Now the NY subways to use ultraviolet light...

.....airlines are also thinking about using this approach to keep planes clear of the virus. Trump ahead of the issue again.

So NY subway operators are planning on putting u ltraviolet light into people?

Airport screening in a COVID-19 environmentAirport Business-6 May 2020Short-wavelength UV light (UVC) is successfully being used for the disinfection of surfaces in industries with high hygiene requirements, ...

http://www.airport-business.com/

Our team has shown that administering a specific spectrum of UV-A light can eradicate viruses in infected human cells (including coronavirus) and bacteria in the area while preserving healthy cells,” Dr. Pimentel of Cedars-Sinai stated. 

Healight is not yet approved by the FDA for use or approved as a COVID-19 treatment, and more studies on its use in humans will be needed before it can be verified as effective. In addition to the UV light therapy, the company also recently acquired U.S. rights for a COVID-19 IgG/IgM Rapid Test, so it may soon have the ability to do rapid testing for the virus. 

.....

No new idea ever came from the ‘can’t be done’ mob .

Buses blasted with UV light to rid them of coronavirus | Metro ...

Health experts in China are blasting buses with beams of ultraviolet light in a bid to contain the coronavirus outbreak. With viruses spreading via droplets landing on shared surfaces, public transport hubs and vehicles are seen as infection hotbeds.

Hahaha injecting light..... what with a syringe?  

Ultra violet filtering isn't a new thing. Neither are blood transfusions.

A combination of the two is what I believe Trump was referring to.

I'm guessing that would lower viral load and reduce strain on the immune system.

Again, an engineering fix to a medical problem .

As always, engineers for the win.

"It hasn’t been used on the Corona virus...Trump led that charge."

As Sharkbok linked to above, UV light had been used against Corona virus before Trump asked could it be put into the human body. So no Trump did not lead the charge.

Also the way NY subways will be using UV light is not going to be used in the manner that Trump asked about but in a way UV light can be used to killed viruses in the environment as has been known about for years and as the Chinese have already done. 

"And actually Stavanger there is a technique being explored which would combine  UV with intubation."

I was aware of that already, it was already posted about in these forums. Even if it proves effective in fighting the Corona virus in infected people, I'm not sure how quickly it could become available or if it would viable to use it on a large scale.

Yep Trump seems so often to be ahead on issues. 

Redrooi tell us again how Trump wanted inject people with disinfectants etc. Hahahahaha talk about TDS.  What an idiot. 

See for yourself . . . tell me what word Bozo uses at exactly 35 seconds into this clip . . .

Just a one-word answer required. Go on then, Baboon-ou . . .

Fact is that the easier methods could have unforeseen complications and I believe scientists should look at  all potential methods.  In the absence of any new treatment for the virus Trump referred to a number of things like -

*   giving doctors freedom to decide on potential treatments they may desperately decide upon to help patients - thousands of doctors were trying Hydroxchlorine and lead treatment in the absence of any real other alternative treatment being available and many people themselves think it saved  their lives;

*   entering into a PPP to develop asap a vaccine that will prevent spreading of the virus;

*   find suitable medicines for treatment of people if the virus cause a disease.

*   to look at the usage uv light in treating people with health problems.

The other thing he clearly said was  to clean surfaces where the virus may have been spreading from there to humans.  

The media did everything possible to distort what Trump said on the issue, 

I may be one accused of spreading conspiracy theories, but how come the virus disease problems - eg SARS,  Bird Flu, Swine Flu, and COVID19 -  all originated in China,   As a matter of fact the coronavirus has in other forms caused diseases - that is why the latest one is COVID19..  However, the Chinese have another virus coming out and that will be called COVID 21,          

@ComradeMike,

Bill Gates has already highlighted that the wet markets in China are the most likely places to create pandemics. The wild animals are transferring viruses to humans.

WHO should be given more power by member countries to demand immediate access, and to inspect China routinely to identify health risks.

Any country that wants to be a member should pay a fee based on the size of their population. Then WHO has unrestricted access to the country. 

The only way forward is more globalisation. However, all of the religious happy clappies will think these are conspiracies. 

@sharkbok

Wet Markets are fine and are in use all round the world. Its the bringing of live animals into wet markets that's the issue.

If the WHO was given more power to demand immediate access how would it be enforced, its not like the WHO is going have an military wing to back itself up and if your relying on something like countries enforcing sanctions than regular politics will come into play.

And say for example China did grant access and gave them accurate information but then decided to ignore WHO guidelines...then what. Do sanctions come into play then.

Then apply that evenly across the world.  Would democratic western countries tolerate WHO having access too and potential control of there health systems, even temporarily?

Stav 

Agree something must be done about wetmarkets - especially if they are indeed source of viruses.   There are videos  available that the Wuhan Wet Market was in fact primarily a fish market with some meat being sold as well.  There was no live wild animals  on the premises or sold at t hat market,

That makes the Chinese story that the virus entails a transfer from animals to people extremely unlikely - hence my statement the "if" in my initial sentence.   Nobody knows whether by some means or another the virus escaped from the lab.   Be it as it may - the WHO went along with the Chinese statement that the virus did not transfer from human to human,     Unfortunately the WHO is rather a political off-shoot of the UN and the Board and Management cannot be trusted to be objective.   

Unfortunately the situation is getting worse,   The Chinese army is on full alert as to a potential war,    That should never be the answer - but it is possible if another virus originates from China.  I always has a problem with dictatorships - they can never be trusted,            

Yes, who needs a microbiome anyway?

Totally overrated.

And this is the guy making fun of hillbillies.

Brilliant.

As usual, ten thousands words needed to unsuccessfully correct one mistake.

Have you had half of a quarter of one baby beer again? 

Careful now, your blood alcohol is gonna be 3456765435.00000055.

Fail.

As was discussed in the last string on this subject, Trump was ‘brainstorming’. Throwing the meeting to open to explore any new avenue the data suggested. It’s standard practice in big US companies.

Part of the reason the US leads the world, by miles, in innovation. Seized  upon by the media and twisted. 

Pathetic.

"As was discussed in the last string on this subject, Trump was ‘brainstorming’. Throwing the meeting to open to explore any new avenue the data suggested. It’s standard practice in big US companies."

Do you seriously think other companies from around the world don't brainstorm new ideas and concepts? Come on give the rest of the world some credit.

"Part of the reason the US leads the world, by miles, in innovation. Seized  upon by the media and twisted."

Except the US is not the most innovate country in the world. It ranks highly in terms of innovation, within the top 10 but outside the top 5.

https://www.businessinsider.com/these-are-the-10-most-innovative-countries-bloomberg-says-2020-1?r=US&IR=T#8-denmark-3

When you talk about the media twisting something, you can look at your first post in this thread. Your implying that NY Subways and potentially airlines are following Trumps lead on UV lights to kill the virus. That's wasn't what Trumps idea was in that now infamous press conference, he was talking about putting UV lights into infected people to destroy the virus inside a person, he came to this idea after been informed of studies that showed the virus could be killed in the environment by UV light a concept that's been around for years and as already been shown in this thread used by other countries before Trumps press conference and that's what the NY subways are doing. Your conflating the two different ways of using UV light to make Trump look good.

Can you honestly say to me that if Biden or Obama had suggested medical scientists should consider looking into injecting bleach into the human body to fight the corona virus you would be praising them for innovation?

Stav

Co me now - do you really believe  the  lies spun by the media about injection of bleach? 

clevermike

Come now - do you really believe the spin put on it by the alt right media and the administration?

I've watched the press conference with my own eyes and heard it with my own ears. I believe my own eyes and ears. To quote him.

"And then I see the disinfectant, where it knocks it out in one minute. And is there a way we can do something like that, by injection inside or almost a cleaning, because you see it gets in the lungs and it does a tremendous number on the lungs, so it’d be interesting to check that, so that you’re going to have to use medical doctors with, but it sounds interesting to me. So, we’ll see, but the whole concept of the light, the way it kills it in one minute. That’s pretty powerful."

He did later walk back on the comment and later still claimed he was speaking sarcastically (which even if true, that would have been an incredible inappropriate time to do so), that doesn't change the fact he did suggest that scientists should investigate the possibility of injecting bleach into people infected with Corona virus.

The fact the Trump later tried to claim it was sarcasm shows that even Trump himself knows he goofed up.

Oh dear Stav...did you even look at the article. It’s based on an index. Let me explain it adjusts for size of the economy. The US is a massive economy, not a tiny little boutique economy like Switzerland. It produces massive agricultural and ot her natural resource GNP, which reduces it’s percentage of tech related stuff. 

But if all these measures were focused on  California where tech is located  and is by itself the 6th biggest economy in the world....it would rank number one in any innovation index and number one in total innovation. As would the US which totally dominates in total innovation.

You read but sadly you simply reach the wrong conclusion time and again. Once again I promise to help.

The US is good and certainly benefits from being a federated state for economies of scale and collaboration. It is Western as are most of the richest countries. With a population of around 1/3rd Billion, it is the largest Western country. 

Germany has a GDP of 33% of the US, and if both shared the same population size the GDP would be around the same.
In Germany, the average wage is probably higher- when removing the richest from the equation. 

If the EU had worked, it could get a GDP higher than the US. However without more federation that is not going to happen. Countries with different languages and cultures are reluctant to follow what has been put in place by Germany. 

What gives the US the edge is the IT industry where the US is miles ahead, at least in creating IT products like Amazon, Google, Facebook etc. As you stated Mozart, the billionaires of tech make California the richest state in the world, and 6th as a country. 

And as we debate this Space X is launched with some incredible technology and visuals.

And that's why it's not smart to pull articles off the internet without understanding how the conclusions were arrived at.

Haha Switzerland is more innovative than the USA.

When did they last build a rocket that landed itself, a self-driving electric long haul truck, Walmart, Twitter, Google, Netflix, 3d printing, stealth planes, robotics, nanotechnology, steel frame construction and...even GPS is only available because the US military allows us to use it. We could go on and talk about innovations currently in development...like Starlink, which WILL change the world or the new Xbox which is on par in some areas and better in other areas than Sony's PS5 offering...And it's not even Microsoft's main business. But even if they stopped everything now, it'll take a decade or two for any country to overtake the US as top innovators. 

The truth is, Nike dwarfs A didas, Levi are still the nicest jeans and there is no better bakkie than the F250.

Lol, Switzerland. Cumon Star. You must have known that list wasn't meant to be read the way you interpreted it.

Indeed, the Donald thing had been put to rest previously.

He'd obviously heard numerous discussions and was given bullet points of potential strategies to treat Covid. But let's crucify him for going off script and attempting to share some of the ideas top people had offered him summaries of. 

He basically said, this is what seems most likely to work but then there is the possibility of these working too. IE Being transparent and optimistic.

UK and Ireland doesn't allow for that type of thing. Pessimism is a religion there.

"Oh dear Stav...did you even look at the article. It’s based on an index. Let me explain it adjusts for size of the economy. The US is a massive economy, not a tiny little boutique economy like Switzerland. It produces massive agricultural and other natural resource GNP, which reduces it’s percentage of tech related stuff." 

If we are using the logic that we are not allowed adjust for scale, then basically we can assume you also think the US is the worlds worst country in dealing with the Corona virus pandemic as it has the most deaths and cases by far?

"But if all these measures were focused on  California where tech is located  and is by itself the 6th biggest economy in the world....it would rank number one in any innovation index and number one in total innovation. As would the US which totally dominates in total innovation."

More number fiddling, you like doing that don't you. Just like when you where excluding New York Corona virus death numbers from the US so you could compare more favorable to other countries.

But tell you what I'll give you some credit and say you actually know this and your simply trying to distract from the fact that your original post was demonstrably wrong.

Now stopping evading and answer the following questions.

Are NY subways using UV light in the same way Trump suggested?

Is the US or Trump leading the world in using UV lights to sterilize environments from corona virus?

"You read but sadly you simply reach the wrong conclusion time and again. Once again I promise to help."

Pot, kettle, black.

Plum

Yes if you taking Americas total output on innovation is probably number one in the world due to the size of its economy and population.

But as I said you can't have it both ways, if your not adjusting for scale the n America is the worst performing state in the world when it comes to dealing with Corona virus.

USA Covid deaths per million pop 319....Ireland deaths per million pop 335. Do your homework Stav and you wouldn’t keep looking foolish. Or ask me, I’m a friendly fellow....I’ll give you the answer.

Ok, Star

Going purely on numbers is merely an exercise in false accountability. IE politics and spin. No? How much control of the below factors, which all affect how the infection and mortality rates play out, does a president have?

Population density, climate, altitude, existing vaccines, racial make-up, season, access to medical care, mortality recording criteria(test vs diagnosis through symptom), division of power between national and local/state government, pre-existing population health, timeline of actual first cases of infection and there are many more. Many many more.

Having a diet with more or less zinc will directly affect Covid's kill count. Who takes credit or is to blame for that?

Basically, there are factors on top of factors which influence the numbers...not many of which Trump actually has/had any/much control over.

So what is this an exercise in?

Quite obviously, numbers for political agenda sake? Ok, then let's do that...

Apparently NZ only had 22 deaths. So, by your own reasoning, both the US and Irish administrators are useless since they're as close as can be in terms of DR but both are far outperformed by NZ.

Cool, so your exercise concludes with you having to accept that you should be sorting out Irish problems since the guy suggesting people inject bleach is performing just as well as your guy.

But it doesn't stop there. Let's take your numbers game to its conclusion.

If we look at the size of the country, which is directly proportional to how difficult it is to manage during a crisis, then one could quickly conclude that Ireland, with  population much closer to NZ's should have done way better than the US. Simply put, the USA has outperformed you by some distance.

If you wanna compare apple's to bananas, you gotta chuck in all the other fruit too.

"Yes if you taking Americas total output on innovation is probably number one in the world due to the size of its economy and population."

No.

Because if you put all of Europe on one side and the US on the other, the leading innovator is still the USA. I'll guess because I don't know, but Europe's total wealth is likely comparable to that of the USA too.

It is amazing how brainwashed people believe the fake media.   We have gone through three ears of the Russian Hoax - which in fact had nothing to do with Yrump and everythimng to do with Obama and Clinton.  The latter in fact in an e-mail hacked by Wikileaks claimed that she has "direct access to Putin's inner sanctum".    

The documents now coming out indicate that it was a HOAX started by the Obama Administration perpetuated by the real fake media.   In that respect the Obama clique broke virtually every law of the Rule of Law in the book and they are very near to charging the criminals.   Obama is likely to escape the net unless the lower level criminals squeal on him, Biden and Clinton - which is likely to happen.    

Now we got to the Virus issue.  Whenever Trump tried to do was actively sabotaged by the Democrats,   The list is long and getting longer.  In States run by the Democrats the Governors introduced idiotic processes like sending infected people to nursing homes where they caused the deaths of 39%  of all the people who died in the USA.   That was stupid - but since it was done by Democrats - not a word about to in the fake media.   Cuomo afterwards tried to blame Trump for what he and his idiots did - that was in the fake media - but as expected from Democrats he lied about it and could not produce a single document that told him what to do. 

Trump made a mistake initially by believing the WHO and China about what really was the case with the virus - While the latter part of January 2020 was taken up by a concocted plot about the so-called Trump Impeachment.   The media was taken up virtually fully by the BS based on no evidence,  The media basically wrote relatively little about the vires until the  middle February other than to attack Trump as a racist because he closed the border to stop non-citizens coming from China on 30 January 2020.   From middle February the media blamed Trump every time he said something.   They edit what is said and then broadcast the BS they come up with.

None of the Trumphaters have anything - but distorted newspaper stories to back them up.   How they have not discovered yet that they are being lied to leads to me coming to the conclusion that they are worthy supporters of the liars in the media.

Take for instance the Stav story,  There never was sild live animals sold at the wetmarket in Wuhan and there is proof of that,  To say that the virus originated at the market is indeed the type of thing that was claimed by the super-reliable Chinese Communist Party dictatorship.  The fools apparently love dictatorships - so much so that they believe anything they are told by a dictatorship.   Very few countries really believe that - but they dare no say it because they would be boycotted or worse by China and depend on for instance the obtaining of antibiotics from China.  

The problem is that the hatred of anything democratic is based on love of communist dictatorships being against any form of religion.   That is the basis of hatred for Trump because he is supported by there  workers in the USA - most of them being religious.  That is why they are so ridiculously stupid,.                       .    

"Ok, Star

Going purely on numbers is merely an exercise in false accountability. IE politics and spin. No? How much control of the below factors, which all affect how the infection and mortality rates play out, does a president have?"

Having a diet with more or less zinc will directly affect Covid's kill count. Who takes credit or is to blame for that?

Basically, there are factors on top of factors which influence the numbers...not many of which Trump actually has/had any/much control over."

So what is this an exercise in?

I'm not holding everything over Trump. But his bleach comments where a a major gaff, a gaff which he tried to disown by claiming it was sarcasm yet people are not only defending those comments but are actually trying to say it proves Trump is actual clever for saying it.

"Apparently NZ only had 22 deaths. So, by your own reasoning, both the US and Irish administrators are useless since they're as close as can be in terms of DR but both are far outperformed by NZ.

Cool, so your exercise concludes with you having to accept that you should be sorting out Irish problems since the guy suggesting people inject bleach is performing just as well as your guy.

But it doesn't stop there. Let's take your numbers game to its conclusion.

If we look at the size of the country, which is directly proportional to how difficult it is to manage during a crisis, then one could quickly conclude that Ireland, with  population much closer to NZ's should have done way better than the US. Simply put, the USA has outperformed you by some distance.

If you wanna compare apple's to bananas, you gotta chuck in all the other fruit too."

New Zealand has done very well. I'd love to know why they are doing so much better than us. They got their first case one day before we did, they went into full lockdown two days before us.

Basically a day in the difference between entering lockdown surely can't account for such a vast difference. New Zealand did implement a travel ban, Ireland did not that may be it, although after a certain point there was no travelers coming in and out anyway. Like other countries care homes have been badly hit with over 50% of the deaths occurring in them and seen to have neglected in planning. This will have to be looked into the time. The first few weeks the government here was slow off the mark but has been pretty good since then, they have been very consistent with information, ramping up testing and tracing etc.

If America is supposedly the most innovative country in the world, in addition to being the richest and most powerful with a large military that could be used in assisting in dealing with the pandemic, then its actually America that significantly under performing by some distance.

As for innovation of US alone being superior to all European countries, have you anything to base that on?

I think that those innovation ratings themselves are BS. Simple as that.

I'm not holding everything over Trump. But his bleach comments where a a major gaff, a gaff which he tried to disown by claiming it was sarcasm yet people are not only defending those comments but are actually trying to say it proves Trump is actual clever for saying it.

That weren't a gaf. I understood exactly what was happening when he made those comments AND the comments about getting light inside. Perhaps I'm just lucky since much of my work involves problem-solving so I'm not a stranger to cross-discipline conceptual language.

The worst you could accuse Trump of is not compensating for the idiots in society. Best you tell us exactly what proportion of the population would actually go and inject bleach. 0% is the answer.

And all of that plays into the deceptive larger narrative of Tump's irresponsible leadership being at the heart of the USA's Covid woes. 

Just for laughs...

New Zealand has done very well. I'd love to know why they are doing so much better than us. They got their first case one day before we did, they went into full lockdown two days before us.

There is hole in the ozone layer above NZ. Ozone is made from O3 and it's what blocks out 99% the sun's UV rays. 

Yes, i thought of that on my own  And it's probably just a happy coincidence.