What is going on in England? Are the Muslims taking over

I don't think it is racist for anyone to not want to become a minority in their own country.... because, to me, that is not an unrealistic or unreasonable expectation or belief to have....... that should be perfectly normal.

There is not one single country in the world that I can think of right now, where the citizens would openly and honestly want to become a minority in their country, at the expense of immigrants flooding in... not one.

For such a long time now, I have been reading more and more about how the average every day British citizen, both male and female, young and old....  are getting extremly angry at how their wives, daughters, grandkids etc etc are treated on the streets in the UK... and unfortunately this specific behaviour is predominately perpetrated by Muslims or non white people ...from what I have read anyway, hence why I posted so long ago about tempers flaring and people reaching boiling point in the UK regarding this issue.

Now of course there is white crime all over the UK, in fact a whole shitload of it every day, but it will never ever get the same attention with the public, as when it happens due to a non-white being involved in the crime, even if it should...and that is just a fact.....and as racist as that sounds, I'm a realist as well.... I do believe that, even it if it is wrong on many levels.

Now, the reason I can believe it is happening, is because one just has to look at how the black population and the Muslim population treat their women, and not just in the UK.....and if you want to label me racist for that, then do it, but it is a fact....Muslim and Black women are not treated with the same respect or held in the same regard as in the White culture, and if you really believe they are, you are fooling yourself and everyone else around you.

Yes, White men are dogs, who also treat their wives like utter shit, but I am talking in general, as a population as a whole.

This belief, which is still very much apparent in the millions of Muslim and Black homes around the UK, then ends up on the streets of London, Manchester, Liverpool etc etc and people in general are just gatvol of it, and I don't blame them at all, but this is not the correct response at all.... burning buildings whilst men, women and children are inside.....pulling people from cars..... despicable and disgusting.

Then, you have this flood of immigrants coming in, which absorbs all the funds from your government that could be far better utilised looking after the already millions of immigrants already in your country, as well as it's own citizens

A lot of what I say or believe is anecdotal, and I might ultimately be wrong or right on some of these points and issues that we are discussing..... but I did say a long time ago that this was coming in the UK and Ireland, because I could very clearly see it..... and it took an incredibly sad and disgusting attack on children, to give people the match to light that fire, which still continues to burn today.

Make no mistake, these riots and protests might die down now, but the underlying anger and frustrations will still be simmering right below the surface, just waiting for the next incident

..

This happened whilst the Sky news reporter was talking live on air...

Muslim men making gun gestures to the camera, shouting free Palestine, and then the Sky news vehicle had it's tyres stabbed on camera...

This does not make the mainstream media ...

Sky News

When I watch all the footage of the UK citizens in the streets, you see hordes of police everywhere..... all over the place.....then compare that to all the footage of large groups of Muslims in Birmingham, blocking of roads, carrying weapons....searching cars...... no police at all ... nothing.

Are they afaid of being called racists if they also target and search or arrest the Muslim population?

I fully get why so many angry British citizens are saying that there is a two tier policing system in place and that the Muslims can get away with so much more.

Here is one of the most logical and sensible statements made by a gentleman called Sunil Sharma, regarding these riots in the UK, that he spoke about on GBNEWS yesterday.

This is exactly what the people of the UK are experiencing it right now, and have been for many years already..

This guy is 100% correct with every word.

Sunil Sharma

I agree with some of your points, but to me the very first step that needs to be addressed is that you cannot keep pointing the finger and calling anyone who speaks out about this... "Far Right" racist activists.

This is clearly a British issue and concern, not just pigeon holed to one particular group. 

You do get the stupid racist far right lunatics, and they will always be involved in issues like this to some degree.

Every single person that voices some opinion on this is automatically lablled far right which is ignorant and stupid.

Once the people start seeing that their concerns are actually being heard and addressed, without being labelled, that's where you need to start.

You most defintely don't make insensitive posts like Starmer just did with ...

"We will not tolerate attacks on Mosques or on Muslim communities"

To which Elon Musk very correctly replied directly to that post with

"Shouldn't you be concerned with attacks on "all" communities"

Elon is also not wrong by pointing out that the police action against rioters and protesters seems to be very one sided.... and I agree

I agree with some of your points, but to me the very first step that needs to be addressed is that you cannot keep pointing the finger and calling anyone who speaks out about this... "Far Right" racist activists.

This is clearly a British issue and concern, not just pigeon holed to one particular group. 

You do get the stupid racist far right lunatics, and they will always be involved in issues like this to some degree.

Every single person that voices some opinion on this is automatically lablled far right which is ignorant and stupid.

The events of the last week where organised and co-ordinated by the far right. I'd wager the majority of those who have taken part in the riots and who have engaged in vandalism and attacks on the police are far right racists. That's not to say all those who attended the riots are far right. Some may have concerns and just wanted to protest or an outlet to vent those concerns but did not partake in acts of criminality. Some others who did partake in the riots and in criminality may have not motivated by racism but just wanted an excuse to riot and loot. There also might be a few who engaged in criminality that didn't intend to but got swept up in the moment.

Regardless of the motivation I do not believe the people who attended these riots are reflective of the majority of the UK population. Yes a considerable proportion of the UK population has issues with immigration but the vast majority of the them would never act like the rioters have done so over the last week.

You most defintely don't make insensitive posts like Starmer just did with ...

"Yes a considerable proportion of the UK population has issues with immigration but the vast majority of the them would never act like the rioters have done so over the last week"

I agree to a point, but it also does not take much at all to start getting more people from the general population involved..... just imagine another big incident happens involving Muslims or immigrants.....that is just putting petrol on the fire...

"I don't find that comment Starmer made remotely insensitive. Muslims have been specifically targeted during the the events of the last week.  He's quiet right to say that attacks on the Muslim community will not be tolerated"

This is where you and I will always differ ..... Starmer should definitely have used this specific opportunity to make a very clear statement which includes the entire population, and not just defend the Muslims being attacked, because that could and probably will be seen as divisive to many people ..... what about the innocent white British people being attacked in the streets, shops and even inside a pub for no reason at all.... who were not even involved in any riot or protest action.....just attacked for being White....is that ok just because the Muslims were apparently attacked first...... no ..... not at all, but Starmer or you don't talk about that, which again, just sends out the incorrect message to your people that you are favouring one side in this.

"Musk is one of the gaslighters. Stating a specific community will be protected does not mean that other communities in the UK will not be protected"

I don't agree at all... Musk is correctly calling Starmer out for sending out the incorrect and divisive message, especially under such devastating and dangerous or volatile conditions....

"The overwhelming majority of the rioting for the last week has been caused and organised by the far right"

And yet again you still say nothing about what the Muslims do or have done... that contributes to this resultant behaviour or response....which to be very clear I do not condone in the slightest..... I truly think it is disgusting and despicable from all sides.

I am still yet to see the police presence where the Muslims are running around the streets with weapons, shouting "Allah Akbar", and "Sharia Law in UK", or "Down with the Zionists"....pointing gun gestures at the cameras...... deliberately provoking and antagonsing the people on purpose......yet you constantly say nothing at all about this happening every day.....imagine anyone standing in any Muslim country constantly shouting that "Christianity Rules", or "Jesus is God, not Mohammed"......you would be beaten up, possibly killed or locked up.

I do definitely see a two tier policing system, I am seeing it every single day, and it is pathetic....both sides should be treated with the very same comtempt that it deserves, regarding this type of behaviour, but it is definitely not happening .... the Muslims are by far being given way too much leeway and leniency to behave in a way that would usually get someone arrested, but in their cases, it is not happening anywhere on the level that it is with the white people, and this is fact.

400 and counting .... currently arrested

Brilliant, I hope they get them all ..... on both sides.

It's disgusting what people on both sides have been doing since this started and that needs to be acknowledged by the people in government and policing.

I agree to a point, but it also does not take much at all to start getting more people from the general population involved..... just imagine another big incident happens involving Muslims or immigrants.....that is just putting petrol on the fire...

I disagree. This is a YouGov poll published yesterday

https://yougov.co.uk/topics/overview/survey-results/daily/2024/08/05/a3217/1

It asks, Do you think those caught taking part in the recent riots should receive harsher or more lenient sentences than would normally issued for those kinds of crimes, or should they a punishment that is about the same as would normally be issued.

Just 7% said the sentence should be more lenient. With 88% saying sentences should be harsher or the same as normal. YouGov also has a section categorising those polled by the political party they voted for in the last election and even among Reform UK voters who would typically be more inclined to view immigration unfavourably, 78% of the Reform voters polled wanted harsher or the same sentences as normal.

And this poll also from YouGov shows who the public believe is most responsible for the riots.

The rioters do not have the support of the general population. They are not the silent majority. 

This is where you and I will always differ ..... Starmer should definitely have used this specific opportunity to make a very clear statement which includes the entire population, and not just defend the Muslims being attacked, because that could and probably will be seen as divisive to many people ..... what about the innocent white British people being attacked in the streets, shops and even inside a pub for no reason at all.... who were not even involved in any riot or protest action.....just attacked for being White....is that ok just because the Muslims were apparently attacked first...... no ..... not at all, but Starmer or you don't talk about that, which again, just sends out the incorrect message to your people that you are favouring one side in this.

The overwhelming majority of the rioting in the last week has been perpetrated by the far right.  They have specifically targeted Muslims. Yes there has been incidents like with the example of the man in the pub or the Sky News journalist and absolutely those responsible should be arrested and prosecuted. But that in absolute no way makes the two side equivalent in the events over the last week.  

I don't agree at all... Musk is correctly calling Starmer out for sending out the incorrect and divisive message, especially under such devastating and dangerous or volatile conditions....

It's not remotely divisive. If say the Jewish or LGBT communities where being specifically attacked, I've no doubt Starmer would say those specific communities would be protected as well. Musk is one of the ones stirring the pot here.

And yet again you still say nothing about what the Muslims do or have done... that contributes to this resultant behaviour or rewhich to be very clear I do not condone in the slightest..... 

What contributes to the resultant behaviour is a disproportionate emphasis on the crimes and misbehaviour of minorities, immigrants and asylum seekers. Its what creates a perception that these groups are responsible for more crimes than they actually are. 

I truly think it is disgusting and despicable from all sides.sponse....

You can think that, but it comes across as trying to say the two sides are equivalent, but with the  present situation that's just not the case, the vast majority of the disorder is coming from the far right.

I am still yet to see the police presence where the Muslims are running around the streets with weapons, shouting "Allah Akbar", and "Sharia Law in UK", or "Down with the Zionists"....pointing guns at the cameras...... deliberately provoking and antagonsing the people on purpose......yet you constantly say nothing at all about this happening every day.

Its not that I say nothing about them, its just I'm not fixated on those who engage in those activities. Muslims are not like the Borg Collective, they don't have all the same thoughts and beliefs. Yes some Muslims would like Sharia Law to be in the UK, others don't and another subsection believe Sharia Law should be in effect in the UK but only for Muslims.  I don't know what the context of that Down with the Zionists chant is, but I know many non Muslim's are also against Zionism (and no that's not the same as being antisemitic)

I do definitely see a two tier policing system, I am seeing it every single day, and it is pathetic....both sides should be treated with the very same comtempt that it deserves, regarding this type of behaviour, but it is definitely not happening .... the Muslims are by far being given way too much leeway to behave in a way that would usually get someone arrested, but in their cases, it is not happening anywhere on the level that it is with the white people, and this is fact.

Its not a fact, that's an opinion. Just this year the Head of Britain's Police Chiefs stated that the UK police is institutionally racist while the Casey Review last year found the same. While I'm sure there has been cases of the police being reluctant to peruse members of minority groups for fear of being branded racist, I'd be certain that if the UK policing can be classified as a two tier system its far more likely the system disadvantage's Muslims and other minorities considerably more often than it does benefit them.  

BB

The distortion is evident when listening what Watters said about the election.  The country is in chaos and tos ay that men only vote for for a woman candidate becasuse she is a woman  is  unatural -n othe words t sould not be whether the candidate is  male or female - it should be based on political issue - bt he ended up with that Waters mentioning a scietist who claimed that by doing that men morphed into a woman by doing that.     

"I disagree. This is a YouGov poll published yesterday"

Yes, that is right now.... but I clearly stated that if another serious incident occurred which involved Muslims or Immigrants, I can definitely see more people getting involved, and I still believe that.

Also polls need to be carefully looked at.....

For instance, I personally agree with the 88% you posted, that say that the penalties or sentences of the rioters should be harsher.... I have always stood for that, and have never changed my opinion... so not sure why you are bringing that up.....because we never discussed that.....however, on the flip side, another poll shows that nearly 60% of the British population sympathise with the protesters..... not the rioters..... and that also tells a very clear story, and also aligns with what I have been saying all along.

"It's not remotely divisive. If say the Jewish or LGBT communities where being specifically attacked, I've no doubt Starmer would say those specific communities would be protected as well. Musk is one of the ones stirring the pot here."

I don't agree at all, if two specific ethnic groups or religious groups or racial groups were at war with each other in a specific city, then in my view.... any respectable and knowledgable leader would release a public statement addressing everyone involved.... saying that any of the perpertrators from both sides will be hit with the full might of the law, and face a very lengthly prsion term...  if it is deemed that they have been involved in some illegal activity..... a respectable leader would never just release a statement saying that the attacking of just one specific ethnic or religious group will not be tolerated..... that is just a very stupid reponse to something that is so sensitive and volatile .... I can't believe that you don't or won't see that.

"The rioters do not have the support of the general population"

Where did I say that they did?

"Yes there has been incidents like with the example of the man in the pub or the Sky News journalist and absolutely those responsible should be arrested and prosecuted. But that in absolute no way makes the two side equivalent in the events over the last week."

You have you blinkers on .... you need to start watching and reading what is happening besides what you might maybe sometimes see in the mainstream media.... you are missing out on so much.....you make it sound like the Muslim crowds that are attacking people and instigating hatred are basically innocent in all of this.... absolutely crazy.

"What contributes to the resultant behaviour is a disproportionate emphasis on the crimes and misbehaviour of minorities, immigrants and asylum seekers. Its what creates a perception that these groups are responsible for more crimes than they actually are. "

Absolute bollocks dude....

Not a perception at all...... actual facts

This report below was only posted a few weeks ago, so it is very current and updated information.

The facts are that non Whites have double the amount of arrests than Whites, in fact it is 38.2 arrests for every 1000 Black people compared to 16.0 per 1000 White people....

It also states that Black people had the highest arrest rate in 38 out of 42 police forces

In Dorset in particular, Blacks were 8.1 times more likely to be arrested than White people.

In 9 police areas, Asian people had a higher arrest rate than White people

in 36 police force areas, mixed ethnic group people had a higher arrest rate than White people

In the Metropolitan police areas, people in the Asian, Black, Mixed and other ethnic groups, made up 56% of the arrests .... the highest percentage out of all police force areas.

Crime Stats

So how do you explain these stats?

"You can think that, but it comes across as trying to say the two sides are equivalent, but with the  present situation that's just not the case, the vast majority of the disorder is coming from the far right"

That does not exempt your Prime Ministers from addressing both sides that are involved in this... equally......and warning both sides about the consequences of their actions..... he could be seen or it could be perceived by some people as showing bias or favouritism towards one specific group.

"Its not that I say nothing about them, its just I'm not fixated on those who engage in those activities"

I see.....so then from all your reponses already, you are just fixated on the "Far Right" activities ..

"Yes some Muslims would like Sharia Law to be in the UK, others don't and another subsection believe Sharia Law should be in effect in the UK but only for Muslims."

In other words, you mean like not every White person is " Far Right " for voicing their concerns about issues like this.... it works both ways.... but again, you only defend the one side.

"While I'm sure there has been cases of the police being reluctant to peruse members of minority groups for fear of being branded racist"

There have been

"I'd be certain that if the UK policing can be classified as a two tier system its far more likely the system disadvantage's Muslims and other minorities considerably more often than it does benefit them"

I don't agree ...

Here is another report that was last update d in May 2024 which stipulates that just in London.... and only London.......   55% of the people that were arrested were from the Asian, Black, Mixed or other ethnic groups.

The highest percentage across the whole of England and Wales

London Stats

Yes, that is right now.... but I clearly stated that if another serious incident occurred which involved Muslims or Immigrants, I can definitely see more people getting involved, and I still believe that.

More people might have got involved but just as of now it would still have been a minority of people who either do not represent the majority of people.  But that's unlikely to happen now, the courts will make an example of some of rioters and the organisers of the riots along with some relatively normal people who just want along to have a look. Hefty prison sentences will deter riots on this scale for a number of years.

Also polls need to be carefully looked at.....

For instance, I personally agree with the 88% you posted, that say that the penalties or sentences of the rioters should be harsher.... I have always stood for that, and have never changed my opinion... so not sure why you are bringing that up.....because we never discussed that.....however, on the flip side, another poll shows that nearly 60% of the British population sympathise with the protesters..... not the rioters..... and that also tells a very clear story, and also aligns with what I have been saying all along.

I brought it up to show the point that rioters have little support among the public, even among those one might have thought sympathetic towards them. Who conducted that other poll? Odd that it varies from YouGov's. YouGov are generally regarded as the best pollster in the UK. 

I don't agree at all, if two specific ethnic groups or religious groups or racial groups were at war with each other in a specific city, then in my view.... any respectable and knowledgable leader would release a public statement addressing everyone involved.... saying that any of the perpertrators from both sides will be hit with the full might of the law, and face a very lengthly prsion term...  if it is deemed that they have been involved in some illegal activity..... a respectable leader would never just release a statement saying that the attacking of just one specific ethnic or religious group will not be tolerated..... that is just a very stupid reponse to something that is so sensitive and volatile .... I can't believe that you don't or won't see that.

Except there was no war between two groups in any city. Once again those participating in rioting and disorder where overwhelming from the far right. Mosques and Muslims have been deliberately targeted by these rioters. So Starmer was right to say that the targeted group would be protected, that doesn't mean other groups won't be protected. People who are claiming that he used divisive language have an ulterior motive for saying so. They want to establish a narrative that the two sides are as bad as the other and the blame is more or less equal, hence they take isolated incidents of counter groups and Muslims and place them on an equal footing with the vastly larger in scale series of co-ordinated criminality of the far right.

On the counter group and Muslim side, we had an example of a few making intimidating gestures, some carrying weapons, someone trying to slash a car trye and one example of an assault on a white person in a pub. There is probably other cases as well but there just the ones I know of.

On the far right side we have had over a week of sustained violence and criminality across nearly 30 cities in the UK with thousands of participants. Resulting in the injuring of over 120 police officers and a number of police animals. We have had shops, libraries looted and burned down. We have had citizens information offices wrecked. We have had numerous cars torched. We have had numerous private properties damaged. We have even an example of tombstones in a graveyard been broken down into rocks to be thrown at the police. We have had petrol bombs thrown, we have had a Hotel housing both asylum seekers as well native people being attempted to be set on fire with people still inside, an act which 100% meets the definition of terrorism. 

Try as some people might, there is just no just no way the two sides can be viewed equivalent.  Its like if we where talking about the war in Ukraine and people wanting to focus about Ukrainian war crimes (which there have a been a few in isolation) in equal measure with Russia's invasion and their war crimes (of which their have been many in a sustained campaign).  

Where did I say that they did?

I'm just pointing out how little support the rioters have.

You have you blinkers on .... you need to start watching and reading what is happening besides what you might maybe sometimes see in the mainstream media.... you are missing out on so much.....you make it sound like the Muslim crowds that are attacking people and instigating hatred are basically innocent in all of this.... absolutely crazy.

I can say the exact same, take the blinkers off, you need to get away from social media, there is so much false and misleading information being pushed on there. Your making it sound like the two sides are equivalent when at this stage. For every act of criminality conducted by a Muslim in the last week, how many where conducted by the far right rioters, 20, 30, 50 or 100?.  Now I don't know what exactly the ratio is, but it's clear and obvious that one side is overwhelming responsible for the criminality. 

Absolute bollocks dude....

Not a perception at all...... actual facts

This report below was only posted a few weeks ago, so it is very current and updated information.

The facts are that non Whites have double the amount of arrests than Whites, in fact it is 38.2 arrests for every 1000 Black people compared to 16.0 per 1000 White people....

It also states that Black people had the highest arrest rate in 38 out of 42 police forces

In Dorset in particular, Blacks were 8.1 times more likely to be arrested than White people.

In 9 police areas, Asian people had a higher arrest rate than White people

in 36 police force areas, mixed ethnic group people had a higher arrest rate than White people

In the Metropolitan police areas, people in the Asian, Black, Mixed and other ethnic groups, made up 56% of the arrests .... the highest percentage out of all police force areas.

Crime Stats

So how do you explain these stats?

How do I explain those stats, a combination of social economic factors and institutionalized racism in the UK police. That's not to excuse criminality among those groups though.

That does not exempt your Prime Ministers from addressing both sides that are involved in this... equally......and warning both sides about the consequences of their actions..... he could be seen or it could be perceived by some people as showing bias or favouritism towards one specific group.

It goes without saying, both sides will face consequences of their actions. The handful of isolated criminal incidents by individuals and members of the counter groups will be dealt with by the law. If Starmer had stated  both sides would face consequences to their actions it would be interpreted as both sides being equally responsible, which in itself would poison the discourse around what's happen and be a victory for the far right.

I see.....so then from all your reponses already, you are just fixated on the "Far Right" activities .

The present disorder is overwhelming caused by the far right. Its not fixation, that's just being factual.

In other words, you mean like not every White person is "Far Right" for voicing their concerns about issues like this.... it works both ways.... but again, you only defend the one side.

I already said not everyone who attended the riots are far right, but the majority of those organising this riots and those attending and partaking in violence and criminality are. Concerns are not addressed by mindless rioting and criminality.

I don't agree ...

The stats you yourself provided show clearly minority groups are not advantaged by the present UK policing system.

"Who conducted that other poll? Odd that it varies from YouGov's. YouGov are generally regarded as the best pollster in the UK"

Your YouGov's website ...

"People who are claiming that he used divisive language have an ulterior motive for saying so"

Nope, they are merely pointing out that they see it as him not addressing all the people involved in the unrest or riots....nothing malicious, or any ulterior motives at all ..... that's a cop out

For instance

You yourself believe that he was right to do what he did, whilst many many others believe that he is not handling this unrest and protesters well at all .... in fact, up until now, one poll says that only 31% of the British population believe that Starmer is handling these protests and rioting well.

Another poll says that the overall public opinion is that 49% say that Starmer has handled it poorly.

Another poll of 2114 people showed that only 14% thought that the politicians were handling the unrest well..... so no, I don't agree with your numbers or theories at all.

I guess it depends on which poll you read.

"Its like if we where talking about the war in Ukraine and people wanting to focus about Ukrainian war crimes (which there have a been a few in isolation) in equal measure with Russia's invasion and their war crimes (of which their have been many in a sustained campaign)."

I just don't get your logic, I just don't....

Like your analogy above .... it's exactly like calling a cease fire and you only telling Russia that they better not do anything to Ukraine, without telling Ukraine the same thing. it just makes no sense....

"I can say the exact same, take the blinkers off, you need to get away from social media, there is so much false and misleading information being pushed on there"

I am very aware of that, but until I post something as true, that is verifyably false, which might possibly happen sometime, who knows.... my eyes are wide open..... but I don't believe yours are, to the same extent anyway.

You basically called me delusional or stupid for saying a long time ago that these riots would happen one day, in the UK and Ireland .... and look at it now...... I was not wrong .... even if I now wish I was.....

I predicted what would eventually happen at some point on your own doorstep, and you didn't.....so telling me that my blinkers are on doesn't hold much water with me. 

"How do I explain those stats, a combination of social economic factors and institutionalized racism in the UK police. That's not to excuse criminality among those groups though"

Another cop out, and most will see it that way....... the easy way out ..... socio .... econonic..... racism ..... the usual rebuttal 

"If Starmer had stated  both sides would face consequences to their actions it would be interpreted as both sides being equally responsible"

Well ..... that's because they are both responsible..... you only want to see the ratios......

"The present disorder is overwhelming caused by the far right. Its not fixation, that's just being factual."

Ahhhh I see .... much like the stats I posted above.....not a fixation either....they are not just overwhelming, but they are also factual ....which you excuse away as racism, socio-economic ... and .... and ..... ...maybe add in previously disadvantaged ....apartheid.... uneducated .....etc etc

"I already said not everyone who attended the riots are far right, but the majority of those organising this riots and those attending and partaking in violence and criminality are"

Where are these factual numbers?

In the book of Stav anybody opposing the leftist outlook on isues are far-right and they are the only people atackng peaceful people. - but people opposng the leftist apprach are not all far right,   So I have  question how many people were ijured and even killed by the far-right rioters - ow many veicles or buildigs have been destroyed by the rioters through arson.

Not all protess aere violent - but that is he first question to be asked.   How violent in reaity is the present situation in England.   

There is somehig I observed,   Starmer as two problems he is trying to serv both sides in the disputes,    If he is too obviously sided with the Musims he would lose White working class support.    If he is neutral or seen to be supporting the Muslim community the Muslims will not  abandon him, but the working class Whites will see it otherwise, 

Sorry for the poor bugge - but it is more difiult to Govern than it is being in opposition.   

The Conservative Pary is in a mess - they were deserted by millions of voters who voted for the Reform Party - so their media would also be blaming the Reform Pary supporters for the riots.

   .      

Mike, these riots are really bad, and they are now anticipating another 100 elsewhere throughout the UK.

Targeting that building with people inside was disgusting, and those guys needs to be put away, no question at all.... as well as the others for what they have done.

One White rioter has just been given a 3 year prison sentence for punching a police officer..... and I agree with sending a strong message to all the people causing this carnage, because there needs to be a strong message sent that it will never be tolerated and that very harch penalties or sentences will apply.... but it must be consistently done, to both sides....and only time will tell.

I seriously have my doubts, but I hope I am proven wrong.

For instance, you recently had the two Muslim brothers who attacked those police in Manchester, resulting in some of the police being hospitalised, with one policewoman suffering a broken nose...and they are still walking completely free.... even after camera footage shows the GBH.... I assume because of the furore over the kick to the head.

That one police officer stupidly kicked and stamped on the one guys head, which was in the heat of the moment, and only after the police were physically attacked themselves....and he might not get sanctioned too badly, or maybe he will....because they are apparently saying that he thought that his gun could have been taken, and that he was furious that the ladies were punched..... so time will tell and I'm not sure yet on the full story, so we will see what comes out., but he has already correctly been suspended.

It will be very interesting to see how this incident with the two brothers will be handled, because up until right now, there are already huge discrepancies to how they would have handled this case if the perpertrators were White.

Your YouGov's website ...

My mistake, I overlooked that one. Well I think its fair enough if people want to protest against immigration in a peaceful manner.

Nope, they are merely pointing out that they see it as him not addressing all the people involved in the unrest or riots....nothing malicious, or any ulterior motives at all ..... that's a cop out

In my view the criticism of what Starmer said is just a blatant attempt to create a sense of false equivalence between the two sides. Its completely disingenuous.

For instance

You yourself believe that he was right to do what he did, whilst many many others believe that he is not handling this unrest and protesters well at all .... in fact, up until now, one poll says that only 31% of the British population believe that Starmer is handling these protests and rioting well.

Another poll says that the overall public opinion is that 49% say that Starmer has handled it poorly.

Another poll of 2114 people showed that only 14% thought that the politicians were handling the unrest well..... so no, I don't agree with your numbers or theories at all.

I guess it depends on which poll you read.

Starmer may be considered to be handling the riots bad, but how much of that is simply down to what amounts to standard criticism coming from supporters of opposition parties, Tory and Reform voters are unlikely to approve of him whatever he does. It also doesn't break down the reason why people thinking he's handling it badly. For all me know it could be that people think he isn't being tough enough on the rioters.

I just don't get your logic, I just don't....

Like your analogy above .... it's exactly like calling a cease fire and you only telling Russia that they better not do anything to Ukraine, without telling Ukraine the same thing. it just makes no sense....

A ceasefire is not a ceasefire unless both sides agree to it. My analogy makes perfect sense. Russia launched a war of aggression against Ukraine, it's committed deliberate war crimes in a sustained way planned from the top down. There have been examples of potential Ukrainian war crimes but they appear to be isolated acts committed by individuals or small groups, but nothing that appears to be a sustained or planned campaign that's been widely implemented. The two sides are not equivalent. Its the same with the current rioting. Of course the individuals who have carried out these isolated incidents should be prosecuted (and I hear the guy wielding that knife/sword in Birmingham has been charged) but why are these isolated incidents being put on the same pedestal as rioting, violence and criminality on a much larger scale. 

I am very aware of that, but until I post something as true, that is verifyably false, which might possibly happen sometime, who knows.... my eyes are wide open..... but I don't believe yours are, to the same extent anyway.

You basically called me delusional or stupid for saying a long time ago that these riots would happen one day, in the UK and Ireland .... and look at it now...... I was not wrong .... even if I now wish I was.....

I predicted what would eventually happen at some point on your own doorstep, and you didn't.....so telling me that my blinkers are on doesn't hold much water with me. 

Which posts where those?

Another cop out, and most will see it that way....... the easy way out ..... socio .... econonic..... racism ..... the usual rebuttal 

What are you reasons? 

Well ..... that's because they are both responsible..... you only want to see the ratios......

If their a crime wave where one group commits 50 crimes, and another commits 1 is it not fair to say one side is overwhelming responsible.

Ahhhh I see .... much like the stats I posted above.....not a fixation either....they are not just overwhelming, but they are also factual ....which you excuse away as racism, socio-economic ... and .... and ..... ...maybe add in previously disadvantaged ....apartheid.... uneducated .....etc etc

Well if reports keep finding the police racist, the head of police chiefs claims the force is racist and you have statistics that minorities are convicted at far higher rate than white people for the same crimes , it does indicate their is likely more to it than simply Muslims/blacks/insert minority groups are just more prone to committing crime than white people. Then you have research from America and other countries than indicate immigrants and asylum seekers commit less crime than the native population does, which makes sense because they would risk being deported.

Where are these factual numbers?

You know there is no factual numbers yet available but its clear the organisers are on the far right, that is the position of the UK police and UK government.