Jeff Wilson on de Allende

Mozart

Specifics vs claims. The Dud Allende hype has now reached farcical proportions. On attack there will inevitably be moments when things work out….but he doesn’t make them happen, they are chance occurrences where he can exploit a weak defender, Slade last year…..Biggar trying to strip instead of tackle in WC19.

Liar are you not shamed of yourself when lying so openly. First of all here were three Welsh players who tried to tackle D e A ;llende - he ran through the tackle attempt of the first one. There were two playes grabbing at him - but he foed his way over the line and scored. You mentione Biggar because you were writing shit and blmamed him for he try - but he was one of the two Welsh Players who tried to stop the try.

Mentioned by a prejudiced person who has no idea about backline play and pretend he sees thigs happening in rugby that never happened and got caught out lying for 12 years now. But coming froma person wop hates Erasmus and want the Springboks to lose a test to find a way you can justify your BS is rich.

There were three playes tring to cover De Allende

You said he drew in three defenders. Why are you changing your story?

The black forward on the left is out of the game, he is just chasing play. #21 is the only player directly challenging DDA. The #12 far right is already turning around to chase the kick that he can see coming even before the ball is kicked, so he is not drawn in or covering the carrier. #21 is the only player engaged in a defensive role on the carrier. There is exactly one player trying to cover DDA - #21.

Just for the sake of interest, the Boks had a 4 on 2 overlap outside DDA.

Yiu arestrwwisted as per normal and just as shot as your description what happened in the try scor by De A llende in the French test - De Allende launched two kicks

He did not launch any kick for his try against the French, Libbok did.

I waste time on this to demonstrate that no one can take anything you say seriously.

‘but he doesn’t make them happen, they are chance occurrences where he can exploit a weak defender, Slade last year…..Biggar trying to strip instead of tackle in WC19

Where did I say Biggar was the only tackler. He was the player who was in the best position to make the tackle. Just as Slade was in the try last year, but Earl also made contact.

Your lack of comprehension is only matched by your assinine belligerence.

As a matter of fact I haven’t read one other account that pointed out Biggar was trying to strip the ball, just another miss by the blind rugby press.

Now have a nice Marie biscuit.

First of all here were three Welsh players who tried to tackle D e A ;llende - he ran through the tackle attempt of the first one. There were two playes grabbing at him - but he foed his way over the line and scored.

Again, no. There were two. He first beat Biggar. Next he was scragged in another terrible attempt by #21, who pulled him down but too late. The only other player close was #23, who was covering Am outside and only arrived after the try was scored.

Minute 1:24 in the video. How embarrassing to be caught lying 3, 4, 5 times in one thread. I guess you're too old to feel any shame or something. Why are you on a rugby forum if your only aim is to completely misrepresent what actually happens in the game?

Also on that clip is Dud Toit hopelessly too late off the side of the scrum resulting in virtually a walk in try to put Wales back in the game, It wasn’t a mistake like a missed tackle, just something an experienced flank would be watching for so close to his line.

Bunch of fucking clowns

Moz, your take on DdA is almost as ridiculous as your years long campaign against Jacques Fourie...you've got a habit of backing the wrong center....thank God you got Danie Gerber right...Jean was OK but not on any level of greatnes...

These clowns know better than Wilson, Jean, Schalk, Schalk Brits, Greenwood and Aplon - what do these legends of the game know

These clowns are literally an embarrassment

You guys keep defending DDA in the face of hard evidence that he is barely capable of the absolute basics...like taking advantage of an overlap.

What Pakie clearly demonstrated to you above was the football equivalent of a player crouching down to knee height to header a ball into the goal when he could simply have tapped it in with his foot.

Say what you like, but kicking the ball away when you have two man overlap is an absolute noob move and indicative of a guy that has an extremely slow rugby brain.

And there are countless examples of things like that supported by hard evidence.

...and your evidence is "Well, the team that he played in won"

No you dumbfuck he is the best in his position in the game it’s why he is close to 100 Bok caps and kept a class act like AE out of the side

AE is as good as any other test 12 out there - in fact I take him over all of them but DA

Damn right he makes mistakes as all players do but he is vital to the Boks - a physical freak who imposes himself both offensively and defensively like no other and has the class and touch to play it wide when need be

DA is pure class

Dud Allende 89 tests…..11 tries

JdV ….109 tests…..27 tries

JdV literally scored tries at twice Dud Allende’s rate despite playing in a period where the Bok pack wasn’t as dominant.

Ma’a Nonu 103 tests….31 tries

Tim Horan 80 tests….40 tries

Tana Umaga 74 tests…….36 tries

Kerevi 51 tests 10 tries

Henshaw 82 tests 10 tries

Bundee Aki 18 tries in 69 tests….again twice Dud’s rate.

.>………………

‘And I’m guessing if we could access good records for try assists the disparity is even greater between Dud and great test centers. All the bs can’t compensate for the 11 or more additional tries he should have scored. Wings score more….but scoring tries is part of what centers do.

Most of those 12’s are a different era different game

Scoring tries is not the measure of a 12 it is a wing

It absolutely is a measure of performance.

It’s definitely not the measure of performance for a 12,13,10, 9,1,2,3,4,5,6,7 or 8

"It’s definitely not the measure of performance for a 12,13,10, 9,1,2,3,4,5,6,7 or 8"

whahahahahahaha!!!!!!!!!!!!

You rugby ignorant prick

measure of performance is not about how many tries someone scores...

its about how the team does with that player in it.

In another team, DA may score tons of tries... but if the team never wins, does that make him a great player?

If thats how you measure a good player, then Daisuke Ohata must be the best player that ever lived!

Chip one can’t begin to comprehend how rugby ignorant these clowns are

It’s unbelievable

Every great inside center I could think of in the last 25 years has a significantly better try scoring ration than Dud. And yet we were more dominating for much of his career than any of the teams the others played in, except perhaps Nonu.

Scoring tries isn’t optional, it’s how you win games. And scoring tries is often a question of instinct…. Sensing the opportunity. Great centers do that. As for the different era argument…I have seen no stats that say less tries are being scored.

John Gainsford 33 tests…8 tries

Danie Gerber 24 tests….19 tries

It keeps coming up the same way, great centers score lots of tries. Which one hasn’t?

Moz

i disagree boet.

A great player makes a team great.

a great team scores tries.

a great team beats top opponents.

I bet every single rugby pundit, besides you… will rate DA as one of the top centres in world rugby right now.

Mozart

Two things idiot supreme and ;liar.- how many of he tries came from amcthesw in which De Villiers - when he p;alyed on the wing.

Now how come in 20 tests Engelbrecht did not score a single try, So how come he must he being played at center ahead of De Allende? In one test he had such an opportunity and h e failed because he repeatr hay he did in 2014 for the Under 20 team and knocked on a perfectly good pasp to him with an open tryline ahead of him. Nothing new in his case, He lost the 2014 Under 20 RWC final the same way.

You are a liar as well in that if a player you hate make tackles you call it proccess tackles whatever that means. When player you like make weak and ineffective tackles they are not process tackles. There are quality of tackles made - but you have an issue with tackles made by players you hate - you describe all tackles they made as process tackles to try and demean their defence record - but the term of "process tackles" are unique to this board - no other real expert has ever used that term - it was an invention by you and we miust believe all the shit you spout on site.

3You do not mention one center who played in the last 30. years and in the professional era - so revert to a center who playe in the1950;s and one whose last test was 33 years ago. There was indeed a difference - with dolts like the coaches we had since 2000 with kicking fyhalf like Morne Steyn around it was an remains very difficult for cntes to score tries - since they rarely saw the balls. The game plan changed substantially under Erasmus - but according to you the Springboks when winning the 2019 - went back to the term "Traditional Springbok Rugby" - which in fact according in the Meyer era was another term you abused and many real experts have described it as BS. Before 1992 the Springboks used the backline for attacking purposes - after 1992 the backline stage was limited to defense only - the exception being Habana who scored most of his tries though indivdual effort and expertise,

In any event your description of "Traditional Springbok Rugby" was mentioned to De Villiers and he decribed it as supershit - there never was such a term in use and what you make out of it is a farce.

So keep hoping the Springboks lose matches so it can jusotfy the sh it you spread on this site, We have been really lucky wwe ad a thinkng coach like Erasmsand not one like Wh ite who somehow could not since 2008 eve coached a team that had any strategy and plan to use the abckline to score tries, While White was cach therewere no game plans other than forwards bashing into opposition. That was wh White was fored by the Sharks i 2014 and sent packing by Montpellier - who refused o renew his contract afte two years of coaching. That according to you mean is "Traditional Springbok Rugby".

So keep up entertaining us by your prejudiced BS, In a way one can regard it as a joke - but in reality it is sad to get into the BS spouted by you because it discredits rugby as a sport. . , ,

. . . .

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Good question. JDV played 13 matches on the wing and scored 6 tries

So in 96 matches he scored 21 tries at center

Dud Allende scored 11 tries in 89 test. If he was as productive per test as JdV was at center he would have scored 19 tries. So purely as a center JdV was 73% more productive than Dud.

And that doesn’t even adjust for the fact that Dud played in 3 full WCs ….where he scored tries against the likes of USA and Canada. JdV has no WC minnow tries because he played only 5 WC games.

So bullshit spreader …..down you go in flames again.

Chip-ou I would reverse that logic….if we hadn’t won two WCs would Dud Allende even be mentioned? He is regarded as World Class because he played for the most successful team in the world. As for the pundits, a bunch of old jocks, I believe what my eyes tell me and the things we can measure objectively.

Say what you like, but kicking the ball away when you have two man overlap is an absolute noob move and indicative of a guy that has an extremely slow rugby brain.

I'm actually good with the option he took there Plummie, the defense was up, fullback way across so the space was there for a well weighted kick, which it was (he's had worse instances of kicking away an overlap). Likewise the try against Wales, it was well taken and crucial in terms of the result. I'm trying to show how Mike can't describe anything happening on the field without adding a few tails to it.

No need to show anything about Mike. Somewhere between bad memory and dishonesty, Mike sits on the sand dreaming up his own reality.

The DDA kicking option really annoys me.

It's like when there is limited space, he won't pass, and when there is plenty of space he still won't pass.

There was a similar pic that I posted ages ago where he took the exact same option when he had about 3 better things to do.

I almost feel like he doesn't have an instinct for the right option and the kick is his way covering up for that.

There are plenty of examples. In the game we lost against Aus in 2021 there was a huge overlap outside, 3 on 1, all he had to do was run a little bit at the inside defense to fix them and then pass flat outside. Instead he immediately, without fixing or drawing anyone, threw a slow lob that Am had to jump for, the solitary defender who was up against 3 Boks could now rush and spot tackle Am and the opportunity was lost.

But I guess it's "embarrassing" and "pathetic" us pointing out stuff like this. Heaven forbid you actually try to analyze plays on a rugby forum. The expected and accepted thing is apparently just to parrot mainstream pundits.

It really gets me.

You look at guys like Pollard and Faf, or our wingers, or even newer players like Williams and Fassi, and one struggles to find them making massive clangers like DDA does and wasting opportunities. And that is with many of them having to handle ball far more frequently tan DDA does.

You look for evidence of them being good players and there is nothing hidden about it. Their value clear and measurable.

...but DDA's value isn't clear. One needs a degree in self hypnosis to find the evidence.

He scores less tries than most 12s...that's not his job.

He is hardly ever there in support of a break...that's not his job.

He hardly ever creates tries...that's not his job.

He hardly ever breaks through the line...that's not his job.

What is his job?

His job is to operate in traffic.

Okay, but he has some of the least meters per carry for a test 12 in rugby...

On and on...

Fucking idiot

Well Dud’s not very smart but calling him an idiot is a bit over the top.

Mozart

You wrote the amazing on Site:-

Chip-ou I would reverse that logic….if we hadn’t won two WCs would Dud Allende even be mentioned? He is regarded as World Class because he played for the most successful team in the world. As for the pundits, a bunch of old jocks, I believe what my eyes tell me and the things we can measure objectively.

It is amazing comens beaing ibn your conmstant and cvicious a ttacks on Easm us and yo players you hate, Tour :objectively assessment is consistently shown up as B S and based on prejudice,

Jeff Wilson was an average winger come cricketer. What does he know about backline play, he played in the amateur era.

He is a big mouth and like to attract controversy. He is the James Small version of All Blacks. Had some memorable games but the glory days are long gone.

Honestly, if you think Dud is the next best thing since Sonny Bill then you have another thing coming.

The reality is, playing 12 these days has become more like an additional 8 man with a bit more pace, (Which Damian lacks) that is why he kicks the pall away.

I nearly choked when I heard they bringing in his passing game. Almost like Pollards passing game that keeps throwing intercepts. Unfortunately this crop of boks under Rassie never learned to pass. It has been kick, kick, kick and tackle and feeding of turn over and using Kolbe and Clones to counter.

Off loads are non existent in the Rassie era where was with Sonny Bill, it became a staple.

it is very hard these days to stand out as a 12, don't see those line breaks anymore nor do I see a centre that can dominate the collision.

I have never seen Damian pin and pass in my entire life, his option are, step back, try to step around a player, I mean at walking pace, try bump a few players off and go to ground. His new gimmick is to get the ball in space and kick the ball away. He managed to get two try assist with that, but that is because we Kolbe and Clones on the wing that can something out of nothing.

Gone are the days of Jean De Villiers or Frans Steyn. Damien has been our centre since 2015, Pollard kicking cross field bombs on the 10 meter and Faf just kicking the leather off the ball or alternative Rassies old game plan of just bashing around the corner.

Average winger are you fucking mad????

He was absolutely brilliant

Dave...

ALL of the 2023 Boks have been spoken about by pundits.

Never in a negative light.

I challenge you to go and find me a pundit that says anything negative about any of them. You won't find anyone saying Mostert, Eben, AE, Pollard, Manie....or anyone else, isn't great, amazing, skillful, brilliant, blah blah blah.

How do you equate OBVIOUS puff pieces and platitudes to evidence.

It's actually not even worth trying to explain it to you anymore.

FYI - Everybody else gets it.