Dave's list.         

AU
AugenöffnerPro6,974 posts
07 Apr 2020, 14:33
#48
07 Apr 2020, 14:33#48

The most successful South African flyhalf of all time is a Bok in name only? You see Lügnerin, this is where you come undone. You overreach. Lets say that Morné indeed was a Bok in name only, now you have made it rather difficult to regard any other Bok 10 as substandard. Naas? What of him? His Bok record? Win/loss? What does that matter? Butch? Stransky? So what? Nothing matters any more. Tries? Points per test? Assists? Tackle percentage? Trophies? It all goes out the window as you've thrown every possible metric out the window just to label Morné as "worst of all time". You are rather childish and it amounts to an attack on Bok rugby itself, as you are demeaning scores of some of its proudest player records. Not a Bok fan at all, you just fancy a few young boys. 

CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
07 Apr 2020, 15:03
#49
07 Apr 2020, 15:03#49

No AO

Objective analysis is necessary in all cases. and the fact is one has to look at he abilities of players and not of anything else.   In essence Morne was a poor flyhalf - that is why he was dropped from the squad in 2012  and twice in 2014.
Making out that realizing the poor performance and abilities of Morne does not lead to negating other aspects of rugby,   In essence Morne was not a real pivot that help in backline play.   There were numerous reasons for that  statement,  as I mentioned repeatedly,    He ended up being a player who nearly never personally attacked the gain line, his kicking out of hand was inaccurate and  his only real asset was his kicking at goal.
One would expect that if Morne was indeed a top flyhalf he would have made hay at Stade Francais,   He did not and became the bench fyhalf for the club,   To rate a player highly despite that situation is  really a farce,
The fact is that player converting kicks at goal the way Morne managed to do did not stem from his on performances endeavours, but from mistakes made by the opposing teams  - normally when they were  under pressure -  or from activities of the Springbok team as a whole.   There were numerous other flyhalfs that may have had a slightly lower conversion rate than Morne,  but who were better all round players than Morne,      .    .               


AU
AugenöffnerPro6,974 posts
07 Apr 2020, 23:54
#50
07 Apr 2020, 23:54#50

So if he was really successful in France, he'd have been making hay? Is this a part time gig to his soccer career? 

CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
08 Apr 2020, 07:30
#51
08 Apr 2020, 07:30#51

I said he would have made hay - but did not,  Stade Francais in 2014 tried to get other French clubs to take over his contract and no club would fall for the disaster,  So he became the bench flyhalf for Stade Francais,  Eventually Morne got an offer from Brive in 2017, but when Meyer turned up as the coach Morne was called back to Stade.  When Meyer was effectively fired by Stade for near to destroying the club - Morne and Alberts were sent packing in mid-season.   

AU
AugenöffnerPro6,974 posts
08 Apr 2020, 08:05
#52
08 Apr 2020, 08:05#52

So the fact that Morné was unable to make hay was the reason they punished him with the bench? Interesting. Uh neva did thunk dat befaw. 

CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
08 Apr 2020, 09:57
#53
08 Apr 2020, 09:57#53

No club with a budget and real financial need for public support would damage themselves by playing a substandard player like Morne.   They had him on their books so use them s paringly from the bench was the way to go.   

Dimness - I had a look at all the games in the 2009 Tri-Nations series and Brussouw dominated nothing in that series in any respect.  That is why I ask you which year you allege he was a dominating factor,   Answer please.    

AU
AugenöffnerPro6,974 posts
08 Apr 2020, 10:27
#54
08 Apr 2020, 10:27#54

Mike, you are and still forever be a blind oaf. Brussow was a massive presence in that season. By far the most important Bok. No Brussow, we don't won't the Lions series, we don't win the Tri Nations. It's that simple. Ende. 

CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
08 Apr 2020, 10:46
#55
08 Apr 2020, 10:46#55

How - I am not looked out for him.   Maybe I was a bit harsh iro the Aussie tests - but in the NZ tests he was not prominent.

Lets get this straight - I never said Brussow was a Springbok in name only, I also indicated that Brussow became injury prone and by 2013 he was not effective anymore,    The fact is that Brussow was a all-round loosie who was better than the Tight 7 game used at the time by SA coaches,     No problem - but objective people need to asses performances objectively.      .  

AU
AugenöffnerPro6,974 posts
08 Apr 2020, 11:29
#56
08 Apr 2020, 11:29#56

Brussow had a fantastic 2015 RC. 

CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
08 Apr 2020, 13:46
#57
08 Apr 2020, 13:46#57

Dream on  - that was  the series when SA lost all three games played and where you claim the Springboks played better rugby then they did in the  2019 series where they won he RC.   The players were all between poor and very poor in t hose matches.   - eg in the NZ match Louw and Brussow gave a way 4 penalties at breakdowns - in the Argentine test he made 9 tackles and missed 3.   In the two tests played he carried balls 11 times and made 15 meters in the process. 

That is fantastic in your book?        

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