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FORUM / RUGBY /  WC starting 15 projected today

WC starting 15 projected today

Started by Mozart41 REPLIES757 VIEWS· 06 Apr 2015, 21:46
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MO
Mozart
Captain49,914 posts
MO
MozartCaptain49,914 posts
06 Apr 2015, 21:46
#1
06 Apr 2015, 21:46#1

Willie 

Hougaard

De Allende

Frans

Habana

Pollard

F du Preez

Beast

Strauss

Jannie

Eben

Victor

Schalk 

Alberts 

Vermeulen


But it's early days Kriel may challenge, as may Kitshoff and Koch. But almost nobody except de Allende, Koch and Kitshoff have advanced their cause, I discount the brave Lions play.


Some are losing traction.. ..Lambie, Steppie, Hendricks, Bismarck, Mohoje, Coetzee.


Some are gone like JJ, Marcel, Lood and the like....never has beens.


And I strongly doubt Jean and Stephanie will beat their injuries in time to be match ready.

DB
DbDraad
Captain26,388 posts
DB
DbDraadCaptain26,388 posts
06 Apr 2015, 22:02
#2
06 Apr 2015, 22:02#2
 Frans, Victor, Hougie and Jannie should not be starting. Alberts must first redeem himself,  if possible. 
SA
Saffolk
Captain30,741 posts
SA
Saffolk Captain30,741 posts
06 Apr 2015, 22:13
#3
06 Apr 2015, 22:13#3
 Let's hope like hell it's nothing like that for that side would not get past the quarters.
Poor side not reflecting the best SA has to offer but the kind of side useless Meyer will select.
Imagine selecting Matfield as your starting lock let alone in the squad as a whole.....its beyond comprehension.
The side I would select would be:
15. Willie 14. JP 13. de Allende 12. Serfontein 11. Kriel 10. Pollard 9. Hougaard 1. Beast 2. Bismark 3. Coenie 4. Willemse 5. Etzebeth 6. Coetzee 7. PSDT 8. Vermeulen
16. Strauss 17. Nkanyane 18. Marcel v/d Merwe 19. Jacques du Plessis 20. Carr 21. Reinach 22. Lambie 23. v/Wyk
MO
Mozart
Captain49,914 posts
MO
MozartCaptain49,914 posts
06 Apr 2015, 22:20
#4
06 Apr 2015, 22:20#4
Now that side is a total disaster...Hougaard at scrum half....hell  didn't Ireland and Wales teach you anything.  Steppie ag no, not that  slow predictable inside step! And hahaha Stephanie on one knee playing flank...No Bobby we havent learned anything yet.
And that's just scratching the surface.
SA
Saffolk
Captain30,741 posts
SA
Saffolk Captain30,741 posts
06 Apr 2015, 22:26
#5
06 Apr 2015, 22:26#5
There was no issue with Hougaard at 9 against those sides at all much like there was no issue with Pollard against Ireland we just had an idiot as a coach who is leading us down a losing path much like your clueless lead. I recall the Hougaard who was outstanding against the best sides in the game in NZ and Oz.
You have to laugh at your take on Serfontein at 12 and then offer Frans as the option .....the guy that has done squat all year.
Last I checked PSDT will be good in 2 months.....the WC is some time away.
My side would win the WC.....yours with old men in it will exit at the quarters. Yours is an insult to rugby followers.
MO
Mozart
Captain49,914 posts
MO
MozartCaptain49,914 posts
06 Apr 2015, 22:31
#6
06 Apr 2015, 22:31#6
A Bools backline and a Sharks pack.....you are one confused fella Sapp. As for Stephanie coming back I think it's a long shot. My guess is he will end up having a proper operation on that knee in the off season.  
CL
clevermike
Coach57,555 posts
CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
06 Apr 2015, 22:32
#7
06 Apr 2015, 22:32#7
 Mozart
Are you really serious even posting that team?  You are talking about players advancing their claim - but what has the following done to justify their claims:-
*   Francois Steyn - the worst attacking center in SA over the past three years and second in the worst missed tackle ratio in SA in those years - with a tendency to lose ball possession and give away penalties - he was wicked thus far this year, but then he was no better last year:
*    Has Fourie du Preez enhanced his match fitness levels over the last year?   He could not play two successive good games in a row - the second one was normally unacceptable or barely acceptable.   The  reason is apparent - in Japan the players only play every 14 days and they are not fit enough  to play every week.    The result is also a string of injuries - Du Preez is no exception.   A  reputation selection at best.
*    Beast sometimes do show some signs op life - but he is by far not up to the standard of  performance he showed in the past.   At best an iffy selection.
*    Jannie du Plessis has been in serious decline over the past year and he is seriously defective at present.  He is not a shadow of the player he was at 30 and at present is way past his sell-by date.
*    Victor has all on his own turned our Tight 5 into a Tight 4.   He is physically deficient and not even remotely fulfilling the role of a lock.   Together with the questionable props we will lose the battle up front altogether with him in the mix
*    And then Willem Alberts - the guy who is clueless about most requirements  pertaining to loosie play and is constantly injured because of serious weight problems - has not played a match since June last year.   Besides that his defense is horribly poor and his ball carries non-existent.
Then you make two deductions - the one factual and the other one a fabrication.   Nobody knows and there were no medical or other reports indicating whether De Villiers will be able to play - so you are correct there.  Even if he is - there is a problem - De Villiers's performances showed a huge downturn in 2014 compared to 2013 and even of he can start playing in July 2015  there is no chance that he would get match practice before the WC and to play a person who are not matchfit would be lunacy.   Where you are fabricating things are in the case of Du Toit.  The medical reports confirm that he would be ready to play from middle June and your statement above must be wishful thinking on your part.   Your guess about another operation is laughable - the specialists would know - you definitely would not.   
I would much rather have the following team as a starting team based on known performance factors and not age, experience and reputation:-
15   Willie le Roux14   Hougaard13   Serfontein12   De Allende11   Habana10   Pollard 9   Reinach 8   Vermeulen 7   Burger/Labuschagne 6   Louw/Coetzee 5   Du Toit 4   Etzebeth 3   Koch 2   Strauss 1   Kitshoff
I know that you find it hard to believe that players goes into decline in performances the longer they play after the age of 30 - but what you produced  above is a joke insofar as especially the forwards are concerned.   I also know the reason why you want Alberts in the team - he must cover for the weak Mayfield in Tight 5 play and Matfield will make a few tackles in return.  That kind of thing can never work and it has never worked in the past.  To have two deficient players in the team in the faint hope that the two will augment each others deficiencies and thus make up two acceptable players  is just not on.  You inevitably end up with half a usable player in each position.  To juggle the loosies ar ound so as to justify Matfield's inclusion is a recipe for disaster. 
                    
       
MO
Mozart
Captain49,914 posts
MO
MozartCaptain49,914 posts
06 Apr 2015, 22:37
#8
06 Apr 2015, 22:37#8

Puleeze....the slowest 13 in the game, so slow he was gassed by the hammy restrict ed Pom flyhalf....Reinach the mistake waiting to happen also known as the charge down king.....a lock on one knee.....and five loosies.

 

Yep that team of 17 would probably win. 

sharkbok
sharkbok
Captain23,285 posts
sharkbok
sharkbokCaptain23,285 posts
06 Apr 2015, 22:39
#9
06 Apr 2015, 22:39#9
Another Saffex team of favourites where many are playing out of position to find a place for each of them.
Kriel selected on the left wing in place of Habana the most experienced Spingbok wing of all time, and current highest paid wing in world rugby. 
Delande the best inside center in SA by a mile is shifted to play outside centre so their is a space for Serfontein.
Coenie is great around the park, but his scrumming is not even SuperXV standard. The scrum collapses on his side ever time, or he gets lifted. He was much better scrumming at loosehead before his neck injury. 
PSDT at flank 
Hougaard can only play on fast dry pitches when his forwards give him cover. In the Northern Hemishpere or/and wet slow conditions, Hougaard becomes a poor excuse of a juggling clown. I suspect that Hougaard will never play at scrum half again in the Northern Hemishphere, and possibally for any rugby team. If the Bulls are playing him at wing, then this is where Meyer is considering him. 
Hougaard does not have the hands to play at scrum half, nor does he have an educated boot. Wing is his best position where he can use his running ability. 
MO
Mozart
Captain49,914 posts
MO
MozartCaptain49,914 posts
06 Apr 2015, 22:39
#10
06 Apr 2015, 22:39#10

Damn...charged again 

 

 

MO
Mozart
Captain49,914 posts
MO
MozartCaptain49,914 posts
06 Apr 2015, 22:49
#11
06 Apr 2015, 22:49#11
Hougaard is a head case when he is at 9.....an aggressive, effective wing deteriorates into a bumbling scrumhalf. Nowhere more evident than against Wales and Ireland. Against the Irish he fumbled the ball twice on the Irish line and against Wales in a close chase, given a penalty he takes a tap and then pumps the ball into touch! Complete utter panic. 
CL
clevermike
Coach57,555 posts
CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
06 Apr 2015, 22:51
#12
06 Apr 2015, 22:51#12
I put in two loosies in each of the openside or blindside positions because of the fact that Burger may get injured and Louw was also injury-prone recently.  Should have explained my reasoning in the relevant regard.  
My criticism is substantiated and clear - yours is pure and utter tripe.   I personally would prefer Kriel at 13 - but without any game time in that position that would just not happen.  
By the way - fact is that Serfontein has twice the speed and competence of Fransie - so he would do better than Steyn at 12 as well.  
OI
oimatey
Pro1,870 posts
OI
oimateyPro1,870 posts
06 Apr 2015, 22:55
#13
06 Apr 2015, 22:55#13
"Projected" - as in what he thinks Meyer will select, not his own team.
I think you're pretty close, although I could see Louw over Alberts and Schalk moving across. Also quota and diversity may mandate Hendricks on the wing instead of Hougaard, an inferior selection. 
I would also love to see Meyer give the Stormers prop tandem a long look. Scrumming is as much about combinations as backline play is and both are excellent in general play. Although Beast is a virtual lock (see Hendricks for reasons) if he's healthy. Either way I have a feeling Meyer desperately wants a replacement for Jannie. Coenie is an option, at least he started showing signs early in this season of again being dominant in the scrum but was disappointing against the Brumbies and looked to be back to his old ways of angling in away from pressure.
The Steyn/SARU relationship seems toxic, and his selection unfortunately may well hinge on the political climate there instead of whether Meyer wants him in the team or not. I'm not sure about DeAllende defensively at 13. There is a lot more pace and quickness in that channel and big fellas are particularly susceptible. I play him at 12 with Kriel at 13 (and giving old Ludeke a call and asking to play him there the rest of the S15)













CL
clevermike
Coach57,555 posts
CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
06 Apr 2015, 23:07
#14
06 Apr 2015, 23:07#14
 oimatey
If Meyer wants Steyn in his team - he must have his head read.  The man is a useless attacking player and he is more likely to lose ball possession than to off-load it as is claimed by Mozart to be the case.    Problem is his defense is also way below par.  
The above has been the case since he came back from France and his few performances this year was deplorable.   Plumtree was 100% correct when he said Steyn is NO center.  
MO
Mozart
Captain49,914 posts
MO
MozartCaptain49,914 posts
06 Apr 2015, 23:08
#15
06 Apr 2015, 23:08#15
Given we are covered at 15 with Willlie and Lambie as a more defensive "Halfpenny like" option, we should be trying Kriel at 13 to see how he responds.  The rest of your reasoning is also very sensible Matey...the Beast and Hendricks are likely to play.
MO
Mozart
Captain49,914 posts
MO
MozartCaptain49,914 posts
06 Apr 2015, 23:14
#16
06 Apr 2015, 23:14#16

A picture is worth a thousand words. The centre Moronic has been pushing for 3 years just after he lost the S15 semi last year.

 

CL
clevermike
Coach57,555 posts
CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
06 Apr 2015, 23:23
#17
06 Apr 2015, 23:23#17
 Sure the team lost 38 -6 and only one player is blamed for the loss.   That is typical Mozart idiocy.  In any event where did I suggest Jordaan be included in the squad, despite the fact that his defense over the last two years has been 40% better than that of Fransie and De Jongh.   The problem is the junk Mozart produces - entirely based on two incidents - one in 2013 and one in 2014.  The dud forgets the way Jordaan dealt with Nonu in the game last year - that means nothing to him. 
    
MO
Mozart
Captain49,914 posts
MO
MozartCaptain49,914 posts
06 Apr 2015, 23:41
#18
06 Apr 2015, 23:41#18
Nope it doesn't wash Moronic. That was the first Saders try caused by Joubert's clearance kick being poor....he had a chance to make amends by making a routine tackle on Read. But sadly he was road kill as Read hardly broke stride breaking his tackle. The Sharks were in the game to that point....it was a killer blow.
Tackling isn't optional
CL
clevermike
Coach57,555 posts
CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
06 Apr 2015, 23:53
#19
06 Apr 2015, 23:53#19
 Tell that story about tackling not being optional to Fransie and De Jongh - they need it  four times more than Jordaan.  
The Sharks never was in the game that match - as the total score clearly indicate.  That is one of your wild statements that is meaningless.
However, the topic here is not Jordaan.  He is merely a diversion tactic to get away from the very real criticism of a dud team suggested by you.    It is about the players - most of whom are basically suggested because of the fact that they are over 30 years of age and they are reputation players without any meritorious performances whatsoever -  whom you suggested should be in the Springbok team.  
MO
Mozart
Captain49,914 posts
MO
MozartCaptain49,914 posts
07 Apr 2015, 00:16
#20
07 Apr 2015, 00:16#20
 Frans' last player rating as a Bok

Frans Steyn – 7/10

It brings an entire new dimension to any back line when your inside centre has the capability to dictate the game with his boot. We enjoyed that element in 2007 when Jean got injured and it’s something I hope we can build on and perfect. Defensive rock that’s starting to mature his attacking game. Has to be said that constant change of outside centre will infringe on the potential he could reach.


Spot on...

CL
clevermike
Coach57,555 posts
CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
07 Apr 2015, 02:16
#21
07 Apr 2015, 02:16#21
 Was that in 2012 or earlier?   As far as I knowe his last match in 2012 was the piss poor performance he put in at Dunedin.  Here is his stats for that day:-
FPL Steyn0/002/4/71915106/20/000/0
There is not much evidence of Fransie's kicking in that game that could justify the comments you quoted.   And his defense  was putrid missing 25% of his tackles is further proof that that was not the test the comment was about.  So that could not be the test the comment you dug  up could be about.
So when was that test you quoted about.  If it was anything in 2012 it would surprise me.  Fransie came back from France in May 2012 - fat as a pig and totally out of form.  He was wicked in 2013 and as a center a disgrace as a center in 2014.  He came back from Japan and in the games he played this year he was worse than in 2013 - when Plumtree said he was not a center.  
So when was your spot on about?        
MO
Mozart
Captain49,914 posts
MO
MozartCaptain49,914 posts
07 Apr 2015, 02:50
#22
07 Apr 2015, 02:50#22
 2014....feeling embarrassed again? You are so sublimely stupid.!
CL
clevermike
Coach57,555 posts
CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
07 Apr 2015, 03:12
#23
07 Apr 2015, 03:12#23
Mozart 
When was that "last test" you quote the comment on - idiot?
Why don't you accept the stats so many times published on this site, showing that Steyn was -
*   the worst attacking center in 2014 in any SA Super 15 franchise;*   the second worst defender in 2014 in any SA Duper 25 franchise;*   the worst possession loser of any backline player in andy SA franchise
In all the games he played in in in 2014 Steyn made less line breaks and beat less defenders than De Allende did in the game on Saturday. He had a 26,5 missed tackle ratio last year only beaten by Benjamin of the Cheetahs when the latter played at inside center.   He lost ball possession 32 times in 17 matches and gave away 8 penalties all on his own.    That was his achievement at center last year last year.  If Serfontein was as bad  as Steyn was last year - you would have had his stats all over the show.
 "2014....feeling embarrassed again? ."  Steyn did not play in a single test since 2012.  What the hell are you talking about?     You are A COMPLETE AND UTTER IMBECILE.      
MO
Mozart
Captain49,914 posts
MO
MozartCaptain49,914 posts
07 Apr 2015, 03:50
#24
07 Apr 2015, 03:50#24
Point out where I use the term "test"  Moronic. 
MO
Mozart
Captain49,914 posts
MO
MozartCaptain49,914 posts
07 Apr 2015, 05:25
#25
07 Apr 2015, 05:25#25

Riddle me this Moronic, when is a Springbok game not a test.... klunk....is that the sound of the penny dropping?

CL
clevermike
Coach57,555 posts
CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
07 Apr 2015, 07:11
#26
07 Apr 2015, 07:11#26
 Any game not played against the national team of another country as authorised by the IRB is not a test.   For example a game played against a team like the Barbarians is not a test.   The game you are probably referring to was against the so-called "World Team" comprising mostly of a conglomerate of ex-international players playing club rugby and club players.   None of the team members have a snowballs hope in hell of ever playing international test rugby in future. 
You will find no evidence anywhere that that team is a test and even ESPN will not give you any stats on that game.   The SA players playing in that game did not get bok caps or was never credited with the game as a test.  Get it now stupid?
Now he falls back on a game that players played in as if that was a test.   So Fransie managed to get a rating of 7/10 for that one-off game - as if he was any good then. The laughable part is that you quote the rubbish written about   "it brings an entire new dimension to any back line when your inside centre has the capability to dictate the game with his boot.'    It must seriously be a joke - a center described as a player to dictate the game with his boot - that seriously is a joke.  A player who showed zero in attacking play for a whole season - suddenly becomes a player maturing in attack and a player who was extremely weak for the whole for the whole of 2013  and 2014 bewcoming a "defensive rock" .
So what can be gained from a moron who referred to that one game as a test - and then when I pointed out it was not a test changed the wording of his initial message and suddenly the players were Boks - which they were not.
Hell what a despicable idiot you are to even come up with this rubbish as proof that Steyn was a 'Bok" in that game.   And then quote a journalist assessment that he performed satisfactorily as evidence to contrast his actual whole performance record in the rugby he played in since his return from France.  
I am laughing my ass off.      
           
SA
Saffolk
Captain30,741 posts
SA
Saffolk Captain30,741 posts
07 Apr 2015, 10:57
#27
07 Apr 2015, 10:57#27

Sharks pack......so you have an issue with Beast and Bismark in the frontrow.....who happen to be Sharks......then lets move on to our best 6 by a country mile in Coetzee, who happens to be a Shark.....and then slipping our best young forward in at 7 just to have him part of the starting 15 as he is so damn good in PSDT, then yeah I'll go with your call with a Sharks pack.....but saying that I'd be more than happy with Kitshoff, Thomas du Toit or Nyakane replacing Beast, Strauss replacing Bismark and one of Arno Botha, CJ Stander, Liebenberg, Elstadt or v/d Walt coming in at 7....much like I'd be happy with one of Brussouw, Kolisi, Kriel or Carr playing at 6.

 

One certainty is that useless Matfield would not smell my broader WC squad of 100 and nor would has been Alberts.

 

Bulls backline......well we have our most exciting young talent in Kriel in my side, much like the PSDT call, this kid just has to be in the side......I'd really like Senatla in there as well and if JP does not pick up his game, Senatla would be my call.

 

Serfontein is the best young 12 in the game, he walks it as does Pollard at 10. Given the performances of our 9's this S15, it would be an easy call picking Hougaard at 9, as he is our best threat at 9........du Preez is a laugh, unless a good service and mountains of kicking is what you are after.

 

But I'd be happy with Reinach or Faf de Klerk at 9, just as I would Lambie, Goosen or Jantjies at 10.

 

My side has nothing to do with provincial and everything to do with the best players in SA in their respective positions.

CE
Ceradyne
Pro9,374 posts
CE
CeradynePro9,374 posts
07 Apr 2015, 11:04
#28
07 Apr 2015, 11:04#28
 This is could into some seriously funny sh!t.


Just an for an appetiser.........

"You will find no evidence anywhere that that team is a test and even ESPN will not give you any stats on that game. "

South Africa (18) 47 - 13 (13) World XV (FT)
CL
clevermike
Coach57,555 posts
CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
07 Apr 2015, 11:36
#29
07 Apr 2015, 11:36#29
Thanks Ceradyne
Since the game involved was not a test - I could not find the stats on the list of official tests played last year.
Let me quote the stats and then the journalistic junk the Supreme Idiot posted:-
FPL Steyn0/001/5/81903205/10/010/0
Now for Mozart's journalistic junk posting:-

Frans Steyn – 7/10

.It brings an entire new dimension to any back line when your inside centre has the capability to dictate the game with his boot We enjoyed that element in 2007 when Jean got injured and it’s something I hope we can build on and perfect. Defensive rock that’s starting to mature his attacking game. Has to be said that constant change of outside centre will infringe on the potential he could reach.

Steyn kicked the ball ONCE out of hand and the raving idiot wrote -

'It brings an entire new dimension to any back line when your inside centre has the capability to dictate the game with his boot."

Steyn carried the ball 8 times for a meter gain of 19 meters and the report is -

"Defensive rock that’s starting to mature his attacking game."

For heaven's sake - what attacking game is being talked about here.   I have seen hundreds of junk Mozart postings - but this takes the cake.  Steyn had two years of disastrous under-performances and Mozart comes up with BS and false praise based on a journalist's unfounded ramblings to counteract the very real  dung performances of Steyn. I am still laughing my ass off.  



 
SA
Saffolk
Captain30,741 posts
SA
Saffolk Captain30,741 posts
07 Apr 2015, 12:02
#30
07 Apr 2015, 12:02#30

Sharktwat.....why are you so thick when it comes to the basics of rugby.....but here we go.....a little help for a friend that is mentally challenged.....

 

 

Lets start with Kriel.......for the record he has played 15, 11/14 and 13 in his time......we have Willie as our 15......so if we want the very talented Kriel in the side, logic dictates that we play him on the wing..........hellooooooooooooo.

 

de Allende and Serfontein are our two best centres and both happen to be playing 12.....so logic dictates that we move one of them to 13.....for me its de Allende as he is the quicker of the 2. Serf at 13 does not work, he does not have the pace for the position.......de Allende at 13 would be perfect, playing the Kurandrani role.........helloooooooooo.

 

Your take on Coenie is a load of crap......he was great on the EOYT and his new technique at 3, with his head held high has seen him even better at 3 this S15......blaming him for a collapsed scrum is ignorance of the highest order....but why not show us your rugby prowess and talk us through Coenie collapsing the scrums with examples of those scrums....this should be fun.

 

PSDT has played as much rugby at flank as he has lock you idiot....he played there for the Baby Boks and his first year at senior level.

 

Hougaard can only play on hard fields...what utter bloody rubbish and how insulting to a professional player.

 

Wake up you ignorant clown.....to be honest I don't know why I bother responding to you as your understanding of the game is so poor, but there is not much activity on here....so educating you with basics is my little treat to you.

 

Now respond in kind with the Coenie collapses........bwhaahaaaaa  

CL
clevermike
Coach57,555 posts
CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
07 Apr 2015, 13:37
#31
07 Apr 2015, 13:37#31
 Dave 
Ar rimes I agree with you at others I do not.
Lets take the issue of the centers - for me De Allende is the better and stronger linebreaker and he regularly make space for players on his outside or even on his inside. into space.   I would have no problems under those circumstances to have De Allende at 12 and Serfontein at 13 - matter of fact Serfontein is a clever player who can make hay when put into space.
Insofar as the loosies are concerned I am afraid you are missing the crux of the matter.  I know Du Toit played at 7 for the JWC in 2012 - but he has since then played as a lock for them.   Playing a player like Du Toit as a flank is a waste of a good lock and creation of a dubious loosie.   Problem is there is despite opinions to the contrary a major difference between what is expected from a lock and what is expected from a loosie.   Playing a lock at 7 means part of the functions of a loosie goes out of the window - in other words you have an additional player not giving you full value as a loosie.   I would never favour Du Toit to play as a loosie for the Springboks.
On the positive side I would like to see Kriel in the team  - but has a suspicion it might eventually be at 13.             
MO
Mozart
Captain49,914 posts
MO
MozartCaptain49,914 posts
07 Apr 2015, 15:22
#32
07 Apr 2015, 15:22#32

Let me quote you the exact sentence Moronic.....focus on each word now. Read them aloud if it helps:

 

"Frans' last player rating as a Bok"

 

 

Where pray do you see the word test? A simple answer will suffice.

CL
clevermike
Coach57,555 posts
CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
07 Apr 2015, 15:51
#33
07 Apr 2015, 15:51#33
 He was no Bok in that game - it was NOT a test.   Even before the game started they said that since it is not a test the  players are not getting credited as Springboks for that game.   The last time Fransie played in a test was in 2012.
You had it as a test when you wrote the original message - that was why I asked about the date of the test.   When you found up you buggered up you changed the post.   That is the worst cowardice imaginable.   However, even of that story of Steyn;s performance for that match is looked at the rating comments you posted does not match the stats - and you should be embarrassed to post such unadulterated rubbish on this site.   
SA
Saffolk
Captain30,741 posts
SA
Saffolk Captain30,741 posts
07 Apr 2015, 15:51
#34
07 Apr 2015, 15:51#34

Absolute rubbish.....having seen enough of de Allende and Serfontein, I know without doubt Serfontein is the more creative of the two.......the fact that he plays for the boring Bulls now and played out of position at 13 for the Boks should not detract from this fact.

 

Serfontein is a class act playing without the freedom to express himself.....but more than anything, what part of Serf not being quick enough for 13 did you not get.......and for that reason alone, I would NEVER play him at 13.

 

de Allende is quicker and stronger......he would be perfect to play the Kurandrani, Tuilagi role for us.......so its NOT up for debate.......Serf at 12, de Allende at 13 is the ONLY way I would call it.....END OF.

 

Same applies to PSDT....while I would prefer him at lock, that is not the case when I have Willemse and Etzebeth to choose from.....for me these two as a combination is a no brainer.......but equally PSDT in my starting 15 is a must. The notion that he cant play 7 having played there often is short sighted and naive........the primary role of a 7 is to enforce himself with ball in hand, clearing and defensively.......I cant think of a better man for the job than PSDT......he is both athletic and skilful enough to play 7......certainly better equipped than the likes of Alberts etc.

 

Easy call......I want Eben, Willemse and PSDT in my starting 15.

 

Kriel is a must.......be it at 15, wing or 13..........for now its on the wing as I want Willie, Kriel, de Allende and Serf in my starting 15.

 

My side is pretty much spot on.....I'd be tempted with Senatla ahead of JP and Kitshoff ahead of Beast.....but I'd stick with the experience they provide for now......I am also a big fan of Arno Botha as my 8, but I cant ignore Vermeulen at 8. Arno needs a full S15 to show his wares.  

 

MO
Mozart
Captain49,914 posts
MO
MozartCaptain49,914 posts
07 Apr 2015, 16:00
#35
07 Apr 2015, 16:00#35
Rubbish Moronic you were just flat wrong. The team was referred to as the Springboks ....they played in Springbok jerseys. Just as they would on a tour provincial game. Why dontcha just admit your stupid mistake ...be honest for a change.

The thing that's so funny about you is you get so indignant...so sure you are right. And then you are wrong. Here is one of literally hundreds of references that prove you wrong:
 

Springboks VS World XV Rugby Match

Watch the Bokke tackle some of the world’s top talent in the first game of the 2014 season


The Springboks are billed to kick off their international season in the Mother City in an all-out scrum-fest with rugby’s dream team, World XV (or World 15), on Saturday, 7 June at Newlands Stadium. The game starts at 5:05pm.

Arguably the ultimate rugger team, the World XV squad is made up of some top rugby players from around the globe. This time around the side will feature former All Black and Wallaby team members, a Rugby World Cup-winning Springbok as well as players from France, England and other European leagues. Not to mention, the super-squad will be coached by former Springbok player, coach and mentor Nick Mallet.

CL
clevermike
Coach57,555 posts
CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
07 Apr 2015, 16:23
#36
07 Apr 2015, 16:23#36
 Ag foeitog - another rugby writers report on the match where the situation was clearly spelled out in advance - it was a combined SA team - not a test team and not qualifying for Springbok team membership.  None of the players got any accreditation for that match.  I am going by the legal position applicable to that match.  No test - no Springbok team playing.  If you believe otherwise  go and ask SARU and they will tell you the same.  Just ask also when last Steyn played for the Springboks and the answer will be 2012.
Howeever, that is not the problem here - even though you want to make out it is.  The problem is you post some tommyrot about Fransie's performance in that game and up popped the stats and what was written in your postings are not supported by the stats.   There was no indication that Fransie did what the assessment said he did and the0 whole assessment was in fact BS.   Fransie was horrible in 2013 to the point he was dropped from the Sharks starting line up - and was equally bad in Super 15 last year.   In the game you referred to there was little sign of improvement and he was back to horrible this year.  Why don't you own up to those facts?
 
CL
clevermike
Coach57,555 posts
CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
07 Apr 2015, 16:23
#37
07 Apr 2015, 16:23#37
 Ag foeitog - another rugby writers report on the match where the situation was clearly spelled out in advance - it was a combined SA team - not a test team and not qualifying for Springbok team membership.  None of the players got any accreditation for that match.  I am going by the legal position applicable to that match.  No test - no Springbok team playing.  If you believe otherwise  go and ask SARU and they will tell you the same.  Just ask also when last Steyn played for the Springboks and the answer will be 2012.
Howeever, that is not the problem here - even though you want to make out it is.  The problem is you post some tommyrot about Fransie's performance in that game and up popped the stats and what was written in your postings are not supported by the stats.   There was no indication that Fransie did what the assessment said he did and the0 whole assessment was in fact BS.   Fransie was horrible in 2013 to the point he was dropped from the Sharks starting line up - and was equally bad in Super 15 last year.   In the game you referred to there was little sign of improvement and he was back to horrible this year.  Why don't you own up to those facts?
 
MO
Mozart
Captain49,914 posts
MO
MozartCaptain49,914 posts
07 Apr 2015, 22:18
#38
07 Apr 2015, 22:18#38

 Yes they were Springboks, they simply didn't get test caps. Here is the official proof.......Schplott city....hahahaha .

 

CL
clevermike
Coach57,555 posts
CL
clevermikeCoach57,555 posts
08 Apr 2015, 01:24
#39
08 Apr 2015, 01:24#39
 The argument is about whether the rating you have put on this site was realistic or utter tripe  and whether it was a test or not had nothing to do with the actual performance record of Steyn.
Fact is what you put as a 7/10 and the motivation for the rating turned out to be  totally unsubstantiated when compared with the stats on the match.  Two whole sentences about the only kick Fransie made in the match and much ado about his attacking abilities when he made all of 19 meters from 8 ball carries showed no real top class performance.
In essence you used that one match and the verbal diarrhea of the reporter as proof that Fransie's dismal performances at center over  a period of 2 years in Super 15 was suddenly totally negated by his performance in that match in June last year.  Two years of failure is not eliminated by even a good performance in one match.  Since then he came back from Japan played in three matches and was performance-wise totally inadequate in all three matches he played in.   Those are facts which showed that over the period since his return Fransie had done Zero to justify test selection.  
The latter is the gist of the whole discussion on Fransie's performances since his return from France in 2012.     
MO
Mozart
Captain49,914 posts
MO
MozartCaptain49,914 posts
08 Apr 2015, 05:14
#40
08 Apr 2015, 05:14#40
Nice try Moronic...but you were adamant Frans never played for the Boks in 2014. In fact you were aggressive and rude...but inevitably, you were wrong. 
Game, set and match.
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