Pat Lambie at flyhalf

So then Moz, how do you account for Tuilangi standing 6ft and weighing over 110kg?

The 10 should not have loosies running at him if his loosies are doing their job. Sure the 10 is going to have big lads running at him, thats why you dont select a defensive liability like Morne at 10......Goosen and Lambie are far better defenders than Morne

The 12 has to be 95kg plus for he is expected to impose himself physically on attack and defence.......this is not something expected of a 10

Very interesting reading the comments here. Quite simply we do not know what we want at 10. Apart from saying that we would take DC, Cruden or Barrett there is no 10 in SA that comes close to running a game.
I have said all along our thinking is wrong about what we want. If our 10's can kick at goal and get all the points on offer he is the 'messiah'. If you add a drop goal in there he is 'God'. 
There is and has been no 10 in SA that can dictate terms of a game even when we are on the front foot from the forwards. I am not blaming any of the 10s here. It is a coaching error that comes from U13 rugby and also the way we see the game in South Africa.
Desperate times need desperate measures but our 'brainstrust' think we are in a perfect position and have a lot of options. That is the problem right there.
As much as i think there is no long term solution, i think in the shorter term Boshoff could probably be the only player that has not been tarnished and you could work with. As probably the most idiotic idea, SP Marais at 10 . Desperation being the only reason.  
My personal thinking is that it is not the players fault. Its the way they are being told to play, which in most cases is not their natural game and what we expect from them. Throw in the unexpected and we may have a few surprises instead of being so predictable. Maybe our players should go to France from 18-21 and then return.

 I have this picture in my mind of Bastareaud running over Sexton, and I'm wondering why we think 10 channel isn't as tough as anything out there. RWC 15 is going to be more physical than anything to date....the Six Nations shows that. I just can't see Lambie or Goosen meeting that kind of physical onslaught and playing rugby like butterflies out there....they will be deep, deep in the pocket and shoeing leather. If we want a player who gets over the advantage line, we should give Fransie a chance to play 10 and see what happens.

 Mozart
Thanks for the joke - you really are a funny guy.  
Our Fransie played one game at 10 - in which game he attempted 4 tackles and missed 2.   Is he not the guy who looked sheepishly on while Harris ran around him to score a try for the Reds?
So far this year he had an excellent tackling record - missing all pf 26% of attempted tackles - a bit of a defensive sieve that one.
But then you think the more tackles missed - the better a defender is.  So nothing new here.        

 

mozart

Status: Rugby Legend
Posts: 6124 RE: Pat Lambie at flyhalf
March 20, 2014, 03:12:42  I have this picture in my mind of Bastareaud running over Sexton, and I'm wondering why we think 10 channel isn't as tough as anything out there. RWC 15 is going to be more physical than anything to date....the Six Nations shows that. I just can't see Lambie or Goosen meeting that kind of physical onslaught and playing rugby like butterflies out there....they will be deep, deep in the pocket and shoeing leather. If we want a player who gets over the advantage line, we should give Fransie a chance to play 10 and see what happens.
Moz, I get what you are saying about the 10 channel and big guys like Basteraud and I have been (probably still is) a fan of Basteraud but I have been watching him a bit closer lately. He is getting much slower than he was. He used to be quite quick for someone with such a big frame but he has slowed down a lot. He is still a monster when he goes an the rampage and when he tucks the ball under his arm. He used to be able to burst through tackles and then go on the run, but nowadays he just burst into tackles and then drag the whole lot with him like a stro ng forward being tackled by a number of smaller backline players. Having said that, the normal backline player still doesn't like to take him head-on.

The first clip was done almost three years ago:



This one is from the 2013/14 season:

Wow Moz, Tuilangi is 22 and will be mid career by 2015!!!!!!!!  

 Mozart 
You have it wrong -
*  Late Career with rare exception 29 to 30  - with declining performances commencing*  Middle career                         25 to 28  - prime performance*  Early career                           21 to 24  - exceptional performances at young age/
Once a player goes over 31 years of age - serious decline in performances always in evidence - with extremely rare exceptions.  De Villiers himself said that he must train twice as hard now to what he did at age 29 just to maintain the level of performance he maintained at 29.   Not all players  do and there are one constant - they get slower and less effective from the time they reach the age of 30 .  

 Where is Iron-Card?

Where I agree with this debate is that a strong 10-12-13 axis is the backbone of every successful World Cup winning team. What have seen is that Morné can competently put down players a great deal bigger than himself. In the Ellis Park disaster he was probably our best defender overall, never missing a single head-on tackle and cleaning up after failures from Jannie, Eben, Alberts and a few others regarded for being integral to the Bok defence. But more than a power 10 we need a complete 12. We can never evolve our game until we move on from one-trick pony Jean and find a test 13. Lambie has consistently failed to deliver the fundamentals of the position at 10, Goosen was brutally exposed throughout 2012 and is continuing in that vein... there is nobody at 10 other than Morné and no other at 12 but Frans. If either one of these two are omitted I predict an early semi-final exit.

 Well, Lambie is out for the rest of SR, we won't see much of Morne, but he is the incumbent. Goosen seems brittle and the Cheetahs are going nowhere ATM, Same at the Stormers. Bools 10's are either too young or too old. That leaves only Boshoff as contender playing locally. And maybe if Frans start playing 10, but unlike Moz, I don't think we can afford such a drastic experiment at this stage. So Morne it will be, with either Boshoff or Goosen gunning for the backup spot at FH?