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I'm not sure....

Started by Denny5 REPLIES515 VIEWS· 12 Jul 2015, 04:18
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DE
DennyCaptain12,893 posts
12 Jul 2015, 04:18
#1
12 Jul 2015, 04:18#1

what's brought about the mass hysteria of a Bok win over a ramshackle W15. Are we that desperate and low on confidence to  create dreams and expectations of bigger things to come based on a win against a nothing side?


I'm not being ungrateful neither am I being dismissive but a reality check for some appears to be much needed.



On a positive  the game answered some very important questions eg. we now know we have a decent defence and we also have a new fresh and promising centre pairing ...thanks to our much maligned coach.

The game also uncorked the use by date players in Jannie and JP....one for HM to address.

We also live in hope of an injection when Vermeulen returns....if he returns in time for the WC.


It's early days, next week we'll be tested on foreign soil, Suncorp is not one of our better hunting grounds......let's not get ahead of ourselves.

CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
12 Jul 2015, 04:56
#2
12 Jul 2015, 04:56#2
Denny
The same thing happened in 2014 when the Springboks played World XV on much the same level.  That was followed by the Le Roux test against the Welsh and then the decay set in.  In the second test against Wales our Tight 5 went to pieces and remained so for the rest of 2014.
There were indeed some questions answered in the game -
*  the Tight 5 situation needs urgent attention; and*  the situation at center is not s bad as previous thought.
The issue of the Tight 5 will be answered more comprehensively next week and will be of vital importance if we want to have any chances in the upcoming tournaments 
Incidentally - after the game in 2014 Mozart kept up the very average  performance of Francois Steyn in that game as a shining example of why Steyn should be our present no 12 in tests.  

MO
MozartCaptain49,914 posts
12 Jul 2015, 05:56
#3
12 Jul 2015, 05:56#3
I can't recall that, but I do recall this classic of yours Tokkie after the world match last year. What an embarrassment.
For Meyer's sake I hope the Springboks win the test series against Wales - if they lose both tests - which is likely bearing in mind Meyer's squad selection - all hell is going to break lose, especially  in view of his preference for elderly Bulls and ex-Bulls players and his usage of foreign players ahead of SA based players.  
CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
12 Jul 2015, 08:53
#4
12 Jul 2015, 08:53#4
 Mozart
You did not recall quoting the comments you posted twice on Steyn's performance in the World 15 match last year after I pointed out that Steyn's performance since his return from France - both on test and Super 15 level - was lousy?   I then pointed out that the match you quoted was not a test and there was a whole debate on the test status issue attached to matches such as the one played yesterday.
That quote of mine was not an embarrassment.   The Welsh lost the first test following that match in June last year because of the brilliant performance of Willie le Roux in the first half of the match - but came very near to beating us because of the atrocious Tight 5 performance of the Springboks and Morne Steyn's BS at flyhalf.  That was followed by the embarrassing performances of Steenkamp and Jannie as props in the Argentine tests and the similar embarrassment of Morne when he came on from the bench in those two tests.   
The final nail in our coffin in the  RC campaign was the collapse of our victory chances in the Perth test where Morne Steyn on his own caused us the loss of that test.
In the AB test in Wellington it was Matfield's failure in the line-out late in the game where a line - up was set up to ensure a driving maul and Matfield fumbled the ball in the line-out.   That was followed by a line-out turnover involving Matfield in the Ellis Park test where we lost a line-out throw-in and the AB's scored a try taking the lead.  It was only the long-distance Lambie penalty conversion that saved that test for the Springboks - the conversion according to you at the time was not a "pressure kick".
The EOYT was an embarrassment because our Tight 5 malfunctioned completely in test after test and we only won the test against England because of the performance that Lambie and Reinach put in.   
What really was an embarrassment was your constant attack on certain players and your constant failure to recognize the real problems in the performance of the Springbok team.  You claim you know rugby - but should be ashamed of the ignorance you show in not recognize the team deficiencies that cause us an embarrassment in last years tests.   Jannie and Matfield was the real problems - get that into your thick skull.              
DE
DezertFoxPro2,288 posts
12 Jul 2015, 09:39
#5
12 Jul 2015, 09:39#5
 If the Boks stutter it won't be because of Bulls players, aside from Kriel. It will be because of our midfield and poor loose trio. The physicality we will face will be significantly higher than what the World XV gave. The Welsh know their patterns very well and have the confidence of uprooting The chaff last year when Meyer gave the fans what they wanted. I do not feel confident in this starting XV to stand up to that challenge. It's too flimsy in too many key areas. But the fans think they know better, so we will see. But I certainly would expect them to admit they were wrong if all goes badly, rather than the usual attack on Meyer for giving them what they want.
CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
12 Jul 2015, 10:17
#6
12 Jul 2015, 10:17#6
 I agree it will not be because of the Bulls players - i do not rate players on a franchise basis.   If we stutter it will be because of the collapse of our Tight 5 because of Jannie du Plessis and Victor Matfield.   The chaff last year was when Mozart kept non-performers in the team - not because he gave the fans wanted.  
I do not feel confident that unless Meyer get rid of the hanger-on that destroy our Tight 5 - we have any chance of success in the RC and WC.   For that person Du Plessis and Matfield will have to go.  
Where you said there is frailty there is none at all - when you said the situation is solid - that is where we fell down in the EOYT last year and in other tests as well and that is where we will fall down in future.
The players to go should be Pietersen, Pienaar, Louw, Matfield and Jannie du Plessis - those are the real weaknesses in the team.   And we need to be protected from selection of duds like Francois and Morne Steyn as well.
The team next week must be as follows for any chance for us to win in the test:-
15   Willie le Roux14   Senatla 13   Jesse Kriel12   Damian de Allende11   Habana10   Pollard 9   Reinach 8   Burger 7   Coetzee 6   Kriel 5   Mostert 4   Etzebeth 3   Malherbe 2   Bismarck du Plessis 1   Mtawarire
16   Strauss17   Nyakane18   Koch19   De Jager20   Whiteley21   De Klerk22   Lambie23   Serfontein/Vorster
any other selection would be lunacy.       
— END OF THREAD —

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