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FORUM / RUGBY /  The Bok RWC tackling monster

The Bok RWC tackling monster

Started by Mozart63 REPLIES2,213 VIEWS· 15 Jan 2025, 16:21
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MO
MozartCaptain49,914 posts
15 Jan 2025, 16:21
#1
15 Jan 2025, 16:21#1

Most would probably pick Dud Toit….but it was that unsung hero Mostert, by a mile. Here are the stats from the games where we fielded our best team….Scotland, Ireland, France, England, NZ.


In total Dud Toit played 381 minutes, made 66 tackles and missed 12.


Mostert played 305 minutes, made 67 tackles and missed 2.



So Mostert actually made 1 more tackle than Dud despite playing effectively a game less in terms of minutes. But much more crucially Mostert had a 97% completion ratio. Dud Toit languished at a mediocre 85%.


But he’s a great runner they object. Dud Toit ran the ball 33 times and beat 2tackles. That’s a tackle beaten every 16 runs! Vermeulen ran the ball 8 times in the WC final and beat 2 tackles.


That’s an aside. The point of this string is not to humiliate Dud, but put Mostert’s WC in perspective…..our true WC defensive hero.


SA
Saffolk Captain30,741 posts
15 Jan 2025, 16:58
#2
15 Jan 2025, 16:58#2
Difference is old powder puff makes nice little process tackles because he has not grunt to put in a dominant tackle PSDT on the other hand made very memorable dominant tackles, the kind of tackles you would expect from a Bok tightforward Good old powder puff is the saddest excuse for a Bok tightforward
MO
MozartCaptain49,914 posts
15 Jan 2025, 17:22
#3
15 Jan 2025, 17:22#3

Perhaps he wouldn’t have missed 15% of his tackles if he hadn’t tried to be dominant. And I can guarantee you we lost more metres from Dud’s missed tackles than we made because he may and I say may, have been more dominant.

MO
MozartCaptain49,914 posts
15 Jan 2025, 17:25
#4
15 Jan 2025, 17:25#4

Dud Toit ran 25 times against Scotland  Ireland, France and New Zealand without beating one defender. Talking about dominance, what about dominant running. Is that the most flaccid ball carrying any Bok designated ball carrier has ever racked up?

MP
MpowerPro5,061 posts
15 Jan 2025, 18:08
#5
15 Jan 2025, 18:08#5
"In total Dud Toit played 381 minutes, made 66 tackles and missed 12. Mostert played 305 minutes, made 67 tackles and missed 2" Franco played less time, made more tackles and higher success rate. Very impressive…..no wonder Rassie rates him so much:)
SA
Saffolk Captain30,741 posts
15 Jan 2025, 18:14
#6
15 Jan 2025, 18:14#6
PSDT would have made a few less tackles than Mostert if at all but many of his would have been dominant - so much so it had an impact in the final sending a very clear message PSDT is not there to beat tackles fuck me when are you ever going to wake up to the role of a blindside flanker or lock - they operate in traffic - they are not there to step defenders. Do you see Eben running into defenders and smashing them out the way - no you don’t - it hardly ever happens in test rugby these days The role is to gain forward momentum in the carry which is what PSDT, Eben, Lood, RG and Wiese do - it’s what useless Mostert can’t do
MP
MpowerPro5,061 posts
15 Jan 2025, 18:21
#7
15 Jan 2025, 18:21#7
Total Bias BS on Mostert not being able to get forward momentum….:) More than enough Video Material was put on here to prove his forward momentum. You just have to look at him play…..
SA
Saffolk Captain30,741 posts
15 Jan 2025, 18:30
#8
15 Jan 2025, 18:30#8
Oh what utter shit - I have never seen Mostert being dominant in a carry because he does not have the bulk to enforce himself physically - 2m and 112kg is your answer There has been zero video evidence on here of Mostert carrying well in contact Never going to happen
PL
PlumCaptain21,007 posts
15 Jan 2025, 18:54
#9
15 Jan 2025, 18:54#9
I think it's safe to say that Mostert won the Boks the WC. I'm sure we can all agree on that. I really hope he's fit for the next WC too!
SA
Saffolk Captain30,741 posts
15 Jan 2025, 18:59
#10
15 Jan 2025, 18:59#10
I thought it was the ref that won us the WC?
PL
PlumCaptain21,007 posts
15 Jan 2025, 19:06
#11
15 Jan 2025, 19:06#11
Nah, it was defos Mostert
DB
DbDraadCaptain26,388 posts
15 Jan 2025, 19:22
#12
15 Jan 2025, 19:22#12

"I think it's safe to say that Mostert won the Boks the WC.

I'm sure we can all agree on that.

I really hope he's fit for the next WC too!"


Ag nee man Plum!...naughty naughty...

SA
Saffolk Captain30,741 posts
15 Jan 2025, 19:34
#13
15 Jan 2025, 19:34#13
Nah if it was not the ref in our pocket it was down to Manie
MP
MpowerPro5,061 posts
15 Jan 2025, 19:41
#14
15 Jan 2025, 19:41#14
The whole team played there part, but some more than others:)
DB
DbDraadCaptain26,388 posts
15 Jan 2025, 20:08
#15
15 Jan 2025, 20:08#15


MO
MozartCaptain49,914 posts
15 Jan 2025, 20:39
#16
15 Jan 2025, 20:39#16

Just glad I could shine the light of truth on the hype about Dud Toit. He played a part, mostly in the final. But Pollard, Ox, Kolbe and particularly Etzebeth, without whom this whole party ends, were key through the whole knockout phase.  

SA
Saffolk Captain30,741 posts
15 Jan 2025, 20:43
#17
15 Jan 2025, 20:43#17
You shone no light at all Moz - PSDT was one of our best players throughout as he is with every match he plays
MO
MozartCaptain49,914 posts
15 Jan 2025, 20:55
#18
15 Jan 2025, 20:55#18

You are in a particularly dark hole Dave, it will take a searchlight of truth to convince you. Hell you are still harboring thoughts that Manie Libbok could be a Bok flyhalf.

SA
Saffolk Captain30,741 posts
15 Jan 2025, 21:22
#19
15 Jan 2025, 21:22#19
Well there is a reason PSDT was named world player of the year post the WC Manie is a Bok flyhalf
MO
MozartCaptain49,914 posts
15 Jan 2025, 23:05
#20
15 Jan 2025, 23:05#20

Yes….it’s a popularity contest.

SA
Saffolk Captain30,741 posts
15 Jan 2025, 23:17
#21
15 Jan 2025, 23:17#21
Bullshit that’s your warped perspective Why would a SA player be on a popularity list? Quite the opposite
MO
MozartCaptain49,914 posts
15 Jan 2025, 23:51
#22
15 Jan 2025, 23:51#22
They pretty much had to give it to a Bok…they prefer the quiet man Dud, to the combative man Etzebeth who is our one indispensable player and the best lock to play the game,
SA
Saffolk Captain30,741 posts
16 Jan 2025, 00:36
#23
16 Jan 2025, 00:36#23
Ok so had they given it to Eben which I would have been more than happy with, PSDT was still one of 4 in the running for the award You don’t win world player of the year twice being an average player that is an ineffective ball carrier How the fuck you can rate Mostert and not PSDT is literally rugby madness Most SA supporters would rank PSDT in their top 5 Boks ever I would not but I do know he is a phenomenal player
MO
MozartCaptain49,914 posts
16 Jan 2025, 01:29
#24
16 Jan 2025, 01:29#24

No defenders beaten in 4 of our critical  WC games in the role of our key ball carrier….an 85% tackle rate…no turnovers anybody can remember. The whole thing hinges on the big hit on Barrett who could easily have stepped him if he was alert.

I’m not persuaded.

DA
Devil's AdvocatePro7,008 posts
16 Jan 2025, 06:49
#25
16 Jan 2025, 06:49#25

Take Mostert out the team and re-evaluate our chances of winning the World cup ....

A fantastic team effort overall.... but the win diminishes significantly without Mostert.

PA
PakieCaptain17,321 posts
16 Jan 2025, 09:20
#26
16 Jan 2025, 09:20#26

Mostert has always been in the shadows. Remember that famous Bok win over NZ, 34-36, where Steph shot to fame over his tackle count? Mostert made the same number, while missing 3 fewer. Didn't even get a mention.

CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
16 Jan 2025, 09:24
#27
16 Jan 2025, 09:24#27

Mosert is a shit poor playe that shoud not eb in the  Springbok team and that has ben proved since 2019.  He fucked up royally in two tests in 2019 nd was dropped form the staring line-up in the remainder of the RWC tests and  only replaced De Jage when eh got injured in the Final - where Mozrt first climed Beast won the inal for the Springboks and then switched to Moster being the palye who won tehs eries for he S pringboks.   

Both ere BS statements and was proved a total B S anyway.   H now came up with the same stroy again/     Fct is the substandad Mostert was neve picked as  Player  of ny test match  either while Du Toit ws playe fo the Yedar on two occassions.    Mostert neve did anything tht inluence match outcomes and that fact is being ignored by all the incomplete stats used by them  sit diots.   

I thought Mostert was great when he played fo he Lions in 2014 - bu as a test player he enve was of any real value on test level.   

       ,      

RO
RooinekCaptain18,117 posts
16 Jan 2025, 10:11
#28
16 Jan 2025, 10:11#28

Q: What do you call someone who doesn't rate the great Pieter-Steph du Toit and cannot see the value that he brings to the Springboks?

A: A rugby noob.


Q: What do you call someone who is too vain and conceited to admit he ever made a mistake?

A: A pompous twat.


Q: What do you call a rugby noob who is also a pompous twat who lies awake at night trying to think of new ways to criticise the great Pieter-Steph du Toit so that he can pretend he didn't get egg all over his stupid face after PSdT won his second World Player of the Year award?

A: Moffie.

PL
PlumCaptain21,007 posts
16 Jan 2025, 10:46
#29
16 Jan 2025, 10:46#29
Dave doesn't rate Mostert because it would require a paradigm shift for him to show appreciation. Mostert has been at the heart of both the best SA teams I have watched in the last ten years. He was heroic at the very dominant Lions. Looking at how current SA teams are performing against European teams puts the almost perfect 3 seasons the Lions had in SR nicely into perspective. You know how hot that side was Dave, and you know Mostert was there doing it. Onward to the 2019-2024 Boks, the other best SA side I've watched. And who do we find as Rassie's perpetual go-to...Sous. He's there again, and he's doing it again. Dave, the problem here is your faulty interpretation of dominance. In your view dominance is only asserted by running over people, and not by other metrics such as volume, etc. But in the real world, the real numbers you see in front of you matter. When you add them all up you get = dominance total. One last time. If you make less tackles you lose more ground, you give away some dominance. I pointed this out to you previously, I even made charts for you. ...but you still didn't twig that dominance is not comprised of one metric only.
SA
Saffolk Captain30,741 posts
16 Jan 2025, 10:48
#30
16 Jan 2025, 10:48#30
Um Moz wake up - you don’t beat defenders when you run into them - for crying out loud His role is to carry in traffic - why is this beyond you?
SA
Saffolk Captain30,741 posts
16 Jan 2025, 10:53
#31
16 Jan 2025, 10:53#31
Pakie and DA - the Bok side is a better one when Lood or RG are at 5 Mostert is a sad pretender incapable of imposing himself physically on attack or defensively It’s not the job of a Bok lock to effect 12 process tackles a game. I’d much rather have a physical RG effecting 6 of those tackles and the remaining 6 by other players and in the process adding grunt to our forwards in every department Fuck Mostert he is literally useless unless your measure of a Bok lock is making process tackles
PA
PakieCaptain17,321 posts
16 Jan 2025, 11:08
#32
16 Jan 2025, 11:08#32

Yes Dave, you've only told us about 1342 times.

MP
MpowerPro5,061 posts
16 Jan 2025, 11:10
#33
16 Jan 2025, 11:10#33
Everything you say about Mostert, is in direct conflict with how Erasmus views and uses Mostert. And Video and stats also don’t back your statements to be factual. No amount of bad mouthing by you or Uncle Romulan will change the facts. Catch 22 :)
RO
RooinekCaptain18,117 posts
16 Jan 2025, 11:13
#34
16 Jan 2025, 11:13#34

"Everything you say about Mostert, is in direct conflict with how Erasmus views and uses Mostert."

Well, GiMp, everything Moffie says about PSdT is in direct conflict with the rest of the world . . . but I don't see you yapping away at your Master . . .

DE
DennyCaptain12,893 posts
16 Jan 2025, 11:14
#35
16 Jan 2025, 11:14#35

It's all really quite simple......

A neutral rugby body voted PSDT two time winner Rugby Player of the Year.....read my lips......it wasn't Mostert, he didn't even make the final list.

Not once....twice!

Are we missin somethin here?


RO
RooinekCaptain18,117 posts
16 Jan 2025, 11:20
#36
16 Jan 2025, 11:20#36

Apart from his two World Player of the Year awards, PSdT has also been named Player of the RWC in 2019 and he's won the SA rugby Player of the Year.

What awards has Franco Mostert won?

I'm not for one second saying I don't rate Mostert as a player. I've always liked his warrior spirit . . . but to compare him to PSdT and to say he should get the credit for our last RWC victory is . . . well . . . something only a rugby noob might say.


MP
MpowerPro5,061 posts
16 Jan 2025, 11:33
#37
16 Jan 2025, 11:33#37
Well, Moz is not my master and I view PSDT as a great player with his particular strengths. Same counts for Mostert. Both of them do have there weaknesses to. Therefore some of the things Moz is saying about Stef is true…I personally think that Lock is Stef,s best position. But he does also have the attributes to play 7 well. Me Moz, Pakie, DA and plum are way more openminded than you guys….. we have the abilities to see the good things about Pieter….. But you guys are so bitter and bias, that you can’t even give Mostert a little bit of credit although he deserves much more…. I would say that is the big difference here….. same counts for Rassie where things are seen more realistically….not like a bunch of Groupie Zombies that gulp everything up:) Any case that’s my opinion:)
SA
Saffolk Captain30,741 posts
16 Jan 2025, 11:34
#38
16 Jan 2025, 11:34#38
Mpower stop lying - show me video evidence of Mostert being dominant in a carry or making a dominant tackle Lying carries zero weight Agreed Rooi we can’t fault Mostert’s energy, durability and warrior instincts, it’s just a pity as a lock he has never had the physicality to back up all that heart and energy and for that simple reason I don’t rate him at all I see through all the heart and energy, it’s the minimal physical productivity that defines him for me For me a Bok lock has to be physical as a bare minimum
DE
DennyCaptain12,893 posts
16 Jan 2025, 11:35
#39
16 Jan 2025, 11:35#39

Nothing new in that behavior we've seen it play out many a time over the decades.....kinda like a puppy dog with bone clamped between jaws .

DA
Devil's AdvocatePro7,008 posts
16 Jan 2025, 11:45
#40
16 Jan 2025, 11:45#40

PSDT does and should still receive all the accolades that he has already received, and hopefully does still receive during his brilliant playing career.

I have always highly rated PSDT and I have supported him before, and that has never changed.

I think he is a bloody phenomenal player, and I believe that without him, our chances of winning that last world cup would have dropped dramatically.

At the same time, I do also genuinely believe that without Mostert's overall performance, all over the field, in every single game he played.....with his constant higher than most work ethic, his tireless in the trenches performance ... game after game, which the stats 100% back up.... I also believe that our chances to win that last world cup would diminish significantly without him in the side.

I cannot say that for many of the other players unfortunately... bar Eben, Pollard etc etc

That is all I am saying

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