Mandela Memorial Service

Well let's set the record straight. I did edit my comment, after reflection.....concluding it was unfair to engage Cloudy on a subject on which she held well meaning views but only a passing knowledge. So what was the "racist" content I eliminated.....why, saying a member of my family went to school with the young girl who was maimed by a bomb while walking through the station holding her grandmother's hand. The grandmother was killed.

That comment is now a racist comment according to the Board sneak.

Anybody reading Rooinek's comment, without seeing the original, would imagine I had published some sort of racial attack. To say it's an insult and a lie would serve no purpose....it's so easy to call somebody a racist. But I hope other Board members see what they are dealing with here....the lowest of the low.

 Cloudy

You should never apolagize to a racist.....Racists have a lot to opolagize for, they never do. The resident Mole, Cerydane, is a full blown racist, his mentallity was shaped by the disgraceful and immoral Apartheid regime, he echoes their philosophy of Blacks being useless, incompetent and savage. As a rule I totally ignore him, I know why he hangs around this site, he's here to enjoy it's demise whenever that day arrives but don't believe me, more importantly ask him if he was as vociferous in condemning the immoral and politically bankcrupt Apartheid regime then, as  he is today in condemning the ANC and Madiba.

As a matter of interest, ask those who have such a lot to say about Madiba whether they had stopped for a second while enjoying the benefits of their white skins under the Apartheid regime to raise their moral discord with the Regime?

Ask them if they cared about Denny being robbed of his dignity as a human being and whether they cared about fellow human being Denny being denied his right of vote as well as his inalienable right to free speech and movement in the country of his birth?

All because Denny didn't have a white skin.

Cloudy, On the other hand don't bother, I already know the answers......there is no need to suffer their arrogant response. They were arrogant then, history has taught them nothing, they are equally arrogant now.

PS

Rooinek, Didn't think I'd ever get to say this but I appreciated your comments re Madiba and thoroughly enjoyed your dissing of Ceradayne. 

 Cloudy

Listen to me. Do not waste your good intent on a racist....been there, done that. Not only is he and his kind racist, they are arrogant as well. They will never change and no matter what you say, they will keep banging away. Brainwashed and idoctrinated to the pits.....you are wasting your time.

Like his kind, the Racist Afrikaaner, told us what's right and wrong then, they've lost the battle and the war but still the losers are telling us what's right and what wrong now! If that's not arrogance then I don't know what is....then to round it off the Loser will bang away with his squeaky clean, holier than thou bullshit.

All I will say is this....the Loser and his kind can kiss my most pigmented arse!

 Actually I've been sitting back and scrolling through the rubbish and you just get to a point where you have to hang out the red flag. Believe me I've been through this type of thing many many times in the past when SAFFAS used to make rugby forums a gathering point and launching pad for their racist beliefs. Scroll through the above and it was happening again.

Nothing wrong about your beliefs in Tata but yes South African politics is very hard to understand, even for the brainwashed who lived over there. Fact is most South African whites were so ensconsed in their racist bubble that they couldn't be bothered with why we didn't support their racist national teams. So not only were they're racist and arrogant....they were ignorant as well. It's so bad that you have to wonder who suffered more....them or us.

Folk,

      Please let the man rest in peace.

      He is only human like all of us.....with both good and not so good intentions. 

      He certianly prevented a civil war in RSA and has always been both up front and active in providing basic human rights to alln and I as an ex white South African applaud him for his effort.

      He was admired by millions/billions of people around the world for his efforts and sacrifice in his belief of a free RSA for all.

      I never ever believed that the ANC is/was the ideal party but they did introduce a better quality of life for most population groups in RSA.

      Now take time and reflect on the mans good points and please let him rest in peace.

       Trust that I have not started another long and sad debate on this forum.

       Thank you all!!!!!

Well well , heres an interesting one. 

Madiba, he was no ways perfect, but he was only a man , and to make mistakes is to be human, its the lessons he took out of his time on this earth and the ability to turn things around that make him great. He stood tall when all around him were scared, he stood against what was wrong, like many people now who stand up against what is wrong in the world now ...although the people that stand tallest are the ones who stand up and out in public . not grumbling in the shadows about their discontent.

so The man that is Madiba ... even if he was flawed and stood as a resistance against an evil and in doing so took part in another form of evil...he did his time..and instead of walking out with revenge on his mind... he smiled..shook hands with and reminded us all that theres more to life...

people think he stood back and allowed the ANC to become this monster.. I think not..he is an old man and his presence alone was a buffer against what could be a worse state... and in his death he has brought the spotlight back and it shines on the ANC.

credit the man..because he never denied his accountability.

That's the sign of a real man. Stands tall..Takes responsibility...but accepts his place as just one of the human race.

There is an interesting obituary in the Economist. They credit him as you do Matey with his post prison role. But they go into some detail about his communist beliefs and the fact that the fall of the Soviet Union helped change those beliefs, essentially making the West the only practical partner. They also note that he continued to support his communist benefactors as a matter of loyalty.

A lot of accusations have been tossed about on this thread, but I see nobody who denies his crucial role in the transition. Whether he was an effective manager beyond that, is a different story.  

 "if any of the other leaders of the ANC had been in his position of authority and influence we would have been in big trouble."

Pure speculation if not utter rubbish.

 "Beeno1 , where did you get this information , the " dark side of Mandela, is it a credible source ? can you provide a link  , I would be interested in looking this stuff up."

Beeno 1's Darkside is the pigment....oooops the figment of his brain. 

 ..."about his communist beliefs and the fact that the fall of the Soviet Union helped change those beliefs essentially making the West the only practical partner.."

I totally reject that belief, Madiba was Madiba, the fall of the Soviet Union would not have changed his beliefs for the West to become his only practical partner. Madiba's beliefs were shaped by Madiba...that's the unique strength of the man and that's exactly why he was universally admired and respected.

no saints on either side of the fence .

Vlags... I haven't been lynched yet ! accomplishment ?