Crash goes scumbag John Dingell and Cloudy Clown!

So Beeno does not accept any reason at all for abortion...…

Why am I not surprised....

"Well, Beenz, it's way past "foot on the door", they've taken over the house."

So , people that support some instances of abortion are pervs now?

Nope DA, not in my book. My point being that a abbortion is the norm now....any kind under any circumstance...it's not a question of "them" getting a foot in the door " anymore.

BTW, abbortion under the conditions that you support are legal in most places and has been legal in "The Old South Africa" too.

Like I said before, personally I don't agree with any abortion of convenience, but in a modern world that's a lost cause. But I can't keep quiet about late term abbortions. It's too horrible to ignore, regardless of religion. 

I really don't get modern day secularism.  On the one hand late term abortion is OK, but on the other, the death penalty is somehow not OK?...but euthanasia is OK too? It sometimes looks like in some ways it's just a reaction to oppose Christianity. 

My point was pretty clear, and I still maintain that a woman should have the absolute personal right to abort a rapists baby...… I am not talking about anything else here..... specifically rape

Db, how could you possibly force a woman to give birth to a baby that she did not intend to conceive......…..could possibly not even afford to raise, school or feed...…..and could possibly never love it because it was conceived during a brutal gang rape...….. and may not even ever know who the father was because 6 men brutally gang raped her

Would you force a woman to go through that...…. would you honestly expect or demand that your wife or daughter go through that?

You would not respect any of their wishes to abort ?

DA, Like I said, I don't want to force anyone to do anything of the kind and would be supportive of anyone near me in whatever decision they make, but I would urge them to make that decision quickly. 

Db, in your opinion, should a woman be forced to  have her rapists baby

Yes or No

Same question to you Beeno

“ Posted by: Devil's Advocate (3093 posts)

Db, in your opinion, should a woman be forced to have her rapists baby

Yes or No”

This is probably the most difficult issue around abortion there is to answer. I do not have the answer. Honestly, I don’t. 

On the one hand, it is inconceivable how you could possibly fault a woman who has been through a horrible ordeal of being raped and then has to wait another few weeks to see if she is pregnant... and then to have that confirmed and then, and top of it all to have to make an abortion decision. Society is not kind either. Every Tom, Dick and Harry has to jump in in the issue. Family members and friends all offer their (unsolicited) advice and “support”. Most who have probably never had to deal with something like this, all suddenly have an opinion and demands to be heard. Then, if that is not enough, she has to go through all the legal issues and the society. 

That is the one side. 

The other side is the unborn child. Although it is debatable and highly debated and, most importantly, still IMO undecided if it is a new life yet or not, it is at least potentially a new life. I don’t think anybody can deny that. To be clear, I’m referring to the very earliest stages of conception here. To my mind I would always be uneasy about the fact that an innocent life has been condemned with no one fighting in its corner. I have always had peace in my mind about the fact that abortion is fine in cases of rape. And then I saw the testimony of this woman........:

No....BUT, she should not take 5 months to decide she does not want it either.

The raped women is in a tough spot not doubt about it. However the unborn child is about to lose its life. Weighed in the scales the child's rights to life must win.

Another  travesty also occurs. The rapist is out after a few years but the child has been murdered. 

Ou DA morals are up the creek once again. 

Note also how the pro abortion lobby harp on these extreme cases that don't happen that often. The fact is the vast majority of abortions arise because the woman/parents don't want the child.

63 million American unborn have been murdered since 1970 - about the same number who died in WW2. What a stain on any nation allowing abortion on demand.

These people are the same ones who support LGBT, PEDOPHILIA and so many foul things. They think there no God in Heaven, that they will never face justice. How totally and utterly wrong they are.

Best they turm from their wicked ways lest they perish. 

I fully support a raped woman's decision to abort the baby when she discovers that she is pregnant.... if she so desires...… but not at the 3rd trimester stage...…. that will never make any sense to me at all...…. that to me, is murder...… no excuses

I also fully support her decision to keep the baby

Only she will know if she can love that baby..... financially support that baby...…….feed it, school it...… put a roof over it's head.

The state will never offer any financial aid, and the state will never at any stage love that baby and provide any support at all, especially when the "father" does not contribute financially

That is why I believe the state should never be involved in issues or decisions specifically like this, where a child is conceived though rape and incest, or any other means where the woman involved was not a willing participant.

Cloudy has made some fantastic points.... thank you Cloudy, and I agree with you

I know, and I reckon most people on this board know, that if Beeno had a 12 year old daughter and she was brutally gang raped by 3 black men and 3 muslim men...….. he would feel very differently about what he would want to happen in that situation...….. but he will pretend otherwise on here...

Beeno, you don't fail to surprise me with your outright disgusting comments about so many others on this forum, and you pretend to be this noble and honest Christian...…. who in fact has very little values and integrity of his own, if any...….. and as I have said before, you are dangerous to stupid people...….. and an embarrassment to Christianity.

Wow ... this board certainly comes up with interesting and diverse subject matter ... and we always seem to have an even spread of pros and cons debating it all.

We have the self righteous in one corner ... pretending to be morally just ... and we have those who oppose everything the self righteous have to say ... no matter the subject matter

The world as we know it has lost it's morality. It supports all kinds of perversions these days and shuns almost all forms of decency.

There is no coming back from this. It is destined to get worse. Total lawlessness is at hand.

Not all abortions are morally wrong.

I feel that the victim of rape should have the choice to terminate the pregnancy. I certainly would not want to be reminded of the incident all my life by having the rapists child around me.

Adoption is an option however it would mean that the victim would have to carry the unwanted child to term and be reminded of her ordeal everyday. That in my view isn't fair. I certainly wouldn't go through with it.  I would get rid of the bastard as soon as possible and get on with my life as best I can.

Any form of deformity should be aborted immediately. It is not fair on the child nor on the parent. A life long commitment to a deformed or retarded child is like a prison sentence. Nobody wins in the end. Why saddle the world with another human like creature that cannot fend for itself? Aren't there enough retards around ... and no ... I'm not referring to Stupid Dave at all. He at least can wipe up his own slobber.

Using abortion as a form of contraception is a horrid thought ... but if they can fight for my right to cut my cock off then why not this? I don't agree with it at all.

There is no getting around the modern age. We are a sick species and our fixation on our rights as human beings has crossed the line into total absurdity.

Instead of over populating this over populated planet any further, perhaps a good culling would be a better alternative.

Yeah Cloudy

Beeno has avoided a few questions regarding issues like this...….

He is a wannabe Christian...…. only when the circumstances suit him

He truly is an embarrassment to the Christian faith, and so many have already said this about him...…. that says something

I can just imagine Beeno forcing his daughter or grand child to raise a deformed mixed race white / black / muslim baby, after being raped

It would be his Christian way.....

Sure sure... it would be God's will...….. yeah sure

How can a government decide what a woman should do with her body , and her baby..... if she has suffered the brutal gang rape from various men?

The government would not ever offer you one cent towards the next 18 - 20 years of expenses with raising that unexpected or unwanted child, before that child moves on and becomes self sufficient...….

So in other words...…. don't for one second discuss or understand the woman's opinion or thoughts on the matter, because she got brutally raped, she must just sit with the financial costs of that child for the next 2 decades, whilst being reminded every single day of what disgusting incident happened to her...….. probably never knowing who the father is...…….unless he is caught...…. possibly raising the child as a single parent...…...maybe even hating the baby...…. but she must just live with it...… it's her fault she got raped...….

What a joke...…… and people like Beeno are wishing that this was the absolute law....

Shame on him

I have no problem if abortion takes place when it seriously affects the health of either the mother or the baby to be borne - neither if the pregnancy resulted from a rape and a rape charge was indeed laid with the Police.   

I know for a fact that my mother had an abortion due to serious health problems when she was in her forties and that makes total sense.   

I think the moral dilemma comes in when the abortion is just because of a financial convenience and woman just slept around and not taking care of pregnancy precautions,   That happens in the case of virtually 90% of common pregnancies of unmarried mothers.  In the USA the African American population has stagnated because of too many abortions being the norm and not the exception,  That is seriously detrimental in any community and nobody really condone it. 

Nobody can legalize something to cater for the exceptional cases and just ignore potential abuse. 

Daperv of course doesn't want to see the big picture. Morals of an ally cat! 

Mike your point about if it's the life of a mother or life of a child is possibly correct.

I think we have largely silenced the murderous abortion advocates here. Good work guys. 

100% correct Cloudy

Michael, is in fact saying precisely what I am.... and have been saying...... all along...…. but I have the morals of an ally cat, LMAO

Now Beeno is agreeing with Michael, but here below, Beeno just posted this recently

"The raped women is in a tough spot not doubt about it. However the unborn child is about to lose its life. Weighed in the scales the child's rights to life must win."

This Beeno….. the worlds worst wannabe Christian...…... is Christ's worst nightmare...……

Let me guess, he will now say that he only agrees by saying IF, it is the choice between the woman or the child

One question, OK two, actually............ and I'm not sure that I know both the answers .

Suppose a woman was raped and got pregnant....... Isn't the fact that she "has to go through the whole ordeal" and "have to deal with the consequences of the rape on her own" and "have the rest of her life ruined" due to the lost opportunities to further her career through studies, etc, almost as big a stain on society as it is on the rapist/s? Isn't the fact that there aren't really very special "dispensations" to assist these women, should they decide to keep their child and raise it themselves or give it up for abortion, as much of a stain on society as it is on the rapists?

Modern society has totally lost it's truly compassionate nature. Modern society somehow thinks that constant virtue signalling is the same as truly and deeply human compassion.

Very good questions Ceradyne

Society or governments should definitely take a more active role with assisting woman that go through something as tragic as this...…. especially if she decides to keep the child.

At the moment, people like Beeno are basically saying...…. ok cool, she got gang raped, and the rapist got caught and he got 30 years, so all is good with the world..... the evil has been sorted out...… what's the issue?

As for the woman...…. well...… just let her deal with this kid on her own, because there is no fucking way she should abort at any time..….. and if she did, then she won't go to heaven...…. she must just deal with what God has just handed to her...…….

Never mind that a just God would never have allowed her to get gang raped in the first place

Never mind that an even more just God would never have allowed her to be impregnated by this rapist...….

I am sure Beeno would feel the exact same way if he had a daughter of his own, and she was raped by a gang a Muslim men...….. you know, because we all know that Beeno. the wannabe selective forum Christian...... has so much love for Muslims.....

He is a compulsive habitual liar, hence why he brings so much shame onto Christianity ……… but he really and truly believes that he is a true and honest  Christian...…… and yet most of the Christians on this forum alone, don't agree with his statements...….. and that already says so much

People say that a woman must be sick, disgusting or perverted, if she wants to terminate a pregnancy if she finds out that she is pregnant..... right after being gang raped multiple times...... by different men

I really don't care how people judge me...…. I think that all the people in our society who believe that a completely innocent 10 year old teenage girl, should be forced against her own will...... by law..... to give birth to her rapist's child...…...and deliberately force her to lose the rest of her childhood, schooling, career. normal life...... etc etc......are as sick as the rapist who committed the crime

That is a very bold statement to make, but it's one that I fully agree with and stand by

The ONLY person who should make that decision is the little girl that was raped.....

And I am talking about days after the rape...…. not even 2nd or 3rd trimester..... I have made it very clear that I believe that to be murder

"And not withstanding the trauma of putting that girl through the pain, anguish and sacrifice of childbirth where the physical changes in her body will be as traumatic as the mental. "

That doesn't come with planned pregnancy? 

I cannot remember my wife being that traumatised through her two pregnancies. Then again, she was a farm girl and her pregnancies were from May '79 through Feb '80 and from May '82 through Feb '83. I guess childbirth was much easier in those days. 

"I guess childbirth was much easier in those days."

I see Cloudy is specifically referring to when it involves a child / girl...... where I can only imagine it is vastly different between a 10 - 11 - 12 year old giving birth...……. and a young mature woman

I can't believe that there are some people that would even want to force this on anyone..... by law or by religious beliefs

It's sickening and disgusting to want to demand to put a child through something this

Like most people, they would instantly change their opinions or  minds on this issue,  if it happened to a child of their own

"Dec 27, 2019, 15:20

"I guess childbirth was much easier in those days."

I see Cloudy is specifically referring to when it involves a child / girl...... where I can only imagine it is vastly different between a 10 - 11 - 12 year old giving birth...……. and a young mature woman"

I got that. What everybody seems to miss is that, like so much of all the other virtue signalling BS, this is also a mountain being made out of a molehill, IMO I must add. 

Out of the millions and millions of abortions performed annually, what percentage is done on girls of 10-12 having been raped and what percentage are performed as an act of convenience to the mother? The whole world is being turned on its head, so to speak, to cater for a very very small percentage who are cared for in a totally wrong way, once again IMO. The big problem is that, apart from the fact that the extent of the issue is seemingly exaggerated, it is also tackled and "resolved" in a totally wrong way.

As far as I can understand, what happens in the tragic and awful event when such a young girls becomes pregnant in such circumstances is that there is an option available of having an abortion. But, my issue is with what happens then? What is society doing after the abortion? From what I can understand.... sweet FA. 

I would say that very special care should be given  - by society, because the fact that something like that has happened is also a failure by society - in those events irrespective if it is decided to abort or not. 

Bring back the death penalty and use it to punish rapists. 

Two birds with one stone.

Mandatory sterilisation will solve some of the other situations that cause pregnancies which place undue pressures on individuals and society at large. 

Circumventing natural selection through medical science requires an artificial balance to right the course. Mandatory sterilisation is a part of the answer.

People that live on social benefit simply out of lazyness should only receive their free money if they adhere to chemical birth control before collecting cheques. That way, if you want more kids or just can't stop being the village spunk repository...either get a job or find another way to support your choices.

Then there is also Africa. Where people can't feed themselves but are too fucking stupid to stop having children. 

Earning $10 a day but has 8 kids. Why? Be cause they don't give a fuck what type of lives those children have. It's an insurance policy. Even if 7 of them die of hunger. As long as 1 makes it and can send them money each month.

Poverty is caused by stupidity, the inability to plan and also control your urges.

Agreed again Ceradyne and Cloudy, I fully support what both of you are saying here

I don't believe it is a mountain out of a molehill at all though.....the question was asked about abortion only ...….no specific scenarios were provided at all...…. so I decided to split my opinion on the topic

What I cannot understand, or even fathom, is that people who feel very strongly about 2nd and 3rd trimester abortions, are also strongly condemning raped children for having abortions....

Yes, children are getting abortions due to promiscuous activity, but I am not referring to that, and I never have..... I am talking about rape and incest, which is prevalent in our society, all over the world..... and the small or large numbers between the two incidents don't matter...……... especially if you have people like Beeno who treats the one promiscuous scenario, exactly as the same as the rape scenario..... and if you have any common sense, you cannot do that, but to him, there is zero difference

There is obviously a line that cannot be crossed for some people..... whereas for some other people, like our own resident wannabe Christian Beeno……., if a 10 year old girl is brutally gang raped...….. all her thoughts and opinions..... rights..... and her and her parents wishes...…. are automatically taken away from them comletely ...…. and she is forced, either by law, or by religion...…. to carry that child to full term...... and give birth to a bastard child..... that she may never appreciate or love.....

I want to see any real father in the world...…. force his 10 years old daughter, to have the baby of the homeless, aids infected black guy that happened to rape her in the bushes on the way home from school.

Don't for a second try and convince me that a dad, would do that to his 10 year old daughter...… because I will tell you straight up, he is a barefaced liar

DA

You are talking about a small fraction of cases. My bet is, less than 1%.

Yep, I looked it up...

5% of rape victims fall pregnant. 

Rape and incest combined make up less than 1% abortion cases.

Doesn't mean that they shouldn't be considered but just that if you actually want to discuss it, the first port of call should be what constitutes the majority of abortion cases. Consensual unprotected sex between adults. 

Solve that first and then move on to exceptional circumstances.

Unless you have a very good reason why you got pregnant accidentally, then why should it be that you are not to made live with the consequences of your actions? Like everything else in life.

Make a bad choice at work and you're fired. Lose your head a beat the shit out of someone and off you go to prison. All consequences of one's actions. In the case of abortion, it's your mistake and somebody else having to pay the ultimate price hardly seems fair.

I'm not pro or anti abortion because I generally don't care. 

It does however seem like there are good arguments both ways but much/most of the pro-choice argument amounts to not much more than a smoke screen focussing on exceptions to prove the rule.