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FORUM / RUGBY /  De Kock looks under kooked

De Kock looks under kooked

Started by Mozart56 REPLIES563 VIEWS· 23 Feb 2014, 17:16
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CE
Ceradyne
Pro9,374 posts
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CeradynePro9,374 posts
26 Feb 2014, 15:31
#41
26 Feb 2014, 15:31#41

Saffex

Status: Hall Of Fame
Posts: 7282 RE: De Kock looks under kooked
February 26, 2014, 11:12:06

So Mike, in your infinite cricket wisdom, kindly explain why Miller would not make a test bat.

 

Vlag you thick shit, why should JP not be in the test side???????????????



Because, you thick shit, he is crap. He scores once every few years, and the fact that he is supposed to be an all-rounder is BS. I have already told you he does not fit the description of an all-rounder by any means. Go check his batting figures. You want to get rid of Faf, but you want to hang on to Duminy? Really? Faf has scored three centuries in less than a year and a half. Duminy has only just scored his third century in just more than five years. Faf has also scored three fifties less than a year and a half. Duminy has scored five in five years. Faf has never been out for a duck. Duminy has five behind his name. Duminy's batting figures for his last innings were  5, 28, 25, 10, 123, and 18. Faf's last six innings were 134, 43, 3, 18, 55, and 24.

Yes, I know that you did not say that Duminy should replace Faf but I only used Faf as an example of how crooked your argument is. In one breath you are saying that Faf is not good enough and should not be their. Then you want Duminy, with figures inferior to that of Faf, in the side. Eish. It helps zip if Duminy can bowl a few balls and maybe take a wicket or two but he does not score runs. He is primarily a batsman and not a bowler. He is and never will be a threat to any team with the ball.
SA
Saffolk
Captain30,741 posts
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Saffolk Captain30,741 posts
26 Feb 2014, 21:35
#42
26 Feb 2014, 21:35#42
Good old Vlag confirming as usual how hopelessly ignorant he is when it comes to sport.......yeah I can just see them dropping JP......what a fucking thick plank you are.

JP is a far more gifted bat than Faf......JP's average is on the up, Faf's is on the down......you get the picture dumbass......Faf hit the test scene with a bang......but given his awful technique, it was only a matter of time before he was exposed at the highest level......by this time next year his average will be 40
CL
clevermike
Coach57,555 posts
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clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
26 Feb 2014, 22:31
#43
26 Feb 2014, 22:31#43

Saffex


You must not get carried away by your own misguided opinions on players.   Obviously Du Plessis's test average would come down - it was an unthinkable 163 after the previous Aussie series and no player in World cricket will maintain that kind of average.


Duminy was playing poorly for nearly three years and his latest century was a great surprise to everyone. 


You must be the only person who wants to get rid of Du Plessis in the test cricket side and keep Duminy.


I admire a lot of what you write on this site - and often support you - but your hang ups on a few players you do not like because they threaten your favourites are never  reasonable and the result of logical and objective analysis .  

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Saffolk
Captain30,741 posts
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Saffolk Captain30,741 posts
26 Feb 2014, 22:46
#44
26 Feb 2014, 22:46#44
Mike what part of me saying that I would be ok with Faf staying did you not get......I can live with Faf......he is a fighter, but a technically flawed bat. Without a flinch, JP is a far better bat than Faf
If it was down to me, my test side would be: 1. Smith 2. Elgar 3. Amla 4. AB 5. JP 6. de Kock (w) 7. Miller 8. Philander 9. Steyn 10. Morkel 11. de Lange......the only possible variation I would consider would be Parnell for de Lange, but I prefer the raw pace of de Lange.......so as you can see Faf would not make my side.


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clevermike
Coach57,555 posts
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clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
26 Feb 2014, 23:08
#45
26 Feb 2014, 23:08#45

Saffex


Just a question - is Smith not an even worse technoically flawed batter than Du Plessis?  Further- is Duminy with his poor batting record - despite the surprise century last week - a reliable batiing option?

SA
Saffolk
Captain30,741 posts
SA
Saffolk Captain30,741 posts
26 Feb 2014, 23:14
#46
26 Feb 2014, 23:14#46
No, Smith is not technically worse and Smith is in a different class to Faf.....Smith made it aged 21, Faf will never really make it.

JP needed a good innings, he has now had that and will now be the bat we all know he should be......the guy is a class act......so yes, right now, he is reliable as he proved in his last two innings's.

Give me JP over Faf any day.......its no contest.......Faf's average will continue to go down and JP's will climb........Faf is just another Alviro......no better no worse
CE
Ceradyne
Pro9,374 posts
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CeradynePro9,374 posts
26 Feb 2014, 23:21
#47
26 Feb 2014, 23:21#47
ex

Status: Hall Of Fame
Posts: 7299 RE: De Kock looks under kooked
February 26, 2014, 19:35:01 Good old Vlag confirming as usual how hopelessly ignorant he is when it comes to sport.......yeah I can just see them dropping JP......what a fucking thick plank you are.

JP is a far more gifted bat than Faf......JP's average is on the up, Faf's is on the down......you get the picture dumbass......Faf hit the test scene with a bang......but given his awful technique, it was only a matter of time before he was exposed at the highest level......by this time next year his average will be 40


 
Saffex, one thing that I can say about you and being a cricket selector is that it is unbelievable how fortunate SA is that you are not a selector for the Proteas. Of course they would not drop Duminy. You heard about transformation?

As for Faf and Duminy, as I have tried to explain to you earlier, I am not saying that Faf should be retained in place of Duminy. I have just used it as an example of how terribly thick you are when it comes to judging players. What I was trying to indicate to you was that you want Faf out in favour of Miller, despite Faf having the better First Class performance and despite the fact that Faf is proven to be doing bloody well in the test side. I was merely using the Faf and Duminy examples to indicate just how foolish you really are. You want Faf, who has the better track record but you want to keep Duminy whose track record is crap.

There is no proof of Duminy being a so-called gifted player. Fuck-all. Zip. You just need to look at his batting graph. You do not even  have to compare it to any other batsman to know that it is crap. That is, of course, if you understand a batting graph, which I doubt. I have, after all posted such a batting graph and from your response, it was clear that you were completely in lost and in the dark.
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Saffolk
Captain30,741 posts
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Saffolk Captain30,741 posts
26 Feb 2014, 23:34
#48
26 Feb 2014, 23:34#48
Vlag please dont mention the word 'thick' for its a little laughable coming from you and I mean that sincerely.

I dont need averages and stats to tell me what a class act JP is as a bat......has he failed to deliver his true worth......damn right he has. But gifted he is......more so than any bats in the SA side other than AB and Amla.

I dont give a toss about Miller's first class average......that is historical.......what is certain is that Miller has come of age in the last year and with that should come elevation to the test squad. The guy is technically sound......better equipped than most in the current side.

What you dont get dumb Vlag is that with my selections, we have the 11 best cricketers in SA in my side.

How racist and insulting it is to call the gifted JP a transformation selection......shame on you, you sad pathetic old man  
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Ceradyne
Pro9,374 posts
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CeradynePro9,374 posts
27 Feb 2014, 00:09
#49
27 Feb 2014, 00:09#49
 

Saffex

Status: Hall Of Fame
Posts: 7302 RE: De Kock looks under kooked
February 26, 2014, 21:34:59 Vlag please dont mention the word 'thick' for its a little laughable coming from you and I mean that sincerely.

I dont need averages and stats to tell me what a class act JP is as a bat......has he failed to deliver his true worth......damn right he has. But gifted he is......more so than any bats in the SA side other than AB and Amla.

I dont give a toss about Miller's first class average......that is historical.......what is certain is that Miller has come of age in the last year and with that should come elevation to the test squad. The guy is technically sound......better equipped than most in the current side.

What you dont get dumb Vlag is that with my selections, we have the 11 best cricketers in SA in my side.

How racist and insulting it is to call the gifted JP a transformation selection......shame on you, you sad pathetic old man 



SA
Saffolk
Captain30,741 posts
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Saffolk Captain30,741 posts
27 Feb 2014, 14:04
#50
27 Feb 2014, 14:04#50
Lost for words - you are true to form  
DE
Denny
Captain12,893 posts
DE
DennyCaptain12,893 posts
27 Feb 2014, 14:11
#51
27 Feb 2014, 14:11#51

 "Lost for words"?.......nope....

 

just lost!

SA
Saffolk
Captain30,741 posts
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Saffolk Captain30,741 posts
27 Feb 2014, 14:13
#52
27 Feb 2014, 14:13#52
Useless twat he is  
CL
clevermike
Coach57,555 posts
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clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
27 Feb 2014, 15:59
#53
27 Feb 2014, 15:59#53

 Saffex


It is not what a person does when he first on the scene that ultimately counts.   Over a period if about two years the guy would shine - and then the better bowlers would have worked him out.   The identified how really Smith's technique is and  over the past five years he has had a spotty performance record - making runs basically against weaker attacks.


Smith is out of form as you claim - but the main reason for his being out of form is the fact that his ridiculously deficient  technique is being used against him by top bowlers he comes up against, 


Faf is not as deficient as Smith is technique wise and fielders fo not block up jis run scoring areas like they with Smith.

SA
Saffolk
Captain30,741 posts
SA
Saffolk Captain30,741 posts
27 Feb 2014, 17:40
#54
27 Feb 2014, 17:40#54

Um Mike, Smith has been around for years, its a bit late for bowlers to be working out his poor technique......they did that years ago and its well documented......so stop speaking shit......he is in bad form and that has stuff all to do with bowlers working him out.......geeez, how much more obvious is that.

 

 

Faf's technique of a wide grip is ten times worse than Smith's tendency to play balls on middle to the leg side.

 

 

Smith is twice the bat Faf is and is the very reason he has averaged 50 odd over a 10 year period.......that stat marks a class act........Faf within 2 years will be either out of the test side or averaging 40   

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clevermike
Coach57,555 posts
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clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
27 Feb 2014, 18:03
#55
27 Feb 2014, 18:03#55

 Saffex


Two to three years after he came on the scene was years ago and that is what I stated before.  After the first two years - Smith's form took a different route.  Against stronger attacks he would not score decent runs - against poorer attacks he does.   Years ago it becane apparent that he would have a good batting performance once in about every six innings he batted and the present dip in form is part of a similar cycle that has been in evidence for years.    As he g ot older the problem seems to be getting more noticeable.


  

SA
Saffolk
Captain30,741 posts
SA
Saffolk Captain30,741 posts
27 Feb 2014, 18:35
#56
27 Feb 2014, 18:35#56

DomMike.......how the fuck do you average 50 at test level over a 10 year period if your form took a different route.......stop speaking shit and making your name arse.

 

His age has stuff all to do with it, he is hardly past it  

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Ceradyne
Pro9,374 posts
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CeradynePro9,374 posts
27 Feb 2014, 21:18
#57
27 Feb 2014, 21:18#57
 Fokkit but you get dim  guys. Smith is one of the strongest players on his  leg side. Is it wrong to play to your strengths? No ways. He is dangerous the moment that a ball is bowled on middle and  leg. That is common  knowledge. He does not often get out on  his leg side. It is when he "goes fishing" outside his off-side that he gets caught behind.

Smith got trapped LBW in only 23% of his dismissals in his entire test career. He was caught behind in 20% of his dismissals and caught 37% of the times. So, in total he got caught out in more than half of his dismissals. He has previously gone through more serious slumps than the present one and, as Saffex has said, he has come back to score big runs time and again. Saffex is correct.

These were his most recent dismissals:
v Aus 2014 - caught twice, bowled once and lbw once.
v Ind 2013 - caught once, run out once, lbw once and not out once.
v Pakistan 2013 - caught twice, stumped once and a DNB
v Pakistan 2013 - caught three times, lbw twice and a DNB
v NZ 2013 - caught once, lbw once and two DNBs
v Aus 2012/3 - caught four times, lbw once.
v England 2012 - bowled once, caught four times, one lbw and one DNB.

That is lbw 7 times compared to 17 times caught, bowled twice, and one stumping.

To say that Smith has had  a spotty performance over the last five years isutter bullshit. I am not even going to waste time showing his batting performances over the last five years. I will just post a link to  his batting graph. http://www.howstat.com.au/cricket/Statistics/Players/PlayerBatGraph.asp?PlayerID=3014

From the above, it is clear that he posts big scores on a regular basis throughout his entire career. One just have to look at the regularity with which the red spikes (50s) and the blue spikes (100s) appear.

Fact is that Smith has had a poor technique right from the start of his career and he has acknowledged that himself often enough for  it not to be a secret. So, to say that bowlers has now discovered it/worked it out is utter bullshit.

There are many cricket players who has overcome  poor technique by working around it. Fanie de Villers was one. He was a javelin thrower at school and that was why he had a poor bowling technique and he had to adapt and by all  accounts he shoould have been a crap bowler due to this. This is not something that I heard somewhere or sucked out of my thumb. He described it in his book and he discuss it on his program on Kyknet before I left SA.
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