Captain40,032 posts
09 Oct 2015, 08:22
#1
09 Oct 2015, 08:22#1
No question about it. If you have the impertinence to disagree st ate you case however lame it may be!
Lood and Eben are the best lock combo in world rugby
Started by Beeno129 REPLIES699 VIEWS· 09 Oct 2015, 08:22
Captain18,570 posts
09 Oct 2015, 08:54
#2
09 Oct 2015, 08:54#2
Beeno: these two blokes have great potential but unfortunately they have not be coached or managed properly & are not ready be crowned "best lock combination in world rugby".
Eben is big & mobile has good ball handling skills & speed but has suffered from injuries & lack of test time leading up to the RWC (undercooked). He will make improvements during the RWC if the Boks go past the 1/4 finals.
Lood is a raw talent, also has great potential but again not developed properly as a player.
ABS have the best lock combination with Retallick and Whitelock. Both have talent (whitelock especially in the line-out) Retallick and Whitlelock in set piece and especially in general play. Both have the benefit of good coaching/development. It's about results Beeno not potential. It's about overall ability not in one area of a locks responsibilities. It's about meeting the needs of your team not just your own strengths.
Sorry mate but I take your bleated post as an indication of the potential of your two locks not actual performance.
PS. I did not mention wee Ma**** d out of consideration for your mental state Others may not be so considerate.
Eben is big & mobile has good ball handling skills & speed but has suffered from injuries & lack of test time leading up to the RWC (undercooked). He will make improvements during the RWC if the Boks go past the 1/4 finals.
Lood is a raw talent, also has great potential but again not developed properly as a player.
ABS have the best lock combination with Retallick and Whitelock. Both have talent (whitelock especially in the line-out) Retallick and Whitlelock in set piece and especially in general play. Both have the benefit of good coaching/development. It's about results Beeno not potential. It's about overall ability not in one area of a locks responsibilities. It's about meeting the needs of your team not just your own strengths.
Sorry mate but I take your bleated post as an indication of the potential of your two locks not actual performance.
PS. I did not mention wee Ma**** d out of consideration for your mental state Others may not be so considerate.
Pro2,580 posts
09 Oct 2015, 11:13
#3
09 Oct 2015, 11:13#3
Retilluck and Whitelock say Hi Beeno .
Club Pro601 posts
09 Oct 2015, 12:04
#4
09 Oct 2015, 12:04#4
Beeno I will join that band wagon if one of them wins World Rugby Player of the year or the rest of world rugby media (outside of SA)acknowledges it.
sharkbok
Captain23,281 posts
Captain23,281 posts
09 Oct 2015, 12:12
#5
09 Oct 2015, 12:12#5
Retalick is certainly one of the best Wee Whiteylock is living of past reputation
Captain30,741 posts
09 Oct 2015, 13:29
#6
09 Oct 2015, 13:29#6
Agreed, without doubt they are the best.....the only combo to come close are Retallick and Whitelock......but give me the Bok pair anyday
Pro2,288 posts
09 Oct 2015, 13:34
#7
09 Oct 2015, 13:34#7
Add the best centre pair in Super rugby and we've got a team going, hey Dave?
Pro2,549 posts
09 Oct 2015, 13:59
#8
09 Oct 2015, 13:59#8
"Lood and Eben are the best lock combo"????
so funny,.... how many times did they start together? 2 or 3? they have a long way ahead before considering them a lock combo,..... let alone the best of the world.
what do they achieve? nothing, zero.
it's not worthy to compare them with Whitelock-Retallick who won all the possibles,... Super Rugby finals and titles, Tri Nations and Rugby Championships (3 as the incunbent lock combo and another one Whitelock), World Cup Champion, Player of the Year,...... a very long way ahead
so funny,.... how many times did they start together? 2 or 3? they have a long way ahead before considering them a lock combo,..... let alone the best of the world.
what do they achieve? nothing, zero.
it's not worthy to compare them with Whitelock-Retallick who won all the possibles,... Super Rugby finals and titles, Tri Nations and Rugby Championships (3 as the incunbent lock combo and another one Whitelock), World Cup Champion, Player of the Year,...... a very long way ahead
Captain30,741 posts
09 Oct 2015, 14:00
#9
09 Oct 2015, 14:00#9
Actually yes.....DA and Kriel are by far the best young centre pair out there.....no other pair comes close.....add Pollard at 10
That's what I keep saying, we have the best young talent in the game, but an idiot of a coach who invests in a bunch of geriatrics instead - madness
Meyer is a fucking idiot and the sooner we see the back of him the better
Captain18,570 posts
09 Oct 2015, 14:30
#10
09 Oct 2015, 14:30#10
Not many SA posters have given their opinion on this one, I guess there isn't much support for Beeno's selection of best lock combo.
Pro2,288 posts
09 Oct 2015, 14:31
#11
09 Oct 2015, 14:31#11
Best individuals don't necessarily maje for best combinations.
Captain49,914 posts
09 Oct 2015, 14:41
#12
09 Oct 2015, 14:41#12
Noo no....you have it all wrong....it's Quince Roux and Stephanie. The leading rugby mind on this site spotted these talents when they were five years old and has been quietly tracking their progress. Three years ago he opined on their mammoth potential.
Lomp and Etzebeth are merely place holders, although it's unlikely even with the new improved pair that anybody will beat Lomps' clarity in lineout calls...."one, two, three .....me".
Lomp and Etzebeth are merely place holders, although it's unlikely even with the new improved pair that anybody will beat Lomps' clarity in lineout calls...."one, two, three .....me".
Captain30,741 posts
09 Oct 2015, 15:23
#13
09 Oct 2015, 15:23#13
How does a useless coach qualify as being smarter than me having won only 5 of the last 13 major tests leading up to the WC, have us drop to 5th and then lose to Japan in the WC you fucking idiot?
Captain49,914 posts
09 Oct 2015, 15:29
#14
09 Oct 2015, 15:29#14
So you are saying we can win even with a useless coach, as long as Matfield doesn't play....a direct inference from your comment that we will lose in the semis because Matfield will return.
Coach57,555 posts
09 Oct 2015, 15:43
#15
09 Oct 2015, 15:43#15
Mozart
It takes a lot of egg - but at present Matfield is not even the 6th best lock in SA. He has gone to seed and is way past his sell-by date.
The moment he appears again in a Springbok jersey on the field of play - we have lost our Tight 5 competitiveness and kiss the game good bye. Add Willempie to that to make up for the act of grunt and in the process we give up two critical positions in the team and get back in return half a position, meaning we will play the game with the equivalent of -
* 1 red card; and* 4 yellow cards
So can we win with that handicap? I believe not.
It takes a lot of egg - but at present Matfield is not even the 6th best lock in SA. He has gone to seed and is way past his sell-by date.
The moment he appears again in a Springbok jersey on the field of play - we have lost our Tight 5 competitiveness and kiss the game good bye. Add Willempie to that to make up for the act of grunt and in the process we give up two critical positions in the team and get back in return half a position, meaning we will play the game with the equivalent of -
* 1 red card; and* 4 yellow cards
So can we win with that handicap? I believe not.
Coach57,555 posts
09 Oct 2015, 16:38
#16
09 Oct 2015, 16:38#16
JW
I do think that Retallick and Whitelock have been the best AB locks for years - but they have both been off form this year. Both are not a full combination required from a lock - better in loser formats of the game - but not really the best in the tight phase of play. Both lack to an extent grunt and that reduces their value as locks.
In a way they both remind me of Matfield although not as solid in line out play. Matfield is by far not the best lock in SA - in his prime he was very much like Retallick. I have always rated Whitelock better than Retallick because he has a bit more grunt than Retallick has.
Be it as it may I would never say they are the best lock combination in the world. New Zealand has a number of best in the world - but the lock combination does not make that elevated grade at all. But then you re likely to disagree - but the Tight 5 is the real area where NZ is at a disadvantage. With their loosies, half backs, wings and full back they would be totally unbeaten, but they have some less efficient divisions - so they do have problems a s well.
I do think that Retallick and Whitelock have been the best AB locks for years - but they have both been off form this year. Both are not a full combination required from a lock - better in loser formats of the game - but not really the best in the tight phase of play. Both lack to an extent grunt and that reduces their value as locks.
In a way they both remind me of Matfield although not as solid in line out play. Matfield is by far not the best lock in SA - in his prime he was very much like Retallick. I have always rated Whitelock better than Retallick because he has a bit more grunt than Retallick has.
Be it as it may I would never say they are the best lock combination in the world. New Zealand has a number of best in the world - but the lock combination does not make that elevated grade at all. But then you re likely to disagree - but the Tight 5 is the real area where NZ is at a disadvantage. With their loosies, half backs, wings and full back they would be totally unbeaten, but they have some less efficient divisions - so they do have problems a s well.
Coach57,555 posts
09 Oct 2015, 17:14
#17
09 Oct 2015, 17:14#17
JW
Let me add - Etzebeth and De Jager (especially the latter) need a bit more experience to be considered the beat lock combination - but they are getting there and will probably be that in another years time.
Let me add - Etzebeth and De Jager (especially the latter) need a bit more experience to be considered the beat lock combination - but they are getting there and will probably be that in another years time.
Captain18,570 posts
09 Oct 2015, 17:41
#18
09 Oct 2015, 17:41#18
Clevermike, I agree that lately they are not playing their best rugby. I am hoping they are building form for the knockout rounds. I agree we will see Bennington favorite duo improving in the next year or so we have to see if they last.
Pro4,671 posts
09 Oct 2015, 19:13
#19
09 Oct 2015, 19:13#19
...Best lock in world rugby currently ? not a Kiwi or from SA.. Fijian Leone Nakarawa... with the best all round skills in attack and defence...
...As of October 8, Nakarawa leads the tournament for offloads (10) and turnovers won (9), meaning the lock forward steals ball like David Pocock and offloads like Sonny Bill Williams. Or rather, they do it like he does, as he is ahead of both of them on the list of their respective specialities.
He is also fifth for most runs made (42), seventh for carries over the gainline (19), and in the top 20 of another two categories: 16th for most metres made (177m) and 20th for most tackles made (34).
.. His presence in so many of the lists indicates a player who is, at the very least, central to the action in defence, and a huge threat in attack..
Nakarawa’s all-round game, honed in the space and speed of Sevens, and developed with the Glasgow Warriors in Pro 12 and Champions Cup rugby, has been a revelation to the wider audience of RWC 2015. Despite Fiji’s exit at the Pool stage, their second-row’s athleticism, skill, and intelligence will live long in both the memory and the statistical records.
RNS ct/as/bo
Captain18,570 posts
09 Oct 2015, 20:06
#20
09 Oct 2015, 20:06#20
Great post Brycy you are right about his individual performance as a lock/monster However, we are looking for the best lock combo so I don't know how is partner lock is?
Captain40,032 posts
09 Oct 2015, 21:06
#21
09 Oct 2015, 21:06#21
Lots of ignorant m urray type chatter.Lood and Eben are so far ahead of the pap kiwi duo its hilarious.
Then also the pap ab loose trio which is causing Mitchill and Taine Randall sleepless nights.
Old woody wood cock is also faltering.
A side on the skids!
Then also the pap ab loose trio which is causing Mitchill and Taine Randall sleepless nights.
Old woody wood cock is also faltering.
A side on the skids!
Captain18,570 posts
09 Oct 2015, 23:10
#22
09 Oct 2015, 23:10#22
Not may agree with you Beeno, always a risk when you live on the edge of logic, reason & sanity or so I have observed
Captain40,032 posts
10 Oct 2015, 08:52
#23
10 Oct 2015, 08:52#23
JW if I use that ignorant ab ass's argument I would ask what has Nakarawa achieved. The answer is zip. The kbbs are confusing eachother
Next ou brycy seems not to have noted I am talking about a combo!! But Jw thinks his reposte is brilliant!
Finally oaks Nakarawa is not in the same class as either Lood or Eben.
Eben and Lood are wee ab munchers as we saw in the last test against nz.
Next ou brycy seems not to have noted I am talking about a combo!! But Jw thinks his reposte is brilliant!
Finally oaks Nakarawa is not in the same class as either Lood or Eben.
Eben and Lood are wee ab munchers as we saw in the last test against nz.
Captain18,570 posts
10 Oct 2015, 08:58
#24
10 Oct 2015, 08:58#24
Beeno, you may have missed my insightful analysis of Lood:
Just_win
Status: Hall Of Fame
Posts: 10862RE: Lood highest tackle count
October 09, 2015, 09:01:42
In fact most of these "tackles" are of little consequence as the back often offloads the ball & Lood gets in the way of other more proficient tacklers.
I will leave it to Moz to explain "process tackles" and other nuances of interpretation of "tackles".
Just_win
Status: Hall Of Fame
Posts: 10862RE: Lood highest tackle count
October 09, 2015, 09:01:42
Lood has made a few tackles but these are "wing-span tackles", i.e Lood has long arms (but thin wrists & ankles) & he is able to grasp a poor wee back & this is generally considered a "tackle".
In fact most of these "tackles" are of little consequence as the back often offloads the ball & Lood gets in the way of other more proficient tacklers.
I will leave it to Moz to explain "process tackles" and other nuances of interpretation of "tackles".
Captain40,032 posts
10 Oct 2015, 09:33
#25
10 Oct 2015, 09:33#25
Yes your comments give great insight JW but not what you might imagine . Especially when you say Lood "has made a few tackles" Indeed who has made more tackles in the RWC?
bnwahahhahahahahaha ou JW all at sea!
bnwahahhahahahahaha ou JW all at sea!
Captain18,570 posts
10 Oct 2015, 10:43
#26
10 Oct 2015, 10:43#26
Beeno: "wing-span" tackls don't count. In fact using "Beeno-math" you subtact the wing-span tackles from the total "tackles" factor in his obstructing real tacklers & Lood ends up with an average tackle count of -10 per game. Not a man I would want on the field.
Out of kindness I will not factor in the "hampsteing" Lood displayed on his ball carries as other Boks also suffer from this malady.
Lack of forward progress may be the result of skinny ankles
Out of kindness I will not factor in the "hampsteing" Lood displayed on his ball carries as other Boks also suffer from this malady.
Lack of forward progress may be the result of skinny ankles
Captain40,032 posts
10 Oct 2015, 11:20
#27
10 Oct 2015, 11:20#27
JW your theories are all too suspect too often !
Captain18,570 posts
10 Oct 2015, 11:24
#28
10 Oct 2015, 11:24#28
Beeno: all is clear to those of us who are intelligent enough to see it. I was hoping you were one of us bad sadly I may be wrong
Pro9,905 posts
10 Oct 2015, 11:26
#29
10 Oct 2015, 11:26#29
Oh brother ... Beandip, sorry man but I have to ask ... why do you like having your head up your backside?
Don't you know that you can see a lot better with it out in the fresh air?
Lood and Eben may have something special but we'll only know that a lot later.
Not now.
Look at Damian and Kriel ... their first outing was a good one but they haven't been able to replicate it since.
So just chill.
Captain40,032 posts
10 Oct 2015, 12:09
#30
10 Oct 2015, 12:09#30
Wee cc wake up!! Going on what we ahve seen there is no better lock combo around. Many years ago a young Greame Pollock set the world alight. He was a great from the begining. Ditto Richards. Its the same here.Nobody can name a better lock combo. The kbbs are of course joking about retardlick and wee whitelock. Pretty frot duo.
Oz locks are not in the picture. England locks were disappointing with lawes looking like a 7 rather than a lock.Ireland have poor old man O'Connel still tring to prop up an end etc etc.
No Lood and Eben are the best. No question about it. They proved it agaisnt Nz and Oz and against all they have played against. The evidence supports the claim.E nd of story!
Oz locks are not in the picture. England locks were disappointing with lawes looking like a 7 rather than a lock.Ireland have poor old man O'Connel still tring to prop up an end etc etc.
No Lood and Eben are the best. No question about it. They proved it agaisnt Nz and Oz and against all they have played against. The evidence supports the claim.E nd of story!
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